Tigers v Sale (A) - Premiership - Friday 10th May 2024 - KO: 7:45pm

[Ian Cant]

We have, apart from Gloucester, had the most injuries of any squad but recently Gloucester has had a very settled squad which reflects how they’ve done pretty well in the last 6 games.
I was hoping to travel up to Sale feeling exciting to see some of the youngsters from last Friday being integrated but no!Have to agree therefore that I’m confused at what DMK is doing. Lose badly and this won’t go down well. Where is the ambition? Where is the trust in the youngsters?
Neil Fowkes did a great job v BlackLion and said in the interview that the whole squad showed utter commitment to the cause! What a waste of an opportunity v Sale to integrate FTT, Kinder, Woodward!

[TigerFeetSteve]

I expect there to be lots of injuries for this side to be picked

We are playing and picking people who will not be here next year - sorry but Dolly and Cockasinga do nothing for next year

Could make other arguements for players like FVW but why oh why are we playing a full back / fly half on the wing

There are lots of injuries and McKellar has gone notably strong over exposing players for next season. The key reason we'd do that is how important it is for the club to have champions cup rugby next season and they are going all out for it.

Wingers we have the following back 3 players out injured, Watson, Bassett, Simmons (& probably Satala based on his HIA last weekend) so it's a choice. Shillcock/Steward on the wing/FB OR Porter who is only just back fit playing in a position he's not started in 2 years, or throwing Kinder in for experience. By how the club have gone strength over experiencing kids the selection makes sense.

Same with the likes of Dolly over FTT or Vanes, gone with the international player over the youngsters.

In fact I think the only position you could argue we haven't gone full strength is Loosehead, because there is no confirmation that Cronin is injured and that's doesn't mean he hasn't only just recovered from a knock so there may be a niggle or something that has kept him from training

When he gave it up for Montoya there was a significant improvement in the team and him when he lost the responsibility

Unfortunately our captain is confirmed injured

Is Ben Youngs no longer fit, not rated or now official 3rd Choice

I think Youngs has struggled with the stop start nature of the season and may not be fully fit. I am reserving judgement till he has had a preseason (especially if rumours we'll have a new S&C lead are true)

[Stephen18]

I expect there to be lots of injuries for this side to be picked

We are playing and picking people who will not be here next year - sorry but Dolly and Cockasinga do nothing for next year

Could make other arguements for players like FVW but why oh why are we playing a full back / fly half on the wing

There are lots of injuries and McKellar has gone notably strong over exposing players for next season. The key reason we'd do that is how important it is for the club to have champions cup rugby next season and they are going all out for it.

Wingers we have the following back 3 players out injured, Watson, Bassett, Simmons (& probably Satala based on his HIA last weekend) so it's a choice. Shillcock/Steward on the wing/FB OR Porter who is only just back fit playing in a position he's not started in 2 years, or throwing Kinder in for experience. By how the club have gone strength over experiencing kids the selection makes sense.

Same with the likes of Dolly over FTT or Vanes, gone with the international player over the youngsters.

In fact I think the only position you could argue we haven't gone full strength is Loosehead, because there is no confirmation that Cronin is injured and that's doesn't mean he hasn't only just recovered from a knock so there may be a niggle or something that has kept him from training

When he gave it up for Montoya there was a significant improvement in the team and him when he lost the responsibility

Unfortunately our captain is confirmed injured

Is Ben Youngs no longer fit, not rated or now official 3rd Choice

I think Youngs has struggled with the stop start nature of the season and may not be fully fit. I am reserving judgement till he has had a preseason (especially if rumours we'll have a new S&C lead are true)

The reason people are disappointed isn’t kinder not being picked over shilcock on the wing, that some what makes sense with Ford, the issue is cokanasiga over him on the bench he hasn’t played wing for us, he’s also only has a couple of games at premiership level, so what is gain by him on the bench over kinder who is a winger and will hopefully be here for the next few season. The problem with going for average at best experience over promising youngsters is that, that starts players questioning the pathway and what shots they are going to get.
As for Dolly he’s barely played at premiership level for 2 seasons Thomas has played a number of games this season and played against a stong partial international pack last week. So again there’s no real gains in experience for the club there.
Van wkye you could argue either way, I’d prefer Whitcomb but I could see why you’d go van wyke.
Realistically if your not going to give them the chance when we’re in 8th no really chance of play offs, cause there a chance we might not make the champions cup when are you going to play them, as hopefully next season we’ll be playing to win the league again and with less games can they be put in then?

[sk 88]

The reason people are disappointed isn’t kinder not being picked over shilcock on the wing, that some what makes sense with Ford, the issue is cokanasiga over him on the bench he hasn’t played wing for us, he’s also only has a couple of games at premiership level, so what is gain by him on the bench over kinder who is a winger and will hopefully be here for the next few season. The problem with going for average at best experience over promising youngsters is that, that starts players questioning the pathway and what shots they are going to get.
As for Dolly he’s barely played at premiership level for 2 seasons Thomas has played a number of games this season and played against a stong partial international pack last week. So again there’s no real gains in experience for the club there.
Van wkye you could argue either way, I’d prefer Whitcomb but I could see why you’d go van wyke.
Realistically if your not going to give them the chance when we’re in 8th no really chance of play offs, cause there a chance we might not make the champions cup when are you going to play them, as hopefully next season we’ll be playing to win the league again and with less games can they be put in then?

Pretty much my view.

It's hard not to ask what the point was of the Black Lion game when the only guys included now are two players who had to be included due to injuries to others. Chucking one guy a bone won't, realistically, affect the result but massively encourages all the young players.

I was really shocked by the Radio Leicester show roundly agreeing with the idea we couldn't possibly "risk" Joe Woodward, a 20 year old former England U-20s centre who has been playing regularly at Notts ahead of Phil Cokanasiga who is only 2 years older, been fairly unimpressive overall in his 18 games and is sodding off next month anyway!! I felt like ringing up and asking if Tom Varndell thought it was "risky" to give him his debut v Worcester at 18 where he scored a hat trick!

[TigerFeetSteve]

If we lose and Exeter get a result (i.e. we're condemned to 8th) it will be intersting to see what team we pick.

[AViewFromLe2]

To be honest, it does feel a bit of a missed opportunity. Woodward is going to be in the Senior Squad next season anyway, so would make sense to have him on the bench over Phil C. FTT over Dolly makes more sense, especially as they are similar players and Whitcombe should be starting over Van Wyk. You could make all 3 of those changes and not weaken the team.

I like McKellar, but he is frustrating at times.

[RagingBull]

I guess they might not want Woodward to make his potential debut against Manu?

[AViewFromLe2]

I guess they might not want Woodward to make his potential debut against Manu?

I get your point but he'll have probably have spent most of his year tackling Kata in training, plus he went well last week against some pretty physical centres. The lesson I took from last week was we have probably got to take the band aid off with some of these youngsters and get them in. Putting Woodward on the bench is not really going to hurt either him or the team that much, if at all.

[Stephen18]

To be honest, it does feel a bit of a missed opportunity. Woodward is going to be in the Senior Squad next season anyway, so would make sense to have him on the bench over Phil C. FTT over Dolly makes more sense, especially as they are similar players and Whitcombe should be starting over Van Wyk. You could make all 3 of those changes and not weaken the team.

I like McKellar, but he is frustrating at times.

I’ve just listen to the radio leicester interview with mcKeller, and there’s no doubt he wants to win but he seems to be weighed down by the fan expectations, club history and club dna. Where he seem to have slipped into that geordan Murphy mindset of this is my team and I’m sticking with it. Like you say those changes have no real negative impact on that team, but possibly posonew for next season.
It’s hard to not compare it to birthweight in his 1st season who play 5/6 20 year olds through the season, who are now not only 1st choice for us but also their countries.

[Pellsey]

A rather unfortunate typo in the press release for this week's team announcement!

“We can’t change Bristol, or this season, but we can put in two eight-minute performances in these next two games that we can be proud of. “

Realism, unfortunately!

That said, for 60 minutes, we are not a bad team.

[Tiglon]

I agree with many of the comments above. If this isn't an opportunity to play 2 or 3 of the youngsters, when is?

I know I defended McKellar for picking Van Wyk throughout the season, but for these two matches its hard to come up with any reason to start him over Whitcombe. Same for Dolly over FTT or Vanes. And Cokanasiga over Woodward or Kinder. I get the Wiese selection, he's a whole different level and there isn't anyone else snapping at his heels, but... the others? Don't get it.

I worry that, as mentioned above, McKellar is too weighed down by expectations and is too frightened to take any risks. It does make me wonder if he is under pressure from the club and needs a specific outcome from these two games or risk losing his job.

I don't think it's helpful for our long term prospects to hold the impressive youngsters back at this point.

Sale away is as tough a place as any to throw inexperienced players in, but it's also a great learning opportunity.

Even from a "must win" approach to these two matches, there's an argument for having a couple of promising youngsters in there, who will be as motivated as it is possible to be, rather than a few fairly average Prem players who already know they're leaving the club and have nothing to play for.

The only thing I can come up with, for devils advocate, is either some of the players vs Lions aren't ready for another top level opposition so soon after, or the Lions team was not as strong as made out and the win and performances were not as impressive as we thought.

[Ian Cant]

Sale is/was the perfect opportunity to get players ready for next season as we rarely win there and even the optimistic Tom Varndell thinks we will lose.
Still, I travel up in the hope those that are leaving will give their all: Sale are always fired up against us.

[Tigerbeat]

McKeller cannot win…..lose and he gets stick…..send a weakened / experimental team and lose there will be huge disappointment with the fans. Sale are in contention for a top 4 so for the integrity of the competition, Tigers should put out the strongest available side to try to win it……not experiment.
If Quins, Bristol or Bath were to miss out on a play off place to Sale because Tigers put out an experimental team and lose to give Sale the 5 points, that does not sit well with me.

[Tiglon]

McKeller cannot win…..lose and he gets stick…..send a weakened / experimental team and lose there will be huge disappointment with the fans. Sale are in contention for a top 4 so for the integrity of the competition, Tigers should put out the strongest available side to try to win it……not experiment.
If Quins, Bristol or Bath were to miss out on a play off place to Sale because Tigers put out an experimental team and lose to give Sale the 5 points, that does not sit well with me.

I think the issue most people have is that we're not talking about a hugely experimental team, and some of the players picked are just as experimental in different ways. We're not talking about dropping Wiese for Ilione, or JVP for Myall.

Dolly has hardly played for 2 years, he's as much an experiment as FTT or Vanes would be - but he's an experiment we gain nothing from.

Whitcombe has plenty of Prem experience, he's at a similar level to Van Wyk.

Shillcock has played wing once in his career before. Now I'm someone who believes wing and full back are, these days, very similar positions but Shillcock at wing is still an experiment to a degree, just like Kinder would have been.

I'd be interested to see stats of young players opportunities at Tigers this year vs other Prem clubs. We certainly wouldn't be the first team to give someone a Prem debut this season and it isn't something we should be terrified of.

I don't want to be too critical of McKellar, I can imagine he's under a huge amount of pressure and having experience in his 23 feels safer for him. But, if you don't experiment, how are you going to learn anything?

The coaches see these youngsters in training and maybe they just aren't quite ready yet, I don't know. It just seems like now is the best opportunity to take a small risk and experiment just a little bit.

[ourla]

I have been one of those that has said McKellar more time but got to admit this selection and what he has been saying this week is testing me.