Doom and Gloom

[ay2oh]

Agree about the turmoil but it is hardly the clubs fault if England take all of their coaches. Regarding churn quite a few sides have made wholesale changes which often happens when a new head coach is appointed even Exeter and Saracens have made many changes and they have a settled coaching staff.
I guess I am just more patient than many on here and tend to be a glass half full man rather than half empty and let’s remember that although Saints Bath and Bristol are much improved they’ve won nothing yet.

[Scuttle]

Agree about the turmoil but it is hardly the clubs fault if England take all of their coaches. Regarding churn quite a few sides have made wholesale changes which often happens when a new head coach is appointed even Exeter and Saracens have made many changes and they have a settled coaching staff.
I guess I am just more patient than many on here and tend to be a glass half full man rather than half empty and let’s remember that although Saints Bath and Bristol are much improved they’ve won nothing yet.

Absolutely, and come the end of the season at least 2 of them will still not have won the league

[sapajo]

7

Agree about the turmoil but it is hardly the clubs fault if England take all of their coaches. Regarding churn quite a few sides have made wholesale changes which often happens when a new head coach is appointed even Exeter and Saracens have made many changes and they have a settled coaching staff.
I guess I am just more patient than many on here and tend to be a glass half full man rather than half empty and let’s remember that although Saints Bath and Bristol are much improved they’ve won nothing yet.

Very true but I would not be upset if our backplates was as good as those teams

[Big Dai]

Management of expectation is key. For instance I don't expect a win on Saturday. I will be pleasantly surprised if we get one but in the big picture of the clubs future what is required is performance.

Do the basics well
Keep discipline
Take chances
Keep the scoreboard ticking.

If honest endeavour in these areas is up to snuff and a better team wins. So be it. That is sport.

So far IMHO we have not been up to snuff. The team has not come up to, never mind exceeded the sum of its parts. A world cup, changes of management and injuries have not helped so maybe, with a complete, organised pre season next season the team can do better.

I live in hope....honest.

[OakhamTiger32]

It’s a funny old season isn’t it.

We have been on the back foot by losing Borthwick, Sinfield and Walters. Add in to the mix the International players who have been unavailable during the RWC or 6N (Montoya, Cole, Heyes, Chessum, Martin, Reffel, Wiese, JvP, Youngs, Pollard, Watson, Steward). Then you look at the fine margins: narrow last minute defeat to Glos, a game we should have won. I know you can’t say what if.. but we would be right in the mix for top 4 if we had seen off Glos at MWWR and that is despite losing a chunk of the coaches and having a very disrupted season with players coming and going.

For me the Saints game said it all. First half, we looked fantastic and nullified the form and top team in the league (on their home turf). Then Ill discipline hurt us. Too many cards of late and the red was where it all unraveled. Kata didn’t go flying in to make that hit, you know I fancied us to get the result there with only 20 to play. Fine margins. Yes the scoreline flattered Saints but we played some great rugby last time out.

So for me it’s been a strange old season. Yes we sit 8th but it’s a packed table and we were a few minutes away against Glos from moving up to 2nd/3rd.

Bristol are no pushovers so I don’t think it’s game over if we lose. They have a fantastic squad and are playing some great rugby. Keep 15 on the field, do the basics well and I reckon we have every chance on Sat.

[Tigersunited]

A lot of complainers were asking for more youth - Carnduff, Illione, Woodward, Beets, possibly others like Chessum, L. that's quite a few to go along side Chessum O etc. I think next year will be the crux of McKellar's tenure, and will very much depend on the quality of further coaching appointments.

I think it very much depends on him!

[Terracetiger4]

To me this season is 100% down to poor recruitment from the club in all facets coaching and playing staff.
I think they went cheap on the s&c coach and it’s now starting to show in the fact we look knackered at around 55-60 mins. Aled was always going to be tough to replace but i really don’t have any confidence in this new guy.

Player recruitment last year was woeful and the year before tbf. Signed too many bang average players at the end of their career. I take OHC out of this point because he has the tools to be a point of difference just need to get his confidence up. You would have thought we would have learnt from the dark days when we just tried to sign cheap squad players from other sides. I hate to say it but bath and Saracens and tbf saints have the best recruitment models of identifying where their club’s academy is lacking and going after really good promising players from other club. Players who are hungry to get better always makes for a better squad.

[Tiglon]

To be completely fair, Saracens (and every other club for that matter) have "bang average" Premiership players - because, salary cap. They are just very good at making the team greater than the sum of its parts and a huge part of that comes down to consistency of coaching.

I think this season the table is too close to judge solely on league position. The difference between 4th and 8th is a couple of bounces of the rugby ball.

There's been a lot of good this season, but the defeat to Gloucester was very disappointing, as was the discipline against Saints - both games we were very capable of winning. In the title winning season we won games we should have lost, at times due to pure luck/chance, and that just hasn't happened this season.

A few good performances in the final 3 games will keep me happy enough to judge McKellar on next season. For all the disappointment this year, we're not a long way behind the other Prem clubs, apart from maybe Saints - and we still managed to beat them this year.

[Old Hob]

Let's not forget that the first 5 matches were lost and we were missing out on 10 first team players.

[LE18]

To be completely fair, Saracens (and every other club for that matter) have "bang average" Premiership players - because, salary cap. They are just very good at making the team greater than the sum of its parts and a huge part of that comes down to consistency of coaching.

I think this season the table is too close to judge solely on league position. The difference between 4th and 8th is a couple of bounces of the rugby ball.

There's been a lot of good this season, but the defeat to Gloucester was very disappointing, as was the discipline against Saints - both games we were very capable of winning. In the title winning season we won games we should have lost, at times due to pure luck/chance, and that just hasn't happened this season.

A few good performances in the final 3 games will keep me happy enough to judge McKellar on next season. For all the disappointment this year, we're not a long way behind the other Prem clubs, apart from maybe Saints - and we still managed to beat them this year.

I was at Saints last week, yes we were in it for a long time but we were starting to slde, hanging on in fact and I dont think even with 15 would would have won, their bench was so much better than ours and our replacement pack was mullered.

[Tiglon]

To be completely fair, Saracens (and every other club for that matter) have "bang average" Premiership players - because, salary cap. They are just very good at making the team greater than the sum of its parts and a huge part of that comes down to consistency of coaching.

I think this season the table is too close to judge solely on league position. The difference between 4th and 8th is a couple of bounces of the rugby ball.

There's been a lot of good this season, but the defeat to Gloucester was very disappointing, as was the discipline against Saints - both games we were very capable of winning. In the title winning season we won games we should have lost, at times due to pure luck/chance, and that just hasn't happened this season.

A few good performances in the final 3 games will keep me happy enough to judge McKellar on next season. For all the disappointment this year, we're not a long way behind the other Prem clubs, apart from maybe Saints - and we still managed to beat them this year.

I was at Saints last week, yes we were in it for a long time but we were starting to slde, hanging on in fact and I dont think even with 15 would would have won, their bench was so much better than ours and our replacement pack was mullered.

You may well be right, but we did beat them at home this season, which suggests that the idea that they are brilliant and we are awful is probably not entirely accurate. The margins are a lot smaller than many claim.

[OakhamTiger32]

Some people are very quick to say how bad we are but for me it is fine margins and poor discipline. We have narrowly lost numerous games this season that easily could have gone either way. Win even just a few of those and we are top 4. I often read about how clueless we are and how bad our attacking structure is but for me it is just not being clinical enough in the red zone and players not backing their own abilities (confidence is low and hopefully that winning mentality will see a boost in confidence across the team). We put OHC over twice yesterday and have shown glimpses of how we can play when it all clicks. I think with an attack coach we might get this sorted and will be looking good next season. I'm not sure of the stats but I doubt we have fielded the same backline more than a few times all season so getting a backline playing regularly together will help. This was epitomised last week with the butchered tries by the backs. Getting JvP, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Parese, Watson, Steward playing together and all firing and we would have a cracking back division.

Discipline is the key for me. Keep 15 on the field and we would have won a few of the games we have lost. 15 vs 15 and I say we would have beaten Saints and Bristol. Just IMHO of course but the games both unravelled quickly when Kata and Brown got their respective cards. 7 yellow cards and 2 reds in 3 games is not good enough. End of. A yellow is usually worth 7 points but against a tired team that has put in a massive defensive shift for 60 odd minutes it's clearly worth more. Saints and Bristol can open most teams up at will so it's hardly surprising we left them back in once our discipline wavered. This is the biggest area of concern for me. We HAVE to get this sorted or we don't stand a chance. We looked very very good first half against Saints and for 60 odd minutes against Bristol we kept them scoreless so we are clearly doing something right.. keep the faith!

[Postiger2]

I agree that discipline is a major issue. I'm sure it's my green, red and white specs, but I do feel that we seem to get more than our fair share of bad luck, especially when it comes to the 50/50 calls. I genuinely feel that we are treated more harshly than other clubs. I realise my confirmation bias btw

[fentiger]

I think if our attack really starts to click, given how good we are at putting teams under pressure in their 22 we will be winning those games that we have been losing this season. We will be scoring those points early on and building the pressure on the opposition, they chase the game and more chances open up. Allied to that when you're on the front foot tiredness isn't a factor!

[Tiglon]

Some people are very quick to say how bad we are but for me it is fine margins and poor discipline. We have narrowly lost numerous games this season that easily could have gone either way. Win even just a few of those and we are top 4. I often read about how clueless we are and how bad our attacking structure is but for me it is just not being clinical enough in the red zone and players not backing their own abilities (confidence is low and hopefully that winning mentality will see a boost in confidence across the team). We put OHC over twice yesterday and have shown glimpses of how we can play when it all clicks. I think with an attack coach we might get this sorted and will be looking good next season. I'm not sure of the stats but I doubt we have fielded the same backline more than a few times all season so getting a backline playing regularly together will help. This was epitomised last week with the butchered tries by the backs. Getting JvP, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Parese, Watson, Steward playing together and all firing and we would have a cracking back division.

Discipline is the key for me. Keep 15 on the field and we would have won a few of the games we have lost. 15 vs 15 and I say we would have beaten Saints and Bristol. Just IMHO of course but the games both unravelled quickly when Kata and Brown got their respective cards. 7 yellow cards and 2 reds in 3 games is not good enough. End of. A yellow is usually worth 7 points but against a tired team that has put in a massive defensive shift for 60 odd minutes it's clearly worth more. Saints and Bristol can open most teams up at will so it's hardly surprising we left them back in once our discipline wavered. This is the biggest area of concern for me. We HAVE to get this sorted or we don't stand a chance. We looked very very good first half against Saints and for 60 odd minutes against Bristol we kept them scoreless so we are clearly doing something right.. keep the faith!

I agree it's fine margins, and after 60 minutes yesterday I was impressed - other than thinking we should have been even further ahead.

Discipline really does need to be fixed. We really can't keep spending the last 10 minutes with 14 men on the pitch, or we'll keep seeing the same results.

I do think both Brown's yellows were harsh, the first considering how many Bristol got away with before their yellow, and the knock on, and the second I think it was two players going for a loose ball - it turned into a tackle once the Bristol player won the ball but head contact was before that.

I also noticed a Bristol player using a fore arm to Hanro's throat when being tackled, and then there was the Naulago knee in Montoya's back after he nearly scored. Genge and Sinckler got away with a lot too, in fact I think I saw both front rows laughing at Carley on numerous occasions. Sinckler being effectively told he'll be carded unless he apologises is really not how the laws are supposed to work, and I felt Carley was enjoying the arguments with players a bit too much and fancies himself as a Nigel Owens - which he definitely isn't.

Rant over...