Tigers v Bristol (H) - Premiership - Saturday 27th April 2024 - KO: 15-00

[OakhamTiger32]

Time to try players in roles where they might be needed next season for my money. I'm thinking:

- Ilione at 7. We direly need a jackal threat when Tommy isn't playing.
- Cracknell at 6. It was his best position at LI where he was well suited to back rows with multiple all-rounders rather than standout jackal or carriers. With Wiese going, Hanro potentially playing 8 and very all-rounder heavy looking back row options for next season, it would be useful to utilise.
- Start Whitcombe with Montoya and get him carrying more. We need carriers, Whitcombe has the size to get over the gain line.
- Steward at centre. Get the firing squad ready.
- FTT as bench hooker. He's very dynamic, could be an impactful bench option. The bench has often been limp this season.
- Hatherell at lock with Chess if Martin isn't available. Hatherell offers closer to what Martin does than the other replacements. Whilst Wells has largely been ineffectual this season, sadly.

1.Whitcombe 2.Montoya 3.Cole 4.Hatherell 5.Chessum 6.Cracknell 7.Ilione 8.Hanro
9.JvP 10.Pollard 11.OHC 12.Steward 13.Scott 14.Brown 15.Shillcock

16.FTT 17.Cronin 18.Heyes 19.Carnduff 20.Wiese 21.Whiteley 22.Kelly 23.*Whoever's fit*

I wouldn't mind seeing one of the dev squad backs on the bench.

I really don’t understand the Steward in the centre proposal. Next season I’m hoping our centre pairing will be 12. Kelly 13. Parese with Kata on the bench. This would be a really solid pairing.

Steward is a rock solid 15, the best under the high ball and a good defender. Shillcock has been far from impressive thus far so the prospect of him being our starting 15 next season concerns me. Steward at 15 for me with the occasional cameo on the wing perhaps

[Stephen18]

Time to try players in roles where they might be needed next season for my money. I'm thinking:

- Ilione at 7. We direly need a jackal threat when Tommy isn't playing.
- Cracknell at 6. It was his best position at LI where he was well suited to back rows with multiple all-rounders rather than standout jackal or carriers. With Wiese going, Hanro potentially playing 8 and very all-rounder heavy looking back row options for next season, it would be useful to utilise.
- Start Whitcombe with Montoya and get him carrying more. We need carriers, Whitcombe has the size to get over the gain line.
- Steward at centre. Get the firing squad ready.
- FTT as bench hooker. He's very dynamic, could be an impactful bench option. The bench has often been limp this season.
- Hatherell at lock with Chess if Martin isn't available. Hatherell offers closer to what Martin does than the other replacements. Whilst Wells has largely been ineffectual this season, sadly.

1.Whitcombe 2.Montoya 3.Cole 4.Hatherell 5.Chessum 6.Cracknell 7.Ilione 8.Hanro
9.JvP 10.Pollard 11.OHC 12.Steward 13.Scott 14.Brown 15.Shillcock

16.FTT 17.Cronin 18.Heyes 19.Carnduff 20.Wiese 21.Whiteley 22.Kelly 23.*Whoever's fit*

I wouldn't mind seeing one of the dev squad backs on the bench.

I really don’t understand the Steward in the centre proposal. Next season I’m hoping our centre pairing will be 12. Kelly 13. Parese with Kata on the bench. This would be a really solid pairing.

Steward is a rock solid 15, the best under the high ball and a good defender. Shillcock has been far from impressive thus far so the prospect of him being our starting 15 next season concerns me. Steward at 15 for me with the occasional cameo on the wing perhaps

Agree don’t see the point of playing steward there, as it’s extremely unlike he’ll ever be required there, much more useful to give Kelly time back at 12 with Scott then give some minutes to Woodward off the bench with Scott.

[ABClub]

It's been done to death, but I think Steward's ceiling is higher at centre. He is on the slow side for an international fullback and doesn't have the playmaking skills of many modern 15s. Fullback at the top level is increasingly the domain of players with the kicking and distribution skills of a fly-half.

Freddie's greatest asset is of course his aerial work but sides are increasingly not kicking to compete on him. Which is unavoidably a simple way to negate that strength.

His next biggest strength is in contact due to his size. Fullback is probably the worst position in the backs to utilise that after SH and FH though.

At centre I think he could be excellent at getting over the gain line and making yards after contact - which is one of the most valuable skills in rugby. I think his size would be more of an asset defensively in the main d-line than in the back three where he can be caught flat footed whilst changing direction. Whilst you can still take advantage of his aerial work from centre but do it on your own terms by using Steward to competing attacking kicks rather than waiting to defend kicks that increasingly aren't booted his way.

He's a very good fullback but I feel he could be a significantly better centre longer term.

[Stephen18]

I like us to do a mixed time of youth and experience, I know it’s unlikely we’ll make the top 4, I still don’t want to just send out a team of kids. I also like to see Wilkinson get a start with the starting pack to see what he can do, and if it goes wrong bring pollard on. With that in mind I go,
Whitcomb Montoya Cole
Wells chessum
Liebenberg wiese ilione
Jvp Wilkinson
Ohc Kelly Scott Bassett(if fit)/brown
Steward

Ftt
Cronin
Hurd
Martin(if fit)/hatherall
Carnduff
Whitley
Pollard
Woodward

[OakhamTiger32]

It's been done to death, but I think Steward's ceiling is higher at centre. He is on the slow side for an international fullback and doesn't have the playmaking skills of many modern 15s. Fullback at the top level is increasingly the domain of players with the kicking and distribution skills of a fly-half.

Freddie's greatest asset is of course his aerial work but sides are increasingly not kicking to compete on him. Which is unavoidably a simple way to negate that strength.

His next biggest strength is in contact due to his size. Fullback is probably the worst position in the backs to utilise that after SH and FH though.

At centre I think he could be excellent at getting over the gain line and making yards after contact - which is one of the most valuable skills in rugby. I think his size would be more of an asset defensively in the main d-line than in the back three where he can be caught flat footed whilst changing direction. Whilst you can still take advantage of his aerial work from centre but do it on your own terms by using Steward to competing attacking kicks rather than waiting to defend kicks that increasingly aren't booted his way.

He's a very good fullback but I feel he could be a significantly better centre longer term.

Not a fan tbh but I see your points and there is certainly a lot of truth in what you say. If this was to be the case we need a new 15 for next season as Shillcock isn’t the answer for me.

Kelly/Parese my choice for next season with Kata for impact.

[ABClub]

I think Shillcock is much better at 15. He's a capable 10 but looks better with that bit more time on the ball. Similar to Furbank really. He was good there against Quins and Leinster. Then had a stinker last weekend. Plenty of this squad have had stinkers this season though. Some have had a year of them.

I'd definitely be inclined to give JvP-Pollard-Shillcock as much time together as possible in the remaining three rounds. Multiple playmakers is where most the top coaches are moving in order to breakdown the huge work rate of modern defences. Most top sides play off at least 9, 10 and 15. Many throw a centre in who can play first receiver for good measure. Meanwhile, Tigers have basically played off 10 for a season, with a little bit of play of 9 since JvP has returned.

If Freddie did shift position then I'd be very happy with Shillcock and Brown at fullback, plus Steward obviously still able to cover.

[sam16111986]

It's been done to death, but I think Steward's ceiling is higher at centre. He is on the slow side for an international fullback and doesn't have the playmaking skills of many modern 15s. Fullback at the top level is increasingly the domain of players with the kicking and distribution skills of a fly-half.

Freddie's greatest asset is of course his aerial work but sides are increasingly not kicking to compete on him. Which is unavoidably a simple way to negate that strength.

His next biggest strength is in contact due to his size. Fullback is probably the worst position in the backs to utilise that after SH and FH though.

At centre I think he could be excellent at getting over the gain line and making yards after contact - which is one of the most valuable skills in rugby. I think his size would be more of an asset defensively in the main d-line than in the back three where he can be caught flat footed whilst changing direction. Whilst you can still take advantage of his aerial work from centre but do it on your own terms by using Steward to competing attacking kicks rather than waiting to defend kicks that increasingly aren't booted his way.

He's a very good fullback but I feel he could be a significantly better centre longer term.

I'm not convinced Steward will make it as a centre personally but I think it could well be good his development to play a bit there. With England looking for versatility it would certainly help his cause there and may help with his distribution skills which are his deficiency.

[OakhamTiger32]

I think Shillcock is much better at 15. He's a capable 10 but looks better with that bit more time on the ball. Similar to Furbank really. He was good there against Quins and Leinster. Then had a stinker last weekend. Plenty of this squad have had stinkers this season though. Some have had a year of them.

I'd definitely be inclined to give JvP-Pollard-Shillcock as much time together as possible in the remaining three rounds. Multiple playmakers is where most the top coaches are moving in order to breakdown the huge work rate of modern defences. Most top sides play off at least 9, 10 and 15. Many throw a centre in who can play first receiver for good measure. Meanwhile, Tigers have basically played off 10 for a season, with a little bit of play of 9 since JvP has returned.

If Freddie did shift position then I'd be very happy with Shillcock and Brown at fullback, plus Steward obviously still able to cover.

Shillcock and Brown sound like they should be fighting crime or offering legal advice!

[OakhamTiger32]

It's been done to death, but I think Steward's ceiling is higher at centre. He is on the slow side for an international fullback and doesn't have the playmaking skills of many modern 15s. Fullback at the top level is increasingly the domain of players with the kicking and distribution skills of a fly-half.

Freddie's greatest asset is of course his aerial work but sides are increasingly not kicking to compete on him. Which is unavoidably a simple way to negate that strength.

His next biggest strength is in contact due to his size. Fullback is probably the worst position in the backs to utilise that after SH and FH though.

At centre I think he could be excellent at getting over the gain line and making yards after contact - which is one of the most valuable skills in rugby. I think his size would be more of an asset defensively in the main d-line than in the back three where he can be caught flat footed whilst changing direction. Whilst you can still take advantage of his aerial work from centre but do it on your own terms by using Steward to competing attacking kicks rather than waiting to defend kicks that increasingly aren't booted his way.

He's a very good fullback but I feel he could be a significantly better centre longer term.

I'm not convinced Steward will make it as a centre personally but I think it could well be good his development to play a bit there. With England looking for versatility it would certainly help his cause there and may help with his distribution skills which are his deficiency.

Maybe he could play blindside flanker

[Wayne Richardson Fan Club]

Shillcock is a pretty good player, but he isn't good enough to be a starter in a side looking to challenge for the biggest honours, the 22 shirt is his best position.

[OakhamTiger32]

Shillcock is a pretty good player, but he isn't good enough to be a starter in a side looking to challenge for the biggest honours, the 22 shirt is his best position.

Completely agree. And while Brown has been fantastic for us and you can’t question his commitment, he’s not a regular starting 15 either. It’s Steward or we need to bring someone in IMHO (which we won’t do)

[Old Hob]

Shillcock is a pretty good player, but he isn't good enough to be a starter in a side looking to challenge for the biggest honours, the 22 shirt is his best position.

Completely agree. And while Brown has been fantastic for us and you can’t question his commitment, he’s not a regular starting 15 either. It’s Steward or we need to bring someone in IMHO (which we won’t do)

I think Brown has still got it; at least enough for, say 60-70 minutes.

[Old Hob]

Forecast for Saturday: Cloudy all day 60% chance of rain around 4pm.

[Pellsey]

I think Shillcock is much better at 15. He's a capable 10 but looks better with that bit more time on the ball. Similar to Furbank really. He was good there against Quins and Leinster. Then had a stinker last weekend. Plenty of this squad have had stinkers this season though. Some have had a year of them.

I agree about distribution, but he is a fine kicker. I see full back in rugby a little like a sweeper in football, in that a fullback can move around, and in rugby's case, come in to the line when needed. To counter his current lack of distribution skills (which he obviously needs to work on), we just need to use other players with those skills more, such as Kelly and JVP, and from what I have seen of him, Perese.

I'd definitely be inclined to give JvP-Pollard-Shillcock as much time together as possible in the remaining three rounds. Multiple playmakers is where most the top coaches are moving in order to breakdown the huge work rate of modern defences. Most top sides play off at least 9, 10 and 15. Many throw a centre in who can play first receiver for good measure. Meanwhile, Tigers have basically played off 10 for a season, with a little bit of play of 9 since JvP has returned.

I do agree with playing Steward more will Shillcock. They played together last weekend as though they had never met each other before. As mentioned before, I think Kelly has the skills to be first receiver as well, at the very least in terms of distribution. Steward has in terms of kicking. Pollard and Steward have worked together well in some games, with Pollard putting Steward through the line a few times (from full back using the centre as a decoy.)

If Freddie did shift position then I'd be very happy with Shillcock and Brown at fullback, plus Steward obviously still able to cover.

In my opinion, that would be a real waste. He is a still very young fullback with plenty of time to tune his distribution skills. If the game is changing, he has the age to change with it. As I have said many times before, Steward is not slow, he just does not have the accelaration or the agility of smaller players, in the same way as Crofty.

In terms of size, I disagree about a 15 not needing size. A 15 is still the last line of defence, and a forward running at Steward / Tim Stimpson would have less chance of scoring than when running at Jason Robinson. Even in attack, fullbacks come into the line and therefore size and power also come into effect. Obviously not to say that Jason Robinson was not an excellent attacking fullback!

With the versitility of fullback (that you can come in to any part of the line), good distributors like Pollard or Kelly could use this to its full potential. Using Steward in the centre purely because of his size would be a waste, in the same way as Manu was often misused.

[OakhamTiger32]

I think Shillcock is much better at 15. He's a capable 10 but looks better with that bit more time on the ball. Similar to Furbank really. He was good there against Quins and Leinster. Then had a stinker last weekend. Plenty of this squad have had stinkers this season though. Some have had a year of them.

I agree about distribution, but he is a fine kicker. I see full back in rugby a little like a sweeper in football, in that a fullback can move around, and in rugby's case, come in to the line when needed. To counter his current lack of distribution skills (which he obviously needs to work on), we just need to use other players with those skills more, such as Kelly and JVP, and from what I have seen of him, Perese.

I'd definitely be inclined to give JvP-Pollard-Shillcock as much time together as possible in the remaining three rounds. Multiple playmakers is where most the top coaches are moving in order to breakdown the huge work rate of modern defences. Most top sides play off at least 9, 10 and 15. Many throw a centre in who can play first receiver for good measure. Meanwhile, Tigers have basically played off 10 for a season, with a little bit of play of 9 since JvP has returned.

I do agree with playing Steward more will Shillcock. They played together last weekend as though they had never met each other before. As mentioned before, I think Kelly has the skills to be first receiver as well, at the very least in terms of distribution. Steward has in terms of kicking. Pollard and Steward have worked together well in some games, with Pollard putting Steward through the line a few times (from full back using the centre as a decoy.)

If Freddie did shift position then I'd be very happy with Shillcock and Brown at fullback, plus Steward obviously still able to cover.

In my opinion, that would be a real waste. He is a still very young fullback with plenty of time to tune his distribution skills. If the game is changing, he has the age to change with it. As I have said many times before, Steward is not slow, he just does not have the accelaration or the agility of smaller players, in the same way as Crofty.

In terms of size, I disagree about a 15 not needing size. A 15 is still the last line of defence, and a forward running at Steward / Tim Stimpson would have less chance of scoring than when running at Jason Robinson. Even in attack, fullbacks come into the line and therefore size and power also come into effect. Obviously not to say that Jason Robinson was not an excellent attacking fullback!

With the versitility of fullback (that you can come in to any part of the line), good distributors like Pollard or Kelly could use this to its full potential. Using Steward in the centre purely because of his size would be a waste, in the same way as Manu was often misused.