RFU to take control of 20 England players with ‘hybrid contracts’

[LE18]

Thing is, I do not think that the pie can be grown. Everyone is full up on football, they do not want anything else. 7 days a week there is football on, there are live games most days, there are highlights at the weekend, there is social media, there is radio that bumps every other sport for football, it is being rammed down peoples' throats until they are full. My personal opinion, there is enough football to fill the channels, radio stations etc, they really do not want or need anything else.

Rugby cannot complete with that and sometimes we do not help ourselves. We have a useful situation in that Tigers and City cannot play at the same time so there is room to try and get some of the non travelling City fans into Welford Road. You could even look at a cross promotional deal where for a match or 2, City season ticket holders get a cheap Tigers ticket and vice versa. Trouble is, we are so anti or unwelcoming to football fans, so derogatory about the game they support (wendyball anyone) that there is no way I as a football fan would want to set foot in a rugby ground but these are people who enjoy live sport, spend money on live sport and are a target audience.

Rugby has to be more welcoming and inviting to grow the pie and we to be more accepting of fans of other sports if we want to attract them to rugby.

Sorry to say it GB but Rugby fans are very different to Soccer fans, we like to stand next to our opponents, have a drink with them, discuss good players and their good play, we appluad good moves, tries, players coming off injured etc etc, we dont have to be segregated to ensure our safety. You enjoy your football, I will enjoy my rugby and our opposition fans etc.

[Rugbygramps]

I’m with GB on this one there is a definite cross over of fans that enjoy supporting both teams and watching both sports.

The supporters of both sports can be very one eyed about supporters of the other

[LE18]

I’m with GB on this one there is a definite cross over of fans that enjoy supporting both teams and watching both sports.

The supporters of both sports can be very one eyed about supporters of the other

Yes I agree about being 1 eyed, afaid Im a rugby 1 eye, I dont see rugby fans being escorted from the station, the endless mindless chanting, in fact wherever football fans go abroad etc there seems to be trouble, sorry its not for me, I tried football referring for 4 years that was enough.

[Rugbygramps]

I’m with GB on this one there is a definite cross over of fans that enjoy supporting both teams and watching both sports.

The supporters of both sports can be very one eyed about supporters of the other

Yes I agree about being 1 eyed, afaid Im a rugby 1 eye, I dont see rugby fans being escorted from the station, the endless mindless chanting, in fact wherever football fans go abroad etc there seems to be trouble, sorry its not for me, I tried football referring for 4 years that was enough.

And playing devils advocate football fans will say all rugby supporters walk round with their noses in the air go to public school and eat picnics out of their Range Rover boots. It is very easy to tar everyone with the same brush there are plenty of youngsters and family’s that go to the city as they do at Tigers.
No,one is saying football has to be for anyone just that there are supporters that enjoy both sports

[LE18]

I’m with GB on this one there is a definite cross over of fans that enjoy supporting both teams and watching both sports.

The supporters of both sports can be very one eyed about supporters of the other

Yes I agree about being 1 eyed, afaid Im a rugby 1 eye, I dont see rugby fans being escorted from the station, the endless mindless chanting, in fact wherever football fans go abroad etc there seems to be trouble, sorry its not for me, I tried football referring for 4 years that was enough.

And playing devils advocate football fans will say all rugby supporters walk round with their noses in the air go to public school and eat picnics out of their Range Rover boots. It is very easy to tar everyone with the same brush there are plenty of youngsters and family’s that go to the city as they do at Tigers.
No,one is saying football has to be for anyone just that there are supporters that enjoy both sports

Yes I agree there are some.

[Hot_Charlie]

Interesting straight bat from Andrea P on the rugby show. We'll wait and see what actually happens.

[GB72]

Interesting straight bat from Andrea P on the rugby show. We'll wait and see what actually happens.

Agree. It was a very good interview and it left me more confident about the club going forward but it was almost as if the agreement with England was being produced without any discussion with the clubs and that they know as much about hybrid contracts as we do.

[Hot_Charlie]

Interesting straight bat from Andrea P on the rugby show. We'll wait and see what actually happens.

Agree. It was a very good interview and it left me more confident about the club going forward but it was almost as if the agreement with England was being produced without any discussion with the clubs and that they know as much about hybrid contracts as we do.

I think there's a lot of reading between the lines to be done in an interview like that. She can only answer the knowns and assumptions (such as the Premiership starting and ending with 10 teams). She can't predict what knock-on effect would trickle over from any more "bumps in the road" (for example if another club collapses, which might lead to further club collapses etc).

[Tigersunited]

Interesting straight bat from Andrea P on the rugby show. We'll wait and see what actually happens.

Agree. It was a very good interview and it left me more confident about the club going forward but it was almost as if the agreement with England was being produced without any discussion with the clubs and that they know as much about hybrid contracts as we do.

Sounded like the clubs are not party to these discussions, which is not a surprise given the RFU/PRL, cartel approach. I worry they will de incentivise clubs from investing in academies and producing their own talent, if the lose control of the player. It’s only a hybrid contract which suggests the clubs will still have to pay - why bother?

[mol2]

Perhaps it keeps them play in England with a better compensation for the clubs for the loss of players.

As for fitness, Tigers used to be the fittest in the Premiership and if it was close coming into the final quarter we would expect that to tell.

In the Cockers era we lost our dedicated conditioning coach. Why isn't clear but allegedly Cockers thought he could do it.

In the immediate pre Borthwick era we lost a lot of matches in the final minutes. Perhaps the ridiculously long warm ups may have contributed to running out of steam. Ability and confidence are also considerations too.

That changed with Aled and we stopped fading out of games.

[Hot_Charlie]

Interesting straight bat from Andrea P on the rugby show. We'll wait and see what actually happens.

Agree. It was a very good interview and it left me more confident about the club going forward but it was almost as if the agreement with England was being produced without any discussion with the clubs and that they know as much about hybrid contracts as we do.

Sounded like the clubs are not party to these discussions, which is not a surprise given the RFU/PRL, cartel approach. I worry they will de incentivise clubs from investing in academies and producing their own talent, if the lose control of the player. It’s only a hybrid contract which suggests the clubs will still have to pay - why bother?

In hindsight I think the comments from the RFU about hybrid contracts were more about Sweeney proving his existence than anything of substance, yet.

[Old Hob]

There is a telling dissection of Sweeny in this Guardian article and his atrocious behaviour towards "lesser" teams.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/other/r ... f7bc&ei=61

[trendylfj]

Shed loads of players left to play great rugby. If we* were to lose all our England internationals tomorrow we'd still have a great side, and the competition would still be as good as last season.

I mean, which Tigers at the world cup are likely to get 'central' contracts? Steward, Watson and Chessum, that's about it.

If we're winning, WR will be full.

*not just us, all team with Eng Ints...

Just to nitpick about what you say and I agree with a lot of it but when was the last time MWR was full???? I would dare bet that it hasn't been full more than once in the last 2 years even when we won the championship. If the clubs were to lose 25 England-qualified international players for most of the prem games and get them back for the European ones, there is a link between the money from European games, how you qualify to play in the HC and the position you finish in the Prem which seems to be ignored. I don't know how many prem games these players will be able to play but they will be missed. I think we could lose 5 or even 6 if Kelly has a good season - Steward, Watson, Chessum, JVP, Kelly and Martin. He will have to go for a larger number of the younger players if he is planning for the next World Cup then people expect. Most players who are 30+ will not be picked IMHO - Manu (32) Farrell (32) May (33) Care (36) Yonugs (34) Daly (31)are among those who may not be around for the next WC just to look at the backs are certainties not to be included. Of course, he will keep most of them after the WC to give some continuity but looking ahead they have to be omitted early rather than later in preperation for the next one.

[Rugbygramps]

Agree with trendy’s analysis. The latest rumoured number is 25 hybrid contracts. IMO players will not miss as many games as some are predicting purely down to the necessity to keep players match sharp, which can only done by playing.

Very difficult to pick list of 25 players other than it is likely to be a match day squad plus an extra forward and extra back.

Easier to look at the current squad of 33 and suggest who is unlikely to be involved.

There are 4 players who have chosen to play in France and it would be highly unlikely that the French clubs would comply, so that Arundell, Marchant, Ribbans, Willis.

Then those that are likely to be too old so again imo you’re looking at Marler, Cole, George, Lawes, Vunipola, Youngs, Care, Ford, Farrell, May, Daley, Tuilagi, Watson.

So that’s 17 players who may not make the mix, but still leaves a solid core of players to build on, Genge, Dann, Chessum, Martin, Curry, Earl, Mitchell, Smith, Lawrence, Steward

[ay2oh]

Shed loads of players left to play great rugby. If we* were to lose all our England internationals tomorrow we'd still have a great side, and the competition would still be as good as last season.

I mean, which Tigers at the world cup are likely to get 'central' contracts? Steward, Watson and Chessum, that's about it.

If we're winning, WR will be full.

*not just us, all team with Eng Ints...

Just to nitpick about what you say and I agree with a lot of it but when was the last time MWR was full???? I would dare bet that it hasn't been full more than once in the last 2 years even when we won the championship. If the clubs were to lose 25 England-qualified international players for most of the prem games and get them back for the European ones, there is a link between the money from European games, how you qualify to play in the HC and the position you finish in the Prem which seems to be ignored. I don't know how many prem games these players will be able to play but they will be missed. I think we could lose 5 or even 6 if Kelly has a good season - Steward, Watson, Chessum, JVP, Kelly and Martin. He will have to go for a larger number of the younger players if he is planning for the next World Cup then people expect. Most players who are 30+ will not be picked IMHO - Manu (32) Farrell (32) May (33) Care (36) Yonugs (34) Daly (31)are among those who may not be around for the next WC just to look at the backs are certainties not to be included. Of course, he will keep most of them after the WC to give some continuity but looking ahead they have to be omitted early rather than later in preperation for the next one.

Many flaws in your summary. Firstly there are unlikely to be many clashes between premiership and England games due to the collapse of 3 clubs. Secondly the article said that clubs will have full selection of their players and thirdly in a squad of 25 would be very surprised if Tigers had more than 4 players in the 25. Chessum and Steward for sure and possibly JVP and Heyes.