LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

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Jimmy Skitz
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Jimmy Skitz »

sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:10 pm
Jimmy Skitz wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:25 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm

Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
I'm not so sure he would have been Kata plays there, we could always go with Brown and Steward, its hard to tell especially with the HC we don't know how he likes to mix his back 3
I'm looking forward to seeing Kata play for us but I'm not sure he'd have got close to matching the work rate of Potter outside. We've generally used one wing as the workhorse and one wing as the strike runner. If we stay the same next season I'd have thought OHC and Kata will be vying for the strike runner option and then Bassett and Watson for the workhorse, Watson being so classy he can effectively do both at the same time.
again though you are assuming we'll keep the kick heavy game plan, we don't know that for sure
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by sam16111986 »

Jimmy Skitz wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:11 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:10 pm
Jimmy Skitz wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:25 pm

I'm not so sure he would have been Kata plays there, we could always go with Brown and Steward, its hard to tell especially with the HC we don't know how he likes to mix his back 3
I'm looking forward to seeing Kata play for us but I'm not sure he'd have got close to matching the work rate of Potter outside. We've generally used one wing as the workhorse and one wing as the strike runner. If we stay the same next season I'd have thought OHC and Kata will be vying for the strike runner option and then Bassett and Watson for the workhorse, Watson being so classy he can effectively do both at the same time.
again though you are assuming we'll keep the kick heavy game plan, we don't know that for sure
I'd be surprised if we abandoned that. McKellar is a pragmatist. We aren't going to start playing out from our own half when the kicking game has worked so well. What needs tuning up is what we do when we have possession in the opponent's third of the field. We get into the opposition third fine but accuracy levels aren't great once we're there. Looked better when Pollard was back in form mind.
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Hot_Charlie »

Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 3:22 pm Difficult to say he’s a big loss when next season he wouldn’t even be in the starting 23.
Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
I think the linchpin of that selection is your 10/15 cover.

I wouldn't be having Shillcock covering 10. He's barely played any elite rugby there in several seasons.
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by TigerFeetSteve »

Hot_Charlie wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:13 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm

Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
I think the linchpin of that selection is your 10/15 cover.

I wouldn't be having Shillcock covering 10. He's barely played any elite rugby there in several seasons.
Well he's played 10 most of this season (till To'omua reached fitness) in Japan's top division, so that was the league higher than Freddie Burns came and joined as our 2nd choice Fly half

Other Fly halves in his division
Matt To'omua, Aus International - DynaBors
Rikiya Matsuda, Jap International - Wild Knights
Bernard Foley, Aus International - Funabashi
Aaron Cruden, NZ International - Sungoliath
Yu Tamura, Jap International - Eagles
Tom Taylor, NZ International - Brave Lupus
Doga Maeda, Jap International - Green Rockets
Quade Cooper, Aus International - Liners


Of the 12 teams 8 have a T1 International fly half, and he spent half a season starting for the DynaBors till To'omua was fit
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Rugbygramps »

TigerFeetSteve wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:43 am
Hot_Charlie wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:13 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm

Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
I think the linchpin of that selection is your 10/15 cover.

I wouldn't be having Shillcock covering 10. He's barely played any elite rugby there in several seasons.
Well he's played 10 most of this season (till To'omua reached fitness) in Japan's top division, so that was the league higher than Freddie Burns came and joined as our 2nd choice Fly half

Other Fly halves in his division
Matt To'omua, Aus International - DynaBors
Rikiya Matsuda, Jap International - Wild Knights
Bernard Foley, Aus International - Funabashi
Aaron Cruden, NZ International - Sungoliath
Yu Tamura, Jap International - Eagles
Tom Taylor, NZ International - Brave Lupus
Doga Maeda, Jap International - Green Rockets
Quade Cooper, Aus International - Liners


Of the 12 teams 8 have a T1 International fly half, and he spent half a season starting for the DynaBors till To'omua was fit
I get what you’re saying , but you have to question that list. It looks more like a home for retired international 10s, with only Cooper having any chance of resurrecting his test career.
As for Shilcock I haven’t seen enough of him recently to comment on his play. What I will add is that we have in Charlie Atkinson a 10, who Handre Pollard considers to have the potential to reach world class. If that sort of talent is available then let’s use it during the early games
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by RagingBull »

All would easily be at worse a back up 10 for pretty much every Prem team in the league though
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Leicestertinytiger »

The point I was making was people are getting a bit hyperbolic about Potter leaving - saying he’s a big loss etc.

For me losing Wiese, Montoya and Pollard would be big losses. But we’ve seen in the past when Ford and Genge left that any player is replaceable.

After them three then any first XV player could be considered a loss depending on strength in depth. After that then any squad player leaving can just be seen as normal business.

Do I wish Potter was staying - yes. But him leaving probably won’t have any impact on the pitch given the other players we have.
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Chobbsy »

Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 3:22 pm Difficult to say he’s a big loss when next season he wouldn’t even be in the starting 23.
Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
Don't forget Josh Bassett
God created rugby so footballers have heros too
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Rugbygramps »

RagingBull wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:13 am All would easily be at worse a back up 10 for pretty much every Prem team in the league though
Only if they wanted to contribute to their pension pots. Some big names yes, I can’t comment on the Japanese players, but Cruden, Foley, Toomua very much in their twilight years
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Rugbygramps »

Leicestertinytiger wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:13 am The point I was making was people are getting a bit hyperbolic about Potter leaving - saying he’s a big loss etc.

For me losing Wiese, Montoya and Pollard would be big losses. But we’ve seen in the past when Ford and Genge left that any player is replaceable.

After them three then any first XV player could be considered a loss depending on strength in depth. After that then any squad player leaving can just be seen as normal business.

Do I wish Potter was staying - yes. But him leaving probably won’t have any impact on the pitch given the other players we have.
Totally agree
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Offside »

I would have Potter remain over Bassett but that is not the choice. In fact as a club we had no choice. The only option for Harry staying was for him to have a potential call up as an England winger. If that was not likely then getting into a position to be called up for Australia is his professional next step and something the club really could not prevent. I do hope he gets the call. I know the father of an England player and have heard some first had tails of Eddie’s methods and texts telling players what they needed to do. Mind games can pay off but he does seem to use players a pawns in his bigger game and pawns can be sacrificed. I hope Harry gets his chance and does not regret the move.
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by sam16111986 »

Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 3:22 pm Difficult to say he’s a big loss when next season he wouldn’t even be in the starting 23.
Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
Depends who we're playing. Any team that has a kicking flyhalf, like say Sarries or Sale, would eat us alive with that back three. You're leaving Steward to cover an awful lot of ground as Kata and OHC aren't known as being great exponents under the high ball or positionally. Possibly why Chiefs used Kata in the midfield and LI tended to partner OHC with a wing/fullback like Loader or Stokes.

Now we might be backing ourselves to improve them in that area and we do have a track record for that but Potter was very good at the unglamorous positional play and hard graft bits.
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by Rugbygramps »

I don’t think Potter was ever going to play for England, too many ahead of him.
I also fear for him going to Australia, with this potentially being another of Jones mind games. Having just watched the Brumbies they have 3 back 3 players all at least on a par with Potter
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by RagingBull »

sam16111986 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:58 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:17 pm

Only if Watson is staying otherwise he'd be on the right wing in the first choice XV. Few wingers chase kicks as well or as consistently as Potter, he's been excellent for us.
Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
Depends who we're playing. Any team that has a kicking flyhalf, like say Sarries or Sale, would eat us alive with that back three. You're leaving Steward to cover an awful lot of ground as Kata and OHC aren't known as being great exponents under the high ball or positionally. Possibly why Chiefs used Kata in the midfield and LI tended to partner OHC with a wing/fullback like Loader or Stokes.

Now we might be backing ourselves to improve them in that area and we do have a track record for that but Potter was very good at the unglamorous positional play and hard graft bits.
Roebuck and Reed are not what people would call kicking wingers either so not sure on your logic
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

Post by sam16111986 »

RagingBull wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 2:19 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:58 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:33 pm

Even without Watson I still wouldn’t have him in the 23.

Youngs, Pollard, OHC, Kelly, Scott, Kata, Steward
JVP, Shillcock, Porter
Depends who we're playing. Any team that has a kicking flyhalf, like say Sarries or Sale, would eat us alive with that back three. You're leaving Steward to cover an awful lot of ground as Kata and OHC aren't known as being great exponents under the high ball or positionally. Possibly why Chiefs used Kata in the midfield and LI tended to partner OHC with a wing/fullback like Loader or Stokes.

Now we might be backing ourselves to improve them in that area and we do have a track record for that but Potter was very good at the unglamorous positional play and hard graft bits.
Roebuck and Reed are not what people would call kicking wingers either so not sure on your logic
They lack a kicking game but Roebuck is a good kick chase winger. Reed should be a good kick chase winger with his speed but seems to lack the hunger. Positionally they're both alright. Reed has issues under the high ball but Roebuck is a good all rounder. I suspect TV is being brought in to allow replace Reed in the big games until he develops a bit more.
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