Change to tackle height laws

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bendy
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Change to tackle height laws

Post by bendy »

https://www.englandrugby.com/news/artic ... gland-2023

Below the Championship and downwards...

(with apologies for the clickbait-y headline!)

What are people's thoughts? Is this going to eventually find its way into the pro-game? Is this an early deathknell for rugby as we know it, or a vital move to preserve the feasibility of the game?

If it were possible to bet on these things, I would be lumping a lot of money on an outrageously high number of yellow cards in next season's National One!
Scott1
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Scott1 »

Follow the principles of evasion? What?!
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
TigerFeetSteve
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by TigerFeetSteve »

Bonkers...

1. I expect concussions to go up... heads near knees is a BIG risk (my very first adult rugby game I saw one of our props in what turned out to be his last adult rugby game, stop the opposition prop dead in his tracks when his head hit the other prop's knee - result fractured skull. If these rules had been in place I'd have walked away and never played, risk too high of that repeating)

2. Way too high for these rules. How many of our Academy loan out to clubs with these rules, then come back to PRC playing different rules. Need to introduce these trials at "Grassroots"

Nat 1 & 2 are in no way Grassroots by my definition.

3. This all seems kneejerk not based on facts.
Used to run around with an 11, 14 or 15 on my back.
Rugbygramps
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Rugbygramps »

It is of course how many of us oldies were taught to tackle.
For safety I think the paragraph about encouraging the ball carrier not to dip into the tackle is equally important.
In terms of the game it will eventually lead to leaner quicker players and the off load and support runners will become king.
If it is ever implemented across the game the scrums will become de powered, the lineout wouldn’t be affected and rucks would get even quicker.
GB72
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by GB72 »

Sadly the governing bodies are just trying to turn back the tide.

Rugby is not a safe sport. It is a sport based on heavy contact and there is little that you can do to make that safer. Whether that will eventually mean the downfall of the game, only time will tell, but if the authorities lose the current law suits, you can pretty much guarantee that the sport will be bankrupted out of existence anyway

May sound overly down but there is simply no realistic way to retain rugby as a sport and to make it safe and rugby lacks the billions of dollards the NFL had to buy their way out of that corner.

The focus should, in my naive opinion, be on keeping the ball in play for more time and reducing the number subs so as players need to concentrate more on Stamina than bulk unlike at present where forwards know that they only normally have to have 60 minutes in them with much of that written off through scrum and lineout delays.
Scott1
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Scott1 »

TigerFeetSteve wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:37 pm Bonkers...

1. I expect concussions to go up... heads near knees is a BIG risk (my very first adult rugby game I saw one of our props in what turned out to be his last adult rugby game, stop the opposition prop dead in his tracks when his head hit the other prop's knee - result fractured skull. If these rules had been in place I'd have walked away and never played, risk too high of that repeating)

2. Way too high for these rules. How many of our Academy loan out to clubs with these rules, then come back to PRC playing different rules. Need to introduce these trials at "Grassroots"

Nat 1 & 2 are in no way Grassroots by my definition.

3. This all seems kneejerk not based on facts.
Yes ,waste of time unless you are doing it at true grass roots level.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Scott1
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Scott1 »

Rugbygramps wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:38 pm It is of course how many of us oldies were taught to tackle.
For safety I think the paragraph about encouraging the ball carrier not to dip into the tackle is equally important.
In terms of the game it will eventually lead to leaner quicker players and the off load and support runners will become king.
If it is ever implemented across the game the scrums will become de powered, the lineout wouldn’t be affected and rucks would get even quicker.
There's no way you can depower the game with this generation of players, no chance. It can be done of course but it's a slower process than people think.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Wayne Richardson Fan Club
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club »

The only way to depower the game at the top level is go back to amateur game, trouble is with some of the dubious people in the game some clubs would have 15 well paid ground staff.
To win is not as important as playing with style!
Rugbygramps
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Rugbygramps »

I get the feeling that what they are trying to eliminate is the head on head contacts as with Loader at the weekend, which from my limited view seems to be on the increase.
It is very easy to be negative about initiatives like this but until they have been in place for a period of time we just don’t know the impact. It may be too late but at least they are trying something
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Rugbygramps »

Wayne Richardson Fan Club wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:48 pm The only way to depower the game at the top level is go back to amateur game, trouble is with some of the dubious people in the game some clubs would have 15 well paid ground staff.
I think even then it would be minimal. The gym culture has meant that power is paramount, and not just for rugby players.
TigerFeetSteve
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by TigerFeetSteve »

Rugbygramps wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:38 pm It is of course how many of us oldies were taught to tackle.
As far as I know it most people were taught to tackle around the waist no matter the era pretty much.

However you can't "aim" for the waist if any higher is a penalty... you have to aim for somewhere that gives you a margin for error. Coaches will have to coach aiming for thigh or even knee height then a mistake is waist.
Used to run around with an 11, 14 or 15 on my back.
johnthegriff
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by johnthegriff »

I grew up being taught to tackle below the waist, effective unless the ball carrier was straight on with a high knee running action like Eric Bann. The other downside was that the tackled players arms were free so the ball was off loaded.
People idea that having the ball in play more would mean smaller lighter players is nonsense at the top level, players like Ollie Chessum go the full 80 and are still active, it maybe that the traditional prop becomes a little more streamlined but that would add danger to the scrum.
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Rugbygramps »

TigerFeetSteve wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 3:01 pm
Rugbygramps wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:38 pm It is of course how many of us oldies were taught to tackle.
As far as I know it most people were taught to tackle around the waist no matter the era pretty much.

However you can't "aim" for the waist if any higher is a penalty... you have to aim for somewhere that gives you a margin for error. Coaches will have to coach aiming for thigh or even knee height then a mistake is waist.
I think the wrap tackle has become more in vogue especially front on to try and prevent the off load.
But we digress your point about impact with hips knees being equally as dangerous is spot on. Isn’t that how Itoje was concussed last Summer in Australia
Rugbygramps
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by Rugbygramps »

johnthegriff wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 3:03 pm I grew up being taught to tackle below the waist, effective unless the ball carrier was straight on with a high knee running action like Eric Bann. The other downside was that the tackled players arms were free so the ball was off loaded.
People idea that having the ball in play more would mean smaller lighter players is nonsense at the top level, players like Ollie Chessum go the full 80 and are still active, it maybe that the traditional prop becomes a little more streamlined but that would add danger to the scrum.
I think it would mean different proportions to players not necessarily smaller. The days of Geoff Wheel shaped lock are long gone
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Re: Change to tackle height laws

Post by WirralExile »

Those of us who coached Mini and Junior rugby, introduced the youngsters to contact and tackling when moving up the age groups and progressing from Tag. We used tried and tested sayings to get the kids to tackle low, so "what smells to what smells" (nose to get down near the bum), "cheek to cheek" (face cheek in contact with bum cheek) and to get them to look at the target area before going in for the contact/tackle, "eye to thigh". We certainly didn't coach tackles around the chest and shoulder area.

Admittedly, I moved away from coaching when my son decided at U14 to have a break, so can't comment on the older age groups and Colts. Another poster mentioned head contact with knee, but "cheek to cheek" and "what smells to what smells" puts the face behind the tackled player and is less likely to be fallen on either.

Lower tackles, stopping legs moving by wrapping arms around thighs/knees/shins/ankles, is more likely to stop forward progress than an above the waist tackle, especially if there are height/weight differences.
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