Next England Head Coach (Pre World Cup)

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Tigers86asw
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Tigers86asw »

Telegraph article

Leicester Tigers are preparing to lose Steve Borthwick to England and sounded out Stuart Lancaster as a potential replacement this summer before he opted to join Racing 92.

Although Tigers remain eager to keep Borthwick into the 2023-24 campaign and beyond, they acknowledge that he has become a strong candidate to succeed Eddie Jones as England head coach after next year’s World Cup.

In an effort to solidify the future of the club, and wary of the instability during their lean seasons before a recent resurgence, Leicester approached Lancaster proactively earlier this year. The senior coach of Leinster, however, had already started negotiations with Racing and opted to leave Dublin and head to France.

Lancaster was a man in demand before signing a four-year deal to work in the Top 14. That Tigers contacted him at all is both a mark of the level of coach they are hoping to attract should Borthwick leave in 2023 and the job become open, and of their own proactivity.

Bill Sweeney, the chief executive of the Rugby Football Union, wants to decide on the next England head coach and unveil them in May, two months after the Six Nations. Sweeney reiterated recently that the new coach could come from abroad, though an Englishman “makes life a bit easier”.

It has been reported that Scott Robertson, head coach of the Crusaders, and Ronan O’Gara, of La Rochelle, are on the shortlist alongside Borthwick. Shaun Edwards has re-signed with France until 2027, with Andy Farrell staying with Ireland until at least August 2025.

Conor O’Shea has previously mooted that Jones’s successor could be integrated into the England set-up for the World Cup, presumably then establishing their own backroom team after the tournament. Though Jones has seemed rather cool on that prospect, Borthwick would appear to be the best fit for such a strategy.

He has extensive experience of working with Jones, having done so with Japan and with England between 2016 and 2020. He is familiar with the current squad and with the quirks of the English club system.

Last season’s remarkable Premiership victory, capped by a 15-12 win over Saracens in the final at Twickenham, completed Leicester’s turnaround just two years after Borthwick arrived in the East Midlands. Were it not for Saracens’ salary-cap sanctions, they would have finished bottom of the league in 2019-2020.

In the past year players such as Freddie Steward, Jack van Poortvliet, Guy Porter and Joe Heyes have emerged in the England squad. All of them are thriving under Borthwick’s coaching. Jones has recognised this himself, indicating that they have arrived in the England set-up with a strong grasp of tactical nuances.

“They are all fit, they are all committed and they know how to play Test match rugby,” Jones said of his Tigers contingent on the verge of the July tour of Australia. “They are the champion team, they are performing at their best, they have beaten everyone else and there is a reason they have beaten everyone else.”

“He’s got a good environment at his club,” Jones added of Borthwick. “It’s really hard-working and a good balance of fun as well.
“He’s got good staff around him and a good crop of players coming through.”

The endorsements have been rolling in for Robertson as well. Mike Brown, the former England full-back, waxed lyrical in his column for the Mail on Sunday after a stint under the New Zealander with the Barbarians.

“There’s so much talent in English rugby and I think they need a coach who will put them at ease, and allow them to flourish and develop,” Brown wrote. “My experience of playing for England is there’s always a little bit of fear and Scott would change that. He encourages you to be yourself and be brave on the field. Someone like Marcus Smith would be in his element.

“In a team coached by Robertson, I don’t think Smith would have kicked out the ball for the draw like he did yesterday [against New Zealand]. It seemed to sum up England’s mindset. It was as if they were happy with that outcome.”

Meanwhile, England have named an unchanged 36-man squad to prepare for their final autumn international against South Africa on Saturday.
RagingBull
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by RagingBull »

"Leicester Tigers are preparing to lose Steve Borthwick to England" but when you actually read the article it doesn't sound like Borthwick is favourite for the position.

The fact the RFU have come out and changed their stance on non english coaches sort of proves that it Borthwick isn't the favourite.

Granted good that the board is looking at options (Lancaster wouldn't have been my preferred replacement by miles though)
westwinds31
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by westwinds31 »

If I were Borthwick reading that, I wouldn’t be too chuffed, hearing that the club approached Lancaster, after the club has just won the title ! How do they know he wouldn’t turn it down ?

The fact that we didn’t go all out for Edwards, proven to be the best around, says a lot.
Scott1
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Scott1 »

westwinds31 wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 11:29 pm If I were Borthwick reading that, I wouldn’t be too chuffed, hearing that the club approached Lancaster, after the club has just won the title ! How do they know he wouldn’t turn it down ?

The fact that we didn’t go all out for Edwards, proven to be the best around, says a lot.
Sure I read England had talks with Edwards
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/63687497
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Scott1
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Scott1 »

ROG for me,but wouldn't mind Robertson either!
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Scott1 »

"If I were Borthwick reading that, I wouldn’t be too chuffed, hearing that the club approached Lancaster, after the club has just won the title ! How do they know he wouldn’t turn it down ? "

Not a surprise sometimes with this club!
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RagingBull
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by RagingBull »

Why can’t the club have talks with other coaches when the coach is on the England head coach shortlist???

Can’t win at times.
If the club doesn’t start getting a shortlist now then people will complain about lack of preparation
wigworth
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by wigworth »

RagingBull wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:39 am Why can’t the club have talks with other coaches when the coach is on the England head coach shortlist???

Can’t win at times.
If the club doesn’t start getting a shortlist now then people will complain about lack of preparation
Best be prepared lest MOC is back for round 3.
Wes
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Wes »

Good bit on Scotty Robinson in this weeks Rugby Pod. Well worth a listen
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Tigers86asw
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Tigers86asw »

Why would Borthwick be upset? As long as tigers were open with him and said ‘listen, we think England may want you and understand you would want to coach at the highest level, we need to prepare for when you leave so will be looking at people now in case you decide to go.’

Transparency is the key thing here. Borthwick will know all of this surely- it’s hardly a secret that England may want him.
tigerburnie
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by tigerburnie »

Englands current forwards coach is a bloke called Richard Cockerill.................................................maybe if Borths goes to England we could give him a shot................................................. :smt003
"If you want entertainment, go to the theatre," says Edinburgh head coach Richard Cockerill. "Rugby players play the game to win.15/1/21.
GB72
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by GB72 »

Tigers86asw wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 9:02 am Why would Borthwick be upset? As long as tigers were open with him and said ‘listen, we think England may want you and understand you would want to coach at the highest level, we need to prepare for when you leave so will be looking at people now in case you decide to go.’

Transparency is the key thing here. Borthwick will know all of this surely- it’s hardly a secret that England may want him.
Totally agree with this. What we did/are doing is the sensible thing. I assume a conversation was had to explain that Borthwick and his team are our future but we would not want to hold any of them back if the opportunity arose and we strongly suspect that England will be sniffing around after the 6 Nations. As such, it is only prudent to start looking at the availability of some of the top coaches in the event that Borthwick wants a move to the international game.
Scott1
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by Scott1 »

wigworth wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:55 am
RagingBull wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:39 am Why can’t the club have talks with other coaches when the coach is on the England head coach shortlist???

Can’t win at times.
If the club doesn’t start getting a shortlist now then people will complain about lack of preparation
Best be prepared lest MOC is back for round 3.
Please no! I still have nightmares about the "no astone left unturned worldwide search"!
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by TTRITH »

GB72 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 9:18 am
Tigers86asw wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 9:02 am Why would Borthwick be upset? As long as tigers were open with him and said ‘listen, we think England may want you and understand you would want to coach at the highest level, we need to prepare for when you leave so will be looking at people now in case you decide to go.’

Transparency is the key thing here. Borthwick will know all of this surely- it’s hardly a secret that England may want him.
Totally agree with this. What we did/are doing is the sensible thing. I assume a conversation was had to explain that Borthwick and his team are our future but we would not want to hold any of them back if the opportunity arose and we strongly suspect that England will be sniffing around after the 6 Nations. As such, it is only prudent to start looking at the availability of some of the top coaches in the event that Borthwick wants a move to the international game.

Also, it's worth remembering that the contracts are up for Steve and the rest of the coaching set up at the end of this season. I'd imagine negotiations have started, with Steve possibly saying "If the RFU comes along, I'm going."
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CrumblingTerrace
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Re: Next England Head Coach (Post World Cup)

Post by CrumblingTerrace »

I don't think Borthwick is as much of a shoe-in as he seemed last year.

Firstly, the evidence from this season suggests a number of teams have figured out how to combat his ultra-pragmatic strategy. That happens when your champions, but we haven't yet seen Borthwick's ability to adapt and constantly evolve the team. Rob Baxter looked bound for the England job at one point but then a similar thing happened to his Exeter side.

Secondly, it'd be difficult for Borthwick to be as closed and oppositional with the national media as he is at Tigers. The role is far too high profile. It is (you might say unfortunately) a requirement to keep the national media on your side as England coach.
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