Worcester’s woes

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sam16111986
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by sam16111986 »

GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:58 am
trendylfj wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:48 am I loved going to Worcs and am very sad to see this happen to a great club. I don't feel that we will be able to sign anyone as my memory says that Bothwicks said a few months ago that we have spent right up to the cap or it may have been very close to it - not quite sure which. So unless the Prem comes up with a new rule to enable clubs who had not planned to expand their squad because of the cap to do so, we are probably not in a position to sign anyone. A very sad day for 40+ professional rugby players, most of whom are now out of work. Equally not sure how Bath can afford to pay 4 new players, even if it is on loan. They must have been well below the cap on the squad they put together to start the season.
My guess would have been (and it is a totally uneducated guess) that the players on loan would be playing for expenses and little else just so as they could keep training and stay sharp for a month. Now that they have no contracts, they are going to have to look for full pay positions at clubs.
A four week loan for those four players would have been pretty cheap and Bath have injuries so could have covered it with injury dispensation. If the combined salary of those four was £600k per annum then it's £50k for the four week loan period to have all four with the club. Quite conceivably affordable.

Unlikely to be able to afford them for the season unless the players take a serious pay cut or the PRL agree to a change in cap rules though.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club »

Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:34 am Worcester players to have contracts terminated - WRFC Players Ltd wound up in High Court

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/63142239
Note it says no one from the Club there to represent them, what a complete cluster####, I have zero confidence in PRL getting something coherent sorted out.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Rugbygramps »

2 things, I think it may be an assumption to say they are going to end up in the championship. There may be very little of Worcester left after this, and certainly not much of a player base.
Secondly as late as yesterday Goode and Hamilton were suggesting that 2 welsh regions could be invited into the premiership
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Rugbygramps »

sam16111986 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:21 pm
GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:58 am
trendylfj wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:48 am I loved going to Worcs and am very sad to see this happen to a great club. I don't feel that we will be able to sign anyone as my memory says that Bothwicks said a few months ago that we have spent right up to the cap or it may have been very close to it - not quite sure which. So unless the Prem comes up with a new rule to enable clubs who had not planned to expand their squad because of the cap to do so, we are probably not in a position to sign anyone. A very sad day for 40+ professional rugby players, most of whom are now out of work. Equally not sure how Bath can afford to pay 4 new players, even if it is on loan. They must have been well below the cap on the squad they put together to start the season.
My guess would have been (and it is a totally uneducated guess) that the players on loan would be playing for expenses and little else just so as they could keep training and stay sharp for a month. Now that they have no contracts, they are going to have to look for full pay positions at clubs.
A four week loan for those four players would have been pretty cheap and Bath have injuries so could have covered it with injury dispensation. If the combined salary of those four was £600k per annum then it's £50k for the four week loan period to have all four with the club. Quite conceivably affordable.

Unlikely to be able to afford them for the season unless the players take a serious pay cut or the PRL agree to a change in cap rules though.
Sam I think the question is not so much around finance but more who are these 4 players on loan from as they are no longer employees of Worcester rugby club. Would that make them free agents on short term deals.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by GB72 »

Rugbygramps wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:25 pm 2 things, I think it may be an assumption to say they are going to end up in the championship. There may be very little of Worcester left after this, and certainly not much of a player base.
Secondly as late as yesterday Goode and Hamilton were suggesting that 2 welsh regions could be invited into the premiership
This. I think that it is wishful thinking to see Worcester in the championship next season. I would be surprised if there is anything beyond an amateur club taking the name in the lower echelons.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Rugbygramps »

GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:29 pm
Rugbygramps wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:25 pm 2 things, I think it may be an assumption to say they are going to end up in the championship. There may be very little of Worcester left after this, and certainly not much of a player base.
Secondly as late as yesterday Goode and Hamilton were suggesting that 2 welsh regions could be invited into the premiership
This. I think that it is wishful thinking to see Worcester in the championship next season. I would be surprised if there is anything beyong and amateur club taking the name in the lower ecelons.
Different levels I know, but that is what happened to Rugby Lions a few seasons back, and before them I believe Manchester rfc
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Tigerbeat »

It is understood Warriors could now have their suspension from the Premiership and other competitions extended until the end of season - and suffer relegation to the Championship.

But, if a buyer is found by the middle of this month, they could still save their place in the Premiership.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Rugbygramps »

So players are supposed to put their lives on hold, in the hope a buyer may be found, then next preseason turn up for life in the championship, if a buyer isn’t found, having had no rugby and no income.

Someone at the RFU and Premiership rugby needs to get a grip, these lads are now effectively unemployed, they aren’t going to be hanging round on a wing and a prayer.
That’s without what is happening to the non rugby staff that are out of a job.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by TigerFeetSteve »

Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:34 pm It is understood Warriors could now have their suspension from the Premiership and other competitions extended until the end of season - and suffer relegation to the Championship.

But, if a buyer is found by the middle of this month, they could still save their place in the Premiership.
Basically my understanding too.

If Worcester RFC Trading (the entity in administration) can get a buyer AND manage to pick up enough players (coaches and other staff) on new contracts, then there is hope, but that means a lot of contracts to get signed... hopefully they'll sort it and get it agreed.

Then hope that the prem decide to lift their suspension.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Not a jock »

As things stand, every weekend there will be two teams without a game, one with a scheduled bye and one who would have played Wuss (except the two weekends when Wuss were scheduled a bye).

Is there any chance of rejigging the fixtures to effectively create a spare weekend or two later in the season eg to coincide with the Six Nations? The benefit would be fewer teams fielding weakened teams due to international call-ups.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by GB72 »

TigerFeetSteve wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:44 pm
Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:34 pm It is understood Warriors could now have their suspension from the Premiership and other competitions extended until the end of season - and suffer relegation to the Championship.

But, if a buyer is found by the middle of this month, they could still save their place in the Premiership.
Basically my understanding too.

If Worcester RFC Trading (the entity in administration) can get a buyer AND manage to pick up enough players (coaches and other staff) on new contracts, then there is hope, but that means a lot of contracts to get signed... hopefully they'll sort it and get it agreed.

Then hope that the prem decide to lift their suspension.
Sadly whoever comes in has to sign all of those players, pay them, pay the clubs debts, pay for the running of the facilities, insurance etc for a year with no income and little chance of recouping those original funds and with most of the club assetts in outside ownership. Cannot see it happening.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by Rugbygramps »

GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:48 pm
TigerFeetSteve wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:44 pm
Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:34 pm It is understood Warriors could now have their suspension from the Premiership and other competitions extended until the end of season - and suffer relegation to the Championship.

But, if a buyer is found by the middle of this month, they could still save their place in the Premiership.
Basically my understanding too.

If Worcester RFC Trading (the entity in administration) can get a buyer AND manage to pick up enough players (coaches and other staff) on new contracts, then there is hope, but that means a lot of contracts to get signed... hopefully they'll sort it and get it agreed.

Then hope that the prem decide to lift their suspension.
Sadly whoever comes in has to sign all of those players, pay them, pay the clubs debts, pay for the running of the facilities, insurance etc for a year with no income and little chance of recouping those original funds and with most of the club assetts in outside ownership. Cannot see it happening.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by TigerFeetSteve »

GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:48 pm
TigerFeetSteve wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:44 pm
Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:34 pm It is understood Warriors could now have their suspension from the Premiership and other competitions extended until the end of season - and suffer relegation to the Championship.

But, if a buyer is found by the middle of this month, they could still save their place in the Premiership.
Basically my understanding too.

If Worcester RFC Trading (the entity in administration) can get a buyer AND manage to pick up enough players (coaches and other staff) on new contracts, then there is hope, but that means a lot of contracts to get signed... hopefully they'll sort it and get it agreed.

Then hope that the prem decide to lift their suspension.
Sadly whoever comes in has to sign all of those players, pay them, pay the clubs debts, pay for the running of the facilities, insurance etc for a year with no income and little chance of recouping those original funds and with most of the club assetts in outside ownership. Cannot see it happening.
It won't be for the full year if my reading of the BBC article is correct. They're being given till the middle of the month to see if they can carry on their remaining fixtures this season, OR they will be suspended by PRL for the season, so if the administrators can get something sorted in the next week or two they may have the games to generate revenue.

It has been publicly announced there currently two offers to buy the club on the table.
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by fentiger »

From Steve Diamond on Twitter: ‘This is the darkestday for English rugby. We thought we could turn the tanker around but it’s ended up like the Titanic, sadly. The ship has sunk, the captains are nowhere to be seen. The RFU/PRL band played in the back ground. There are a privileged few who have jobs.’
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Re: Worcester’s woes

Post by sam16111986 »

Rugbygramps wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:27 pm
sam16111986 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:21 pm
GB72 wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:58 am

My guess would have been (and it is a totally uneducated guess) that the players on loan would be playing for expenses and little else just so as they could keep training and stay sharp for a month. Now that they have no contracts, they are going to have to look for full pay positions at clubs.
A four week loan for those four players would have been pretty cheap and Bath have injuries so could have covered it with injury dispensation. If the combined salary of those four was £600k per annum then it's £50k for the four week loan period to have all four with the club. Quite conceivably affordable.

Unlikely to be able to afford them for the season unless the players take a serious pay cut or the PRL agree to a change in cap rules though.
Sam I think the question is not so much around finance but more who are these 4 players on loan from as they are no longer employees of Worcester rugby club. Would that make them free agents on short term deals.
The contracts aren't negated yet so currently the loan arrangements still stand. What happens after that I don't know. As you say you can't have a loan from a company that doesn't exist. I guess the players agents will be in talks and a short term contract might suit all parties whilst negotiations over longer term take place.
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