Transfers & Rumours Non-Tigers 2022

[ay2oh]

ay2oh, do you really think Bath would abuse the salary cap, surely they would have learnt from the indiscretions of Saracens and Tigers.

yes

[BigDan50]

Hmmm

[ABClub]

Bath building a very strong squad.

What salary cap

If Bath are over the cap then who knows how Tigers are under. The only position I look at the likely squads for next season side by side and think that Bath will be spending more is back row given that Jasper is leaving us and Guy Pepper coming into the Rec.

[ay2oh]

Bath building a very strong squad.

What salary cap

If Bath are over the cap then who knows how Tigers are under. The only position I look at the likely squads for next season side by side and think that Bath will be spending more is back row given that Jasper is leaving us and Guy Pepper coming into the Rec.

let me enlighten you then. JVP, Youngs, Kelly, Cole, Martin, Chessum, Wells, Reffell, Whitcombe, Henderson , Heyes, have all come through our academy and although some of these players will have been given well deserved salary increases for us to bring in players of similar quality would have cost us far more. At the time of writing we have released more players than we have signed including Wiese who is one of our top earners. Bath on the other hand have bought in a number of players since Van Graan took over including some South Africans as well as Lawrence, Hill and Barbeary. I’ll leave you to do the math.

[sam16111986]

What salary cap

If Bath are over the cap then who knows how Tigers are under. The only position I look at the likely squads for next season side by side and think that Bath will be spending more is back row given that Jasper is leaving us and Guy Pepper coming into the Rec.

let me enlighten you then. JVP, Youngs, Kelly, Cole, Martin, Chessum, Wells, Reffell, Whitcombe, Henderson , Heyes, have all come through our academy and although some of these players will have been given well deserved salary increases for us to bring in players of similar quality would have cost us far more. At the time of writing we have released more players than we have signed including Wiese who is one of our top earners. Bath on the other hand have bought in a number of players since Van Graan took over including some South Africans as well as Lawrence, Hill and Barbeary. I’ll leave you to do the math.

Yeah but at the same time they were signing those guys they released Jonathan Joseph, Falatau, Watson etc. they moved some older big money guys out to make room. They'll probably be moving some on for next season as well. Gallagher already confirmed as leaving and is unlikely to be replaced.

[Tigerbeat]

Bath also picked up some Worcester and Wasp players and probably at a bargain

[Tiglon]

Just had a scroll through the Bath squad list and I'd be surprised if they are spending more than us next season.

Take out Russell, and your not left with many big money players. Even the likes of Underhill and Cokanasiga are surely not on huge money given their injury problems.

Similarly to us, a lot of their first team has come through their academy or been picked up cheap from other clubs. The overseas players are mostly not internationals with loads of caps.

[sam16111986]

Bath also picked up some Worcester and Wasp players and probably at a bargain

They had apparently been staying a chunk under the cap because of injuries in previous seasons leaving them exposed. So they'd kept some aside for injury cover signings which then got used picking up stranded players. By the following season they'd shed some of their overpaid stars to slot those guys in. Watson was on something stupid like £300k+ so Lawrence and Hill could have come in for him.

[Tigers86asw]

Just had a scroll through the Bath squad list and I'd be surprised if they are spending more than us next season.

Take out Russell, and your not left with many big money players. Even the likes of Underhill and Cokanasiga are surely not on huge money given their injury problems.

Similarly to us, a lot of their first team has come through their academy or been picked up cheap from other clubs. The overseas players are mostly not internationals with loads of caps.

No but lots of international level players- Lawrence/Redpath/Spencer/Underhill/Cokanasiga/Hill/Obano/Stuart/Ewels/Pepper/Ojomoh

I really rate Du Toit- plays both size, great frame,

All players who are internationals or have been. Many likely to be in Borthwick’s wider squad. I think they’ve built a really good squad.

[longlivethecrumbie]

Lovejoy Chawatama is signing for Brizzle to replace Sinckler

[ABClub]

What salary cap

If Bath are over the cap then who knows how Tigers are under. The only position I look at the likely squads for next season side by side and think that Bath will be spending more is back row given that Jasper is leaving us and Guy Pepper coming into the Rec.

let me enlighten you then. JVP, Youngs, Kelly, Cole, Martin, Chessum, Wells, Reffell, Whitcombe, Henderson , Heyes, have all come through our academy and although some of these players will have been given well deserved salary increases for us to bring in players of similar quality would have cost us far more. At the time of writing we have released more players than we have signed including Wiese who is one of our top earners. Bath on the other hand have bought in a number of players since Van Graan took over including some South Africans as well as Lawrence, Hill and Barbeary. I’ll leave you to do the math.

LH - Smith, Cronin, Whitcombe vs Obano, Schoeman, Cordwell
Obano might be the biggest earner but has had injuries. Smith wont be a budget signing. Whilst Cronin should be on more than Schoeman. Likely similar spend.

Hooker - Montoya, Dolly, Clare, FTT vs Dunn, Annett, Faiva, Stewart
Montoya alone might be on more than 3 of Bath's combined. Dolly will be a similar earner to Bath's first choice. Tigers are spending way more.

TH - Cole, Heyes, Hurd, Richardson vs Stuart, du Toit, Jonker, Griffin, Verden
Cole and Heyes, Stuart and du Toit will take up the bulk of this spending. I'd expect Cole to warrant a higher wage than Stuart but du Toit to have maybe cost more to bring in than Heyes. Though Heyes would start for many clubs too. The others will be much of a muchness. Similar spend.

Lock - Chess, Martin, Henderson, Wells vs Ewels, Molony, Richards, (Roux? Stooke? du Plessis? McNally?)
I'm just going to leave this as up in the air for next season. Bath have a lot of maybes. Well informed Bath fans I know are hoping that 2 of those maybes are there next season, though views on which differ. Whilst many here, myself included, are hoping that Tigers bring in a unit of a second row. Despite being home grown, Chess and Martin wont come cheap though. Pending.

Flanker - Reffell, Hatherell, Cracknell, Rogerson, Illione vs Underhill, Hill, Reid, Bayliss, Pepper, Tonks
Underhill and Reffell should be similar contracts I'd expect. Hill will be the next highest earner. Then Bath are bringing in Pepper. Even with Cloete rumoured to be leaving, this should be Bath spending more.

Number 8 - Hanro and Beets vs Barbeary and Coetzee
Hanro and Barbeary likely similar but Bath will be spending more given Coetzee compared to Beets.

SH - JvP, Youngs, Whitely vs Spencer, Schreuder
Lenny and JvP should be on more than Spencer and Schreuder. Bath's backup are likely academy cap but Whiteley wont be a big wage. Tigers spending more.

FH - Shillcock vs Bailey
Pollard and Russell are marquees. Shillcock should be on more than Bailey though. Tigers spending more.

Centre - Kata, Perese, Kelly, Porter vs Lawrence, Redpath, Ojomoh, Butt
Lawrence maybe the biggest earner of the 8 but Butt, underrated player IMO, will likely be on the smallest contract. Kata and Perese wont come cheap, whilst Kelly and Porter's stock was higher when re-signing. Centre looks like similar spend to me.

Wing - OHC, Watson, Bassett, Simmons vs Cokanasiga, Muir, McConnochie? Grace?
OHC and Cokanasiga will be similar deals. Both powerful finishers just below the England squad. Rumours that McConnochie might be off but expect a similar signing if so given their numbers would be low. It depends on how much lower Watson's post injury deal was. On paper, that looks like Tigers spending more to me. It might be similar if Watson was really cut price.

Fullback - Steward and Brown vs de Glanville, Owen (and potential Gallagher replacement)
Steward will be on way more than de Glanville. Presuming an incoming fullback to replace Gallagher isn't a huge signing, Tigers will be spending more here due to Freddie.

So, we have hooker, SH, FH and fullback where I'd say Tigers should clearly be spending more. Hooker massively so. LH, TH, centre and wing don't seem any obvious difference. Lock is pending for both clubs. Back row should be Bath spending more.

So despite your philanthropic offer of enlightenment, I just don't see anyway that Bath are obviously playing silly with the cap but Tigers would be under it when you line up the squads side by side.

[johnthegriff]

That is an awful lot of work when we don't know the salary of a single player listed. Of course what is paid to any player is irrelevant all that matters is what they actually bring to the team.

[ay2oh]

If Bath are over the cap then who knows how Tigers are under. The only position I look at the likely squads for next season side by side and think that Bath will be spending more is back row given that Jasper is leaving us and Guy Pepper coming into the Rec.

let me enlighten you then. JVP, Youngs, Kelly, Cole, Martin, Chessum, Wells, Reffell, Whitcombe, Henderson , Heyes, have all come through our academy and although some of these players will have been given well deserved salary increases for us to bring in players of similar quality would have cost us far more. At the time of writing we have released more players than we have signed including Wiese who is one of our top earners. Bath on the other hand have bought in a number of players since Van Graan took over including some South Africans as well as Lawrence, Hill and Barbeary. I’ll leave you to do the math.

LH - Smith, Cronin, Whitcombe vs Obano, Schoeman, Cordwell
Obano might be the biggest earner but has had injuries. Smith wont be a budget signing. Whilst Cronin should be on more than Schoeman. Likely similar spend.

Hooker - Montoya, Dolly, Clare, FTT vs Dunn, Annett, Faiva, Stewart
Montoya alone might be on more than 3 of Bath's combined. Dolly will be a similar earner to Bath's first choice. Tigers are spending way more.

TH - Cole, Heyes, Hurd, Richardson vs Stuart, du Toit, Jonker, Griffin, Verden
Cole and Heyes, Stuart and du Toit will take up the bulk of this spending. I'd expect Cole to warrant a higher wage than Stuart but du Toit to have maybe cost more to bring in than Heyes. Though Heyes would start for many clubs too. The others will be much of a muchness. Similar spend.

Lock - Chess, Martin, Henderson, Wells vs Ewels, Molony, Richards, (Roux? Stooke? du Plessis? McNally?)
I'm just going to leave this as up in the air for next season. Bath have a lot of maybes. Well informed Bath fans I know are hoping that 2 of those maybes are there next season, though views on which differ. Whilst many here, myself included, are hoping that Tigers bring in a unit of a second row. Despite being home grown, Chess and Martin wont come cheap though. Pending.

Flanker - Reffell, Hatherell, Cracknell, Rogerson, Illione vs Underhill, Hill, Reid, Bayliss, Pepper, Tonks
Underhill and Reffell should be similar contracts I'd expect. Hill will be the next highest earner. Then Bath are bringing in Pepper. Even with Cloete rumoured to be leaving, this should be Bath spending more.

Number 8 - Hanro and Beets vs Barbeary and Coetzee
Hanro and Barbeary likely similar but Bath will be spending more given Coetzee compared to Beets.

SH - JvP, Youngs, Whitely vs Spencer, Schreuder
Lenny and JvP should be on more than Spencer and Schreuder. Bath's backup are likely academy cap but Whiteley wont be a big wage. Tigers spending more.

FH - Shillcock vs Bailey
Pollard and Russell are marquees. Shillcock should be on more than Bailey though. Tigers spending more.

Centre - Kata, Perese, Kelly, Porter vs Lawrence, Redpath, Ojomoh, Butt
Lawrence maybe the biggest earner of the 8 but Butt, underrated player IMO, will likely be on the smallest contract. Kata and Perese wont come cheap, whilst Kelly and Porter's stock was higher when re-signing. Centre looks like similar spend to me.

Wing - OHC, Watson, Bassett, Simmons vs Cokanasiga, Muir, McConnochie? Grace?
OHC and Cokanasiga will be similar deals. Both powerful finishers just below the England squad. Rumours that McConnochie might be off but expect a similar signing if so given their numbers would be low. It depends on how much lower Watson's post injury deal was. On paper, that looks like Tigers spending more to me. It might be similar if Watson was really cut price.

Fullback - Steward and Brown vs de Glanville, Owen (and potential Gallagher replacement)
Steward will be on way more than de Glanville. Presuming an incoming fullback to replace Gallagher isn't a huge signing, Tigers will be spending more here due to Freddie.

So, we have hooker, SH, FH and fullback where I'd say Tigers should clearly be spending more. Hooker massively so. LH, TH, centre and wing don't seem any obvious difference. Lock is pending for both clubs. Back row should be Bath spending more.

So despite your philanthropic offer of enlightenment, I just don't see anyway that Bath are obviously playing silly with the cap but Tigers would be under it when you line up the squads side by side.

You don’t have ANY facts on players salaries so total guesswork

[ABClub]

let me enlighten you then. JVP, Youngs, Kelly, Cole, Martin, Chessum, Wells, Reffell, Whitcombe, Henderson , Heyes, have all come through our academy and although some of these players will have been given well deserved salary increases for us to bring in players of similar quality would have cost us far more. At the time of writing we have released more players than we have signed including Wiese who is one of our top earners. Bath on the other hand have bought in a number of players since Van Graan took over including some South Africans as well as Lawrence, Hill and Barbeary. I’ll leave you to do the math.

LH - Smith, Cronin, Whitcombe vs Obano, Schoeman, Cordwell
Obano might be the biggest earner but has had injuries. Smith wont be a budget signing. Whilst Cronin should be on more than Schoeman. Likely similar spend.

Hooker - Montoya, Dolly, Clare, FTT vs Dunn, Annett, Faiva, Stewart
Montoya alone might be on more than 3 of Bath's combined. Dolly will be a similar earner to Bath's first choice. Tigers are spending way more.

TH - Cole, Heyes, Hurd, Richardson vs Stuart, du Toit, Jonker, Griffin, Verden
Cole and Heyes, Stuart and du Toit will take up the bulk of this spending. I'd expect Cole to warrant a higher wage than Stuart but du Toit to have maybe cost more to bring in than Heyes. Though Heyes would start for many clubs too. The others will be much of a muchness. Similar spend.

Lock - Chess, Martin, Henderson, Wells vs Ewels, Molony, Richards, (Roux? Stooke? du Plessis? McNally?)
I'm just going to leave this as up in the air for next season. Bath have a lot of maybes. Well informed Bath fans I know are hoping that 2 of those maybes are there next season, though views on which differ. Whilst many here, myself included, are hoping that Tigers bring in a unit of a second row. Despite being home grown, Chess and Martin wont come cheap though. Pending.

Flanker - Reffell, Hatherell, Cracknell, Rogerson, Illione vs Underhill, Hill, Reid, Bayliss, Pepper, Tonks
Underhill and Reffell should be similar contracts I'd expect. Hill will be the next highest earner. Then Bath are bringing in Pepper. Even with Cloete rumoured to be leaving, this should be Bath spending more.

Number 8 - Hanro and Beets vs Barbeary and Coetzee
Hanro and Barbeary likely similar but Bath will be spending more given Coetzee compared to Beets.

SH - JvP, Youngs, Whitely vs Spencer, Schreuder
Lenny and JvP should be on more than Spencer and Schreuder. Bath's backup are likely academy cap but Whiteley wont be a big wage. Tigers spending more.

FH - Shillcock vs Bailey
Pollard and Russell are marquees. Shillcock should be on more than Bailey though. Tigers spending more.

Centre - Kata, Perese, Kelly, Porter vs Lawrence, Redpath, Ojomoh, Butt
Lawrence maybe the biggest earner of the 8 but Butt, underrated player IMO, will likely be on the smallest contract. Kata and Perese wont come cheap, whilst Kelly and Porter's stock was higher when re-signing. Centre looks like similar spend to me.

Wing - OHC, Watson, Bassett, Simmons vs Cokanasiga, Muir, McConnochie? Grace?
OHC and Cokanasiga will be similar deals. Both powerful finishers just below the England squad. Rumours that McConnochie might be off but expect a similar signing if so given their numbers would be low. It depends on how much lower Watson's post injury deal was. On paper, that looks like Tigers spending more to me. It might be similar if Watson was really cut price.

Fullback - Steward and Brown vs de Glanville, Owen (and potential Gallagher replacement)
Steward will be on way more than de Glanville. Presuming an incoming fullback to replace Gallagher isn't a huge signing, Tigers will be spending more here due to Freddie.

So, we have hooker, SH, FH and fullback where I'd say Tigers should clearly be spending more. Hooker massively so. LH, TH, centre and wing don't seem any obvious difference. Lock is pending for both clubs. Back row should be Bath spending more.

So despite your philanthropic offer of enlightenment, I just don't see anyway that Bath are obviously playing silly with the cap but Tigers would be under it when you line up the squads side by side.

You don’t have ANY facts on players salaries so total guesswork

Which is also entirely true of your claim that Bath are breaking the cap. I've merely offered reasoning behind my counterpoint.

[Tiglon]

Just had a scroll through the Bath squad list and I'd be surprised if they are spending more than us next season.

Take out Russell, and your not left with many big money players. Even the likes of Underhill and Cokanasiga are surely not on huge money given their injury problems.

Similarly to us, a lot of their first team has come through their academy or been picked up cheap from other clubs. The overseas players are mostly not internationals with loads of caps.

No but lots of international level players- Lawrence/Redpath/Spencer/Underhill/Cokanasiga/Hill/Obano/Stuart/Ewels/Pepper/Ojomoh

I really rate Du Toit- plays both size, great frame,

All players who are internationals or have been. Many likely to be in Borthwick’s wider squad. I think they’ve built a really good squad.

We're not talking about how good they are, but what they are likely to be paid.