The Scrum

[ellis9]

Kinoulton says collapsing the scrum to wind down the clock is not rugby union. OK it is a valid point but does that mean that when you are winning and a forward picks up the ball from a ruck and drops 1 step forward and the ball stays in the ruck for 30 secs at a time for the next forward to do the same and then the next forward to do the same again and so on is not rugby union.

I seem to remember quite a few occasions when Tigers have done this.

[trendylfj]

Being my unusual uncontroversial self - can I suggest this over simplistic answer.

Instead of pinging the offence at a scrum, and, unless there is a dangerous situation evolving - PLAY ADVANTAGE!!!!!!!!

This would keep the game moving and still give the option of coming back for the offence if no advantage ensues.

As for the joining of the scrum, again a simple solution.

Front 5 join with no push until the ball is fed and back row join at the same time as the command feed is given by the ref. Failure to feed on command = free kick advantage

[ellis9]

Even if the ref did shout "Use it" then the player would just pick it up hit another ruck, the ref would ask for the ball to be moved so the next player would pick it up hit the ruck and so on.

Basically, what I am saying is there are always certain rules which can be bent without actually breaking them to work in your teams favour.

[taffyboiy]

Yeah, watching teams wind the clock down is rubbish. (I actually find it worse to watch when it's the team I'm supporting!)

Would this be better?

If the scrum has to be reset, the clock is stopped until the ball comes out legally or there's a penalty/free kick - that should reduce the time lost through endless resets.

If a pick-and-drive fails to get over the gain-line, scrum to the opposition. Same goes for little pop-passes to flying-wedge forwards.

[Old Hob]

Yeah, watching teams wind the clock down is rubbish. (I actually find it worse to watch when it's the team I'm supporting!)

Would this be better?

If the scrum has to be reset, the clock is stopped until the ball comes out legally or there's a penalty/free kick - that should reduce the time lost through endless resets.

If a pick-and-drive fails to get over the gain-line, scrum to the opposition. Same goes for little pop-passes to flying-wedge forwards.

This is dangerously close to "Make 10 yards or hand it over"

So, at Welford Road tonight; it's the third down and only 8 gained

[Bill W (2)]

Every time a scrum is reset the referee should be required to pay into the Matt Hampson Trust:

First reset - £500
Second reset - an additional £1000
Thirt reset - an additional £1500

and so on.

Suddenly refs would develop the ability to know who was responsible for the collapse.

[taffyboiy]

[quote]This is dangerously close to "Make 10 yards or hand it over"[/quote]

Well, it's fairly close, but I doubt American football or Rugby League would come round asking for their rules back! It's only a suggestion to reward a good bit of defending, or discourage teams doing the ol' pick, drive, hide the ball under big pile of bodies, wait 10 seconds, repeat till final whistle - which is a cheap and cr@ppy tactic

I suppose an alternative is a free kick to the opposition for blatant time-wasting. (Assuming the likes of Old Hob can cope with such shameless borrowing of rules from other sports!)

[Kinoulton]

This is dangerously close to "Make 10 yards or hand it over"

Well, it's fairly close, but I doubt American football or Rugby League would come round asking for their rules back! It's only a suggestion to reward a good bit of defending, or discourage teams doing the ol' pick, drive, hide the ball under big pile of bodies, wait 10 seconds, repeat till final whistle - which is a cheap and cr@ppy tactic

I suppose an alternative is a free kick to the opposition for blatant time-wasting. (Assuming the likes of Old Hob can cope with such shameless borrowing of rules from other sports!)

Totally agree.
Rolling maul = RU
Proper ruck = RU
Several staionery rucks that slowly inch across the pitch and go nowhere much = Not Proper Sport

[Bill W (2)]

Several staionery <sic> rucks that slowly inch across the pitch and go nowhere much = Not Proper Sport

A ruck that does not move should result in a scrum to the side taking the ball in. A maul that does not move should result in a scrum to the side not taking the ball in.

What are the refs doing??

[ellis9]

A ruck that moves? Surely thats a maul isn't it?

[Bill W (2)]

A ruck that moves? Surely thats a maul isn't it?

Negative. A ruck has the ball on the floor. A maul has the ball off the floor.

[ellis9]

Exactly. If the ball is on the floor how can a ruck move? You can take the ball out of the ruck and make the next phase of play but thats not actually moving a ruck is it?

[Bill W (2)]

Exactly. If the ball is on the floor how can a ruck move? You can take the ball out of the ruck and make the next phase of play but thats not actually moving a ruck is it?

The ball can be dribbled forward with the feet.

Most #8's are skilled at this.