Pat Howard

bigstef · Post by **bigstef** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:32 pm

Alot of people are starting to get annoyed with this man at the moment, what do we think guys, sohuld he be sacked? Do we need a new head coach?

I personall y think you cannot just put the blame on Pat, he and his whole team lately have been making decisions that only they can explain, i personally would like some new blood in, with the squad that we have we should be doing better, and we also are in real desperate need of a proper backs coach, any views guys?

WilfMan · Post by **WilfMan** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:35 pm

a better backs coach and a huge player signing would be nice

Bud · Post by **Bud** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:42 pm

I have faith it Pat, to the end. I confess to be a bit confused with some of his decisions recently, but I'd back him all the way. It's crazy that people have been calling for his head after months of wishing he would stay another year.

smith482 · Post by **smith482** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:24 pm

I questionned the team last week and was proved wrong - Pat seems to know his players. Can't say I'm happy he's sending Humph to Leeds but I'm sure he knows what he's doing. I'm happy to stick with Pat for now and give him the benefit of the doubt

King Kong · Post by **King Kong** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:02 pm

Its too early to say, but I am starting to get a little tired of all the changing. He needs to pick a team and stick with it.

Mat · Post by **Mat** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:17 pm

Sorry King Kong the day of picking a team and sticking with it are long gone. We did this two seasons agao and won th eleague but then ranout of steam in the grand final and were destryoyed by Wasps.

Many players are not avialiable due to international call ups so wecant pick the core players for about 1/3 of the prem games.
Modern players get injured regularly so again we cant pick the same team week in week out.

Players need rest time to peak at the right time of the season. Wasps pipped us in recent years by having there players peak to win in the playoffs not week in week out soldiers.

We have to have at least 2 if not 3 players for each position who are good players. With a salery cap that means they have to be given game time.

The real problem is not the chopping and changing but we just dont have enough game changing palyers anymore, this has been compounded by injuries to key palyers like Gibbo.

You need a squad for the grind of the league to get you in the top 4 and then your stars to win you the cups in teh semis and finasls. Sadly we just dont have creative stars.

I do think that maybe the players have been over coached on moves in stead of heads up whats on rugby , but I would say that is true for most of the Norther Hemisphere and not just Tigers.Sadly rugby is copying football and loosing , not producing or discouraginf skillfull players. We seem obsesed with having 15 players who can smash the man in the tackle etc who are conservative and so dont give the ball away etc etc.

We need to get creative dont be afraid of mistakes. Free Varndell use his pace and forgett the fact he misses the odd tackle. I can t actually remeber him missing many takles that cost us tries so who cares. He certainly has scored a lot for us. I think i read its 30 tries in 34 games. WEll that is workld class.

simon redshaw · Post by **simon redshaw** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 7:41 am

Mat, whilst I agree with all you say, I would also add you also need a mental attitude. That is what Wasps had in those three years of winning the play-offs. They were able to win tight games or to dominate the opposition. There was also perhaps a one-game too far feeling for the other clubs like ourselves. We have not had the right mental attitude in big games over recent years.

Of course, in a just or sensible world, Wasps would never have had the chance to win those games in the first place. But we all know how crooked and corrupt people like the RFU can be.

To get back to Pat Howard, the jury is or should be out on him. Whilst we don't want to sack a coach at this stage into the season, the board should be looking closely at the outcome of these loan moves and other decisions he makes. I just feel that there is something not right within the club, on the coaching, team spirit side or whatever.

This considerable chopping and changing isn't really what the club needs, a more settled situation is what is needed. It seems to me that Pat is prepared, rightly or wrongly, to take an ever increasing amount of gambles, which he sees as being for the long term benefit of the club. Some of these have been selectorial decisions, other loan moves. These gambles are fine if they pay off and make the club more succesful, but if they don't, then his head is on the block surely. Also, it could be said all these loan moves etc, are not altogether great for the individuals involved or for team spirit.

Its difficult to say this but a number of people like myself have lost faith and confidence in this guy. Probably because we as a body can't understand what he is doing and how it will benefit the club. If we are proven wrong, then that's fine on me. We would be the first to hold our hands up and say we were wrong. We need to be looking at other avenues for the end of the season in case Pat's gambles go t...i...t...s... up, and why we don't have a decent backs coach is beyond me. Surely the board should know that. Although we have missed a number of good candidates already. Maybe if we did have a good backs coach, the sort of problems that we can't seem to address by sending players away on loan, could be more readily solved.

Rlinksteve · Post by **Rlinksteve** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 8:06 am

We have played 5 games, won 3 drawn 1 and lost 1

We have got several players unavailable due to injury.

Disaster - I think not.

Tigers are still in the mix for all competititions and I think that it is wrong that we should be discussing this topic based on the above.

Lets get behind Pat and the team. Pat knows what he is doing and works more closely with the players than we do.

simon redshaw · Post by **simon redshaw** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 8:15 am

Whilst I accept that Pat works more closely with the players then we do, the jury is out on whether he knows what he is doing or is making the right decisions.

Being able to work closely with players doesn't necessarily make you a great coach nor as someone says does being a very good player. Also, it could be said we underachieved last season in that we could have had more.

rockhound · Post by **rockhound** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:07 am

Has a decision been made as to whether Pat will be staying at the end of the season...or do we go into farce mode as usual

simon redshaw · Post by **simon redshaw** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:28 am

Assuming this is what you are meaning, the club needs to make a decision on Pat Howard by the end of the season. At the moment, many are not convinced that he ought to stay.

rockhound · Post by **rockhound** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:31 am

Assuming Pat decides to leave - who would you want as his replacement

simon redshaw · Post by **simon redshaw** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:40 am

We had Scott Johnson or John Kirwan as two possible contenders last season so if either of those was available I would give them serious consideration. Mike Ruddock did a good job with Wales, I believe.

Another choice of mine, if he became available, would be Warren Gatland who did a great job with Wasps.

Certainly someone with his experience and background would be great for Tigers.

WoolMan · Post by **WoolMan** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:42 am

I believe in what Pat is doing as a coach, and at the end of the season when we lift that trophy we will all be happy :D

On loaning of players - in yesterdays Ian H debat - all the top football premiership clubs do this all the time. Theo Walcott was loaned out for the whole of last season from Arsenal to Sheff Utd(?), its very common practice to give your young games a full game.

Also, remember we are only palying for a play off position, and in France all the top teams only put the first team out for Heiniken Cups & play offs at the end of the season. With Cockers and Pats French connection, they are doing exactly what I expected.

Rizzo · Post by **Rizzo** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:24 am

Surely the question is - who would wish to take on the job IF Pat and the Club decide he is not continuing after this season. Johnno is out of the question for the time being, he has said so himself. And I bet there would be other clubs who'd snap Pat up if they got the chance!