Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
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Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Well we got what we deserved, when u set out to kick the ball all day long , I thought after our last 2-3 games where we played some great football , but today it was back to the same kick and chase it’s boring and gets u know where , when u have a player like Watson he needs the ball in his hands he is a gun but the only time he seen it was when he jumped in the air for it . Think our season is over playing like this .
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
never thought I’d say this but I agree with Scott.Scott1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:07 amNot really! Pollard went off in the 45th minute,we stopped playing rugby long before that. We played heads up rugby for the first 20 minutes if we are being generous but it was more like 15.aslongaswebeatsaints wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:29 pm For me the massive momentum change was Pollard going off. We were much better organised when he was on the pitch. Once he departed we seemed to stop using the width of the pitch and defaulted to kick smash then repeat. Which was a massive shame because Watson and Potter were really testing them.
Have to admit I applauded the Saints Try - what a fantastic offload.
But I don’t blame WW for the loss. It was a close game as a Derby should be. But we were hamstrung before we even got on the pitch. That sits firmly with the RFU for ripping the heart of our coaching team because they panicked over EJ, as they also panicked last week over tackle height. And that’s before you consider the depletion due England, easily solved if they proactively looked at the calendar. Derbys should be an all guns affair between the best players on each team.
A2O
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
It happens once in a whileay2oh wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:05 amnever thought I’d say this but I agree with Scott.Scott1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:07 amNot really! Pollard went off in the 45th minute,we stopped playing rugby long before that. We played heads up rugby for the first 20 minutes if we are being generous but it was more like 15.aslongaswebeatsaints wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:29 pm For me the massive momentum change was Pollard going off. We were much better organised when he was on the pitch. Once he departed we seemed to stop using the width of the pitch and defaulted to kick smash then repeat. Which was a massive shame because Watson and Potter were really testing them.
Have to admit I applauded the Saints Try - what a fantastic offload.
But I don’t blame WW for the loss. It was a close game as a Derby should be. But we were hamstrung before we even got on the pitch. That sits firmly with the RFU for ripping the heart of our coaching team because they panicked over EJ, as they also panicked last week over tackle height. And that’s before you consider the depletion due England, easily solved if they proactively looked at the calendar. Derbys should be an all guns affair between the best players on each team.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
For me next season we need a settled half back partnership, Pollard and JVP need to hit a tune backed up by Atkinson and Youngs. We have lacked continuity this season, with Ford we had a near world class general who ran the show pretty much all season, Burns backed him up well and had his golden season.
Take Farrell out of Sarries and I think they would be massively less effective.
RW certainly isn’t the head coach we need to move forward due to his lack of experience, need a wise head to reset and find a style of rugby that again gets the job done and gets the points in tight games.
Take Farrell out of Sarries and I think they would be massively less effective.
RW certainly isn’t the head coach we need to move forward due to his lack of experience, need a wise head to reset and find a style of rugby that again gets the job done and gets the points in tight games.
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Yes,I understand Andrea has said we are not giving WW any targets to achieve to put his name in the hat ,or something along those lines,but let’s not go down the GM route again please! I believe he got the gig FT after losing something like 7 in 8 games. WW has shown me enough already to know he’s not the man for the job so I certainly hope he’s out the frame.baz1664 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:07 am For me next season we need a settled half back partnership, Pollard and JVP need to hit a tune backed up by Atkinson and Youngs. We have lacked continuity this season, with Ford we had a near world class general who ran the show pretty much all season, Burns backed him up well and had his golden season.
Take Farrell out of Sarries and I think they would be massively less effective.
RW certainly isn’t the head coach we need to move forward due to his lack of experience, need a wise head to reset and find a style of rugby that again gets the job done and gets the points in tight games.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
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Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
For me on Wigglesworth
Clearly a good backs coach imo, before today our backs looked better than they had been.
But big game and missing some key players he reverted to Borthwick’s game plan which isn’t his game plan and it didn’t work.
That being said I also not really sure these results would’ve been any different with Borthwick as head coach either.
Forwards not got the depth anymore to survive the game plan he likes.
But I do think after 4 years of full time assistant coaching Wigglesworth would make an excellent head coach.
Maybe he has a stint under Borthwick till next rugby World Cup and we might look to bring him in then.
Either that or he just needs to back his own game plan now.
Clearly a good backs coach imo, before today our backs looked better than they had been.
But big game and missing some key players he reverted to Borthwick’s game plan which isn’t his game plan and it didn’t work.
That being said I also not really sure these results would’ve been any different with Borthwick as head coach either.
Forwards not got the depth anymore to survive the game plan he likes.
But I do think after 4 years of full time assistant coaching Wigglesworth would make an excellent head coach.
Maybe he has a stint under Borthwick till next rugby World Cup and we might look to bring him in then.
Either that or he just needs to back his own game plan now.
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Why didn’t he revert to SB gameplan for the first 15/20 minutes when we looked at our best?RagingBull wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:37 am For me on Wigglesworth
Clearly a good backs coach imo, before today our backs looked better than they had been.
But big game and missing some key players he reverted to Borthwick’s game plan which isn’t his game plan and it didn’t work.
That being said I also not really sure these results would’ve been any different with Borthwick as head coach either.
Forwards not got the depth anymore to survive the game plan he likes.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
If we have signed Hassell-Collins to go with Shilcock , Atkinson , Watson , Kelly , Steward etc would be madness to keep kicking the ball away next season.
A2O
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Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Scott1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:39 amWhy didn’t he revert to SB gameplan for the first 15/20 minutes when we looked at our best?RagingBull wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:37 am For me on Wigglesworth
Clearly a good backs coach imo, before today our backs looked better than they had been.
But big game and missing some key players he reverted to Borthwick’s game plan which isn’t his game plan and it didn’t work.
That being said I also not really sure these results would’ve been any different with Borthwick as head coach either.
Forwards not got the depth anymore to survive the game plan he likes.
I think he panicked with saints keeping the scoreboard ticking due to penalties. (Some of which was from stupid players)
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Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Well I see we’re back in the ‘we’re all doomed’ scenario!
Nobody could have been more disappointed than me at yesterdays game. Shocking game, no atmosphere despite it being our best crowd of the season and just to top it off it was against Northampton!
I think WW will be furious with the performance, I don’t see how everything that was poor yesterday can be laid at his door. It was almost a perfect storm of circumstances that came together to make the game a big ask from the outset.
Personally I wouldn’t criticise anybody, no question that everybody gave everything they had on the day. But…
A set of forwards made up of young, inexperienced players and players returning from injury lacking match fitness. Consequently a lack of go forward, faltering set pieces and poor ruck speed.
A young scrum half in his first Prem start in arguably the biggest home game of the season. Had a decent game and shouldn’t be criticised at this stage of his career but the cohesion between 9 and 10 and with first up ball carriers wasn’t quite there.
Freddie full of emotion and playing his last game and possibly trying too hard. To many chip and chase kicks and looking to make breaks that weren’t there when there were better options.
Put it together and you get a disjointed performance which despite lots of huff and puff never managed to generate any meaningful momentum and consequently led to more kicking than was probably in the original game plan.
And before everybody says that Saints had the same issues with selection, it’s true they did and they were pretty poor as well but we lost by a point. As I say fine margins…..had we won by a point we would probably have all been saying ‘in the circumstances, take the win and move on’.
Nobody could have been more disappointed than me at yesterdays game. Shocking game, no atmosphere despite it being our best crowd of the season and just to top it off it was against Northampton!
I think WW will be furious with the performance, I don’t see how everything that was poor yesterday can be laid at his door. It was almost a perfect storm of circumstances that came together to make the game a big ask from the outset.
Personally I wouldn’t criticise anybody, no question that everybody gave everything they had on the day. But…
A set of forwards made up of young, inexperienced players and players returning from injury lacking match fitness. Consequently a lack of go forward, faltering set pieces and poor ruck speed.
A young scrum half in his first Prem start in arguably the biggest home game of the season. Had a decent game and shouldn’t be criticised at this stage of his career but the cohesion between 9 and 10 and with first up ball carriers wasn’t quite there.
Freddie full of emotion and playing his last game and possibly trying too hard. To many chip and chase kicks and looking to make breaks that weren’t there when there were better options.
Put it together and you get a disjointed performance which despite lots of huff and puff never managed to generate any meaningful momentum and consequently led to more kicking than was probably in the original game plan.
And before everybody says that Saints had the same issues with selection, it’s true they did and they were pretty poor as well but we lost by a point. As I say fine margins…..had we won by a point we would probably have all been saying ‘in the circumstances, take the win and move on’.
If you don't go in hard it's not a tackle it's an insult.
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
That’s how it looked to me tooRagingBull wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:45 amScott1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:39 amWhy didn’t he revert to SB gameplan for the first 15/20 minutes when we looked at our best?RagingBull wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:37 am For me on Wigglesworth
Clearly a good backs coach imo, before today our backs looked better than they had been.
But big game and missing some key players he reverted to Borthwick’s game plan which isn’t his game plan and it didn’t work.
That being said I also not really sure these results would’ve been any different with Borthwick as head coach either.
Forwards not got the depth anymore to survive the game plan he likes.
I think he panicked with saints keeping the scoreboard ticking due to penalties. (Some of which was from stupid players)
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
It felt like we had the game plan for players that were not on the pitch, or in some cases not at the club anymore. Add in some spiral bombs and a huge or fast winger and it could have been different. The most annoying thing is that we could have won that without too much difficulty. I don't know why we didn't attack them more. Even so, I think that team would have won more times than not playing that way. At home and to Saints we needed better.
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
Yes ,we have to get away from "X was away on international duty" or "y was young" or "z was injured " all the time! Saints were dire tbf and we were worse,but we definitely had enough out there to have won this game!Downsouth wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:52 am It felt like we had the game plan for players that were not on the pitch, or in some cases not at the club anymore. Add in some spiral bombs and a huge or fast winger and it could have been different. The most annoying thing is that we could have won that without too much difficulty. I don't know why we didn't attack them more. Even so, I think that team would have won more times than not playing that way. At home and to Saints we needed better.
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
That's the galling thing, Saints we're rubbish, we should have easily beaten them.
Re: Tigers v Saints (H) - Saturday 28th January 2023 - KO 14:00
I think that’s the worse I’ve seen us play at home since the season before last bearing in mind the opposition.
A2O