Ealing PRC game info

[TigerFeetSteve]

Article on our Website suggests you need to have played earlier in the competition to be eligible to play in the semi.

https://www.leicestertigers.com/news/lt ... r11-hudson

Not sure where injured players would sit in regards to this (I would suspect they may be eligible) but that would mean the following players are ineligible I think (of our senior squad):

Chessum O
Kata
Martin
Montoya
Reffell
Youngs

I may expect injured players to be available to play so JvP or Scott may be eligible?

Also if JvP may not be eligible/fit it may explain why we didn't put both Edwards and Allan in the squad vs Nottingham, as Whiteley is the only Senior squad scrum half who could be eligible, meaning one of Allan or Edwards may well have to play so they didn't risk them both...

I would guess also Pollard, Weise and Steward (not that I suspect they would play through selection and international duty). Watson and JVP would be interesting as out through injury at the time.

Thing is, if they could play and were nearing fitness, I suspect that England may want Martin and JVP to get some game time in next week as well as maybe Heyes

Missed Wiese and Steward off...

Watson may also be different as he wasn't at the time of the group stages a Tigers player...

That may mean he's ineligible or he may be eligible, really not sure...

[AViewFromLe2]

An interesting selection this as obviously there is silverware up for grabs, but just as importantly is the focus on development and bringing young lads through. Whilst we have done a good job with the likes of Martin, JVP and Steward amongst others, we have not been as successful since. So I do think we need to give that some focus for this game, and Ealing are a perfect team to get some younger guys in. Ultimately we need to see if they are capable of being first team regulars, and if they can't do it against Ealing then it is tough to see how they can in the Premiership.

As a result, I've tweaked my original draft of last week and gone with this. I think it's a good balance between getting youth in, especially around the older Development lads who are on the fringes of the first team, as well as the older and more senior guys. I do think this team is good enough to get a win.

Whitcombe, Vanes, Heyes, Wells, Lewis Chessum, Rogerson, Illione, Hatherall, Whitely, Shillcock, OHC, Woodward, Porter, Bassett, Gourlay

Bench - FTT, Van Der Flier, Richardson, Carter, Josh Manz, Edwards, Wilkinson, Myall

We may get Carnduff back from England under 20's. If we do, I would start him over Rogerson, and move Rogerson to the bench. Same goes with JVP, but I'm not convinced we will get him back tbh.

[Rugbygramps]

Totally agree get the balance right, but a win is uppermost imo.
Ealing will come flying out of the gates and will be match sharp, so the starting 15 will need to be able to withstand that.

[AViewFromLe2]

I'm not sure a win is of the most importance personally. Getting youngsters into the first team set up takes priority for me. Nevertheless that starting 15 and 23 is good enough to get the win.

[RunTigerRun]

For me knowing the eligibility I’d now go:

Shillcock
Bassett
Porter/Myall?
Woodward
OHC
Wilkinson
Edwards
Rogerson
Ilione
Carnduff?
Chessum L
Carter
Richardson/Heyes?
Vanes
Whitcombe

FTT
Van Wyk/ van der flier?
Heyes / Hoyt?
Wells
Koroiyadi/Cracknell?
Edwards/JVP?
Pollard
Gourlay

[Rugbygramps]

Just as a point of reference the team that beat Falcons at home in the pool stages was

Brown
Bassett
Porter
Kelly
OHC
Atkinson
Powell
Van Wyk
Clare
Heyes
Henderson
Wells
Liebenberg
Cracknell
Rogerson

Bench - Dolly, Whitcombe, Hurd, Williams, Hatherall, Whitely, Shilcock, Cocanasinga

Sale side was similar but with Ilione, Carter, Manz, and Pollard in there

I fully respect people saying play the youngsters, but that is what games like the Nottingham one are for, this is one of 3 pieces of Silverware and we should play our strongest possible side, given that if we loose no more games till March 22nd.

Given that I was unaware that players had to have played in the pool stages I would revise my team to

Brown, Bassett, Porter, Kelly, OHC, Shilcock, Whitely, Whitcombe, Vanes, Heyes, Wells, Hatherall, Liebenberg, Ilione, Rogerson

FTT, Van Wyk, Richardson, Carter, Cracknell, Edwards, Pollard, Cocanasinga

[AViewFromLe2]

Just as a point of reference the team that beat Falcons at home in the pool stages was

Brown
Bassett
Porter
Kelly
OHC
Atkinson
Powell
Van Wyk
Clare
Heyes
Henderson
Wells
Liebenberg
Cracknell
Rogerson

Bench - Dolly, Whitcombe, Hurd, Williams, Hatherall, Whitely, Shilcock, Cocanasinga

Sale side was similar but with Ilione, Carter, Manz, and Pollard in there

I fully respect people saying play the youngsters, but that is what games like the Nottingham one are for, this is one of 3 pieces of Silverware and we should play our strongest possible side, given that if we loose no more games till March 22nd.

Given that I was unaware that players had to have played in the pool stages I would revise my team to

Brown, Bassett, Porter, Kelly, OHC, Shilcock, Whitely, Whitcombe, Vanes, Heyes, Wells, Hatherall, Liebenberg, Ilione, Rogerson

FTT, Van Wyk, Richardson, Carter, Cracknell, Edwards, Pollard, Cocanasinga

Tbh both the team that I have put and RunTigerRun has put forward, only have a minority of youngsters. Mine had only 9 of the 23 from the Development Squad, RunTigerRun similar numbers. Neither of us are advocating going really young, both have selected the more senior youngsters.

We also need to play the more senior Development boys to find out where they are at as it impacts our recruitment for this summer and the future.

For example the rumours are that both Van Wyk and Cronin are leaving this summer, so do we need one or two LH's? Well this is the game to find out where Whitcombe and Van Der Flier are at, because if Van Der Flier does very well, we may feel that he is first team ready and only need to sign one LH. If he goes badly then we know we need two. We won't find that out by not playing him and playing Van Wyk instead - we learn nothing.

Same with Lewis Chessum, Joseph Woodward and Elliott Gourlay. These are the more senior Development Squad members that the club is going to have to make a call on how good they are. The club learns nothing by not playing them in this game and just playing a senior team. This is the game to get these players playing, but around more senior players to find out. We learn nothing by playing Dan Kelly, but we learn plenty by playing Woodward.

[Rugbygramps]

Going to be an interesting announcement on Friday either way

[GB72]

I guess I agree with that in that if we have players who we expect to step up to the first team squad in the near future then they should at this stage be able to compete with the players in a championship side. To see their best, their needs to be some experience around them to simulate the sort of situation that they may have to play in and so I would be happy with less a less experienced front row player in with some of the first team, one lock from the development team, one or two in the back row, one in the centers and one or two in the back 3. I think we need our best scrum half and fly half so as the younger players can show what they can do with the sort of service they would get in the first team. I would also like to see Brown at full back to be the experienced head that can help the younger players mentally on the pitch.

[RunTigerRun]

Just as a point of reference the team that beat Falcons at home in the pool stages was

Brown
Bassett
Porter
Kelly
OHC
Atkinson
Powell
Van Wyk
Clare
Heyes
Henderson
Wells
Liebenberg
Cracknell
Rogerson

Bench - Dolly, Whitcombe, Hurd, Williams, Hatherall, Whitely, Shilcock, Cocanasinga

Sale side was similar but with Ilione, Carter, Manz, and Pollard in there

I fully respect people saying play the youngsters, but that is what games like the Nottingham one are for, this is one of 3 pieces of Silverware and we should play our strongest possible side, given that if we loose no more games till March 22nd.

Given that I was unaware that players had to have played in the pool stages I would revise my team to

Brown, Bassett, Porter, Kelly, OHC, Shilcock, Whitely, Whitcombe, Vanes, Heyes, Wells, Hatherall, Liebenberg, Ilione, Rogerson

FTT, Van Wyk, Richardson, Carter, Cracknell, Edwards, Pollard, Cocanasinga

Tbh both the team that I have put and RunTigerRun has put forward, only have a minority of youngsters. Mine had only 9 of the 23 from the Development Squad, RunTigerRun similar numbers. Neither of us are advocating going really young, both have selected the more senior youngsters.

We also need to play the more senior Development boys to find out where they are at as it impacts our recruitment for this summer and the future.

For example the rumours are that both Van Wyk and Cronin are leaving this summer, so do we need one or two LH's? Well this is the game to find out where Whitcombe and Van Der Flier are at, because if Van Der Flier does very well, we may feel that he is first team ready and only need to sign one LH. If he goes badly then we know we need two. We won't find that out by not playing him and playing Van Wyk instead - we learn nothing.

Same with Lewis Chessum, Joseph Woodward and Elliott Gourlay. These are the more senior Development Squad members that the club is going to have to make a call on how good they are. The club learns nothing by not playing them in this game and just playing a senior team. This is the game to get these players playing, but around more senior players to find out. We learn nothing by playing Dan Kelly, but we learn plenty by playing Woodward.

Exactly my thinking. These are the perfect opportunities to see the top senior academy guys play in teams with experience around them. Yes silverware is on offer and it would be great to get it, but if we lose the match but come away from it knowing the likes of Woodward, Carnduff, Gourlay, Chessum, van der flier, Vanes, Myall, FTT etc. can compete and aren’t rabbits in headlights then it’s a huge positive for recruitment moving forwards. If we lose and find they aren’t quite ready then we also learn so much about them.

Guys like Woodward, van der flier and Ilione have played champ rugby regularly this season so have some exposure. The others probably Nat 1 so we are assessing if they can make that next step up. We still have time before Gloucester to get the main squad ready if we don’t get the result.

If we weren’t going to play the likes of Woodward or Myall vs Ealing then they’d have played vs Notts, imo.

There’s still enough senior players in there to help guide and to push if we need to, but I don’t see how the youngsters learn if they aren’t in amongst the senior guys to see if they can step up.

[AViewFromLe2]

The one thing I would say is that this is the game we can take a view on those development players. If we get to the final, our opposition would be a fellow Premiership side, so you would be more justified in going with more senior players at that point.

[Rugbygramps]

It’s a fair point but as you’ve said a number of them are already playing Championship rugby so what is going to be learnt from playing another championship side? As those playing Nat 1 get them championship experience in a game with nothing riding on it.

Arguments to be made for both policies, and as usual the selection will be somewhere between the 2

[AViewFromLe2]

It’s a fair point but as you’ve said a number of them are already playing Championship rugby so what is going to be learnt from playing another championship side? As those playing Nat 1 get them championship experience in a game with nothing riding on it.

Arguments to be made for both policies, and as usual the selection will be somewhere between the 2

To answer that question, I'd argue that when they are on loan they are playing under the systems of that club they are on loan to. Whilst we have tie in with Nottingham and will try to send our lads on loan to a club similar to us, those systems or approaches are still likely to be different to how we set up. So this is A) an opportunity to get them into men's rugby against probably the best Championship side, and B) an opportunity for our coaches to see first hand how they get on under our systems and our calls and with our players.

[Tigerbeat]

I think that Tigers should show some respect to Ealing and the competition and send a strong team. There is Silverware available and if we were to lose, no further competitive games until Gloucester on 22nd March.

[AViewFromLe2]

I think that Tigers should show some respect to Ealing and the competition and send a strong team. There is Silverware available and if we were to lose, no further competitive games until Gloucester on 22nd March.

I'm struggling to see how playing some of our best Development players is being disrespectful.

In any case Chessum, Illione and Woodward are all previous England under 20's - Illione and Chessum were captains. If Carnduff plays, he is the current Under 20's Captain. These aren't mugs, they are our best prospects and they have to play at some point otherwise why have Development players?

Not only that, neither the team that I or RunTigerRun have advocated for, could be described as being weak. The majority are senior players, with some Internationals thrown in.