LEICESTER TIGERS 2022/23 Squad and transfers thread part 2: The Lion, the Wig and the Wardrobe

[RagingBull]

Browning is still here as well I believe RB?

Hamer-Webb would be a good addition. Frankie Sleightholme I wouldn't mind a punt on but with Browning and Cusick we have two dev squad wings already.

I think the academy cap would currently only have FTT and Miell in it, presuming that Cokanasiga is over the minimum salary. So there could be room there for a development winger such as Sleightholme.

If we wanted a more experienced winger to free Kata up for the centres then Purdy and Skosan are both unattached.

Re depth at 9, I thought Nordli-Kelemeti at Falcons looked talented in 2021/22 then he struggled with injuries last season. I'd prefer Maunder for a one year deal but honestly feel Nordli-Kelemeti has more potential than Whiteley.

Browning for me needs to prove himself in the Prem cup before being viewed as a 1st team option.
Sounds of it he did better v Saints end of last season.

Cusick IMO is still more a 13 in the making it's where he's played most of his rugby, but feel for this season he will be looked at more a Wing option hence why I would like another wing option.

I think Cokanasiga needs to have a good season otherwise I reckon Cusick will take his spot at 13 and Woodward will take his spot at 12.

In terms of Dev I just want whoever is good enough and fits the cap rather than who we have available already.

[Rugbygramps]

Agree with RB about the tight head situation.
IMO Heyes needs to develop more over next season or we need to look at signing a world class tight head for the 24/25 season.
He has been on the edge of first team starter for a few seasons now and should have over taken Cole. However he is still behind Cole at both club and test level.
Dan will be 37 next May so this may well be his last season and we need a better progression than currently in place

[Scott1]

Heyes was superb season before last,don't know the exact stats but it feels like he shared the season with Cole and it was nip and tuck. He didn't seem to kick on last season at all

[FrontRowUnionMember]

I think this season will be Heyes major breakthrough when he confirms himself as outright starter over Cole, Dan passing over the torch. I do agree TH looks slightly weaker than LH in terms of depth. Cole & Heyes are better than/equal to Cronin & West (last year) / Cronin & Fisichetti? (this year fingers crossed), but I feel Whitcombe is more advanced than Hurd, then Van Wyk more experience over Richardson, but let’s see what McKellar, Palmer and Fowkes can do for us.

Some of the LI players seem to have been announced in batches, maybe this week, assuming we will announce the final shaping/additions of our squad, perhaps we have a few up our sleeves.
Fisichetti, Rogerson/Basham, Brooke and maybe an outside back, would be a nice little pickup to really round out or squad, assuming we have Wilkinson lined up also.

[Rugbygramps]

I think this season will be Heyes major breakthrough when he confirms himself as outright starter over Cole, Dan passing over the torch. I do agree TH looks slightly weaker than LH in terms of depth. Cole & Heyes are better than/equal to Cronin & West (last year) / Cronin & Fisichetti? (this year fingers crossed), but I feel Whitcombe is more advanced than Hurd, then Van Wyk more experience over Richardson, but let’s see what McKellar, Palmer and Fowkes can do for us.

Some of the LI players seem to have been announced in batches, maybe this week, assuming we will announce the final shaping/additions of our squad, perhaps we have a few up our sleeves.
Fisichetti, Rogerson/Basham, Brooke and maybe an outside back, would be a nice little pickup to really round out or squad, assuming we have Wilkinson lined up also.

I hope you’re right because that Heyes major breakthrough season has been supposed to be happening for the last 2 seasons and hasn’t.
Don’t eat me wrong he is a fine player but he needs to make that step up if major investment isn’t required

[FrontRowUnionMember]

Has Juan Martin Gonzalez been picked up by anyone yet?

[Wayne Richardson Fan Club]

Has Juan Martin Gonzalez been picked up by anyone yet?

Suggest he might bust most clubs salary cap, the young Argentine hooker LI signed last season is another excellent player unattached, unless I have missed him being picked up.

[markharbtiger]

Rory Sutherland being linked to Biarritz
If true and if the rumour of us signing a capped NH LH are true suggest that we have picked up the Fischetti(HOPEFULLY)

With realistic 1st team options
1. Fischetti(?), Cronin, Whitcombe, Van Wyk,
2. Montoya, Dolly, Clare, Vanes,
3. Cole, Heyes, Hurd, Richardson,
4. Martin, Henderson, Wells, Manz
5. Chessum, Carter, Chessum, Carmicheal
6. Liebenberg, Rogerson(?), Carnduff
7. Reffell, Cracknell, Ilione
8. Wiese, Hatherell
9. JVP, Youngs, Whitetely, Edwards
10. Pollard, Atkinson, Wilkinson (?)
11. OHC, Simmons, Cusick
12. Kelly, Kata, Woodward
13. Porter, Scott, Cokanasiga,
14. Watson (?), Bassett,
15, Steward, Shillcock, Brown, Walsh

Pretty damn good squad IMO looks stronger all round squad than last season.
I would like to potentially add
Joe Powell on a short term contract during RWC - He knows McKeller and was big part of his squad, maybe a short term deal and see him go back to Aus come decemeber ala Nadolo. Potentially Jack Maunder and Chris cook on a trial signing as well a option
Josh Basham but would be between him and Rogerson and Rogerson leadership would be very big IMO.
Gabriel Hamer-Webb just feel another winger would be a good thing he has high upside but shouldn't be costly
If rumours are true and we are looking for short term lock Will Spencer or Greg Peterson would be good options.

Then some dev players I like
Ollie Allan - Mentioned previously
Lucas Brooke - Same as above
Joe Vajner - Another interesting Hooker prospect, could argue if we need another with potentially Clarke also in the U18. But especially tight 5 I feel you can't have too many as long as in the dev cap.
Monty Bradbury - IMO is a better 15 potentially if Walsh is viewed as leaving could be a good pick up
Frankie Slightholme - Looks promising winger not many coming through


Looking longer term TH is a slight issue for me
Cole and Heyes are fine but Hurd/Richardson/Hoyt do need to start showing promise as long term options. If none of them do anything during the prem cup TH needs to become a priority for the season after I feel.

RagingBull: Great job! I bow to your insight and analysis! The club ought to be paying you a fee for scouting reports (or maybe they are?)

[johnthegriff]

Joe Heyes is still young for a prop particularly tighthead. In my opinion props reach their potential at about 28. Here's and Hurd have a way to go. I have been impressed by Hoyt at under 20 level, I think he will make the step up but it is a little early to be sure.

[Rugbygramps]

Joe Heyes is still young for a prop particularly tighthead. In my opinion props reach their potential at about 28. Here's and Hurd have a way to go. I have been impressed by Hoyt at under 20 level, I think he will make the step up but it is a little early to be sure.

Agree to disagree Heyes has been there or there about for at least 2 seasons. He is now 24 and should have kicked on by now with all the players coaches he has had to learn from.
As I say he is a very good player but he has had enough chances and the really good props are well into their test career by the time they’re 28

[Scott1]

Heyes had one off season last one,a very good one before that,where he was still very good at times and the obituaries are being written!

[AViewFromLe2]

Nothing wrong with Joe Heyes' development. He's 24, played over 100 games for Tigers and is England's 3rd or 4th best TH. The reality is that when Cole goes off, our scrum does not worsen in quality on that side of the scrum - that shows that he's up there with Cole in terms of his ability.

Out of all those games, there's not may where he's struggled, Ospreys away in the Champions Cup last season is the obvious one - but there really is not much more that springs to mind.

Secondly, he starts on the bench so much because Steve & then Wiggy believed that Cole could only play when starting - the stats showed that they did not get much impact out of Cole when he came off the bench. As a result, to get a Cole & Heyes combination, they had to have Cole starting.

And finally, Cole has been the best TH in the league over the last 12 months, hence his recall for England. All that shows is how good Coley is, rather than Heyes not being good enough.

Fundamentally, Heyes' development is going fine, he will keep getting better which is great news for us. Does it matter if he doesn't become England's number 1 TH or a world class TH? No, not really. Hanro is not an international, but i don't see many people calling for him to be dropped any time soon.

[Rugbygramps]

I’m not calling for him to be dropped. You say Heyes is gradually improving maybe that improvement is too gradual. The top class props are capped multiple times by his age and he should have been helped by injuries to Stewart and Sinclair drop in form, yet a 36 year old has kept him off the England bench.
Tigers have a history of high class tight head props, Heyes is very good I just don’t think he’s at that level yet. If he does mature when he’s 28 that’s 4 years maturing to do.

Like many clubs there is a tendency towards rose tinted glasses for our players just IMO

Oh the point about Hanro not being capped is to do with circumstances other than his ability.

[AViewFromLe2]

I’m not calling for him to be dropped. You say Heyes is gradually improving maybe that improvement is too gradual. The top class props are capped multiple times by his age and he should have been helped by injuries to Stewart and Sinclair drop in form, yet a 36 year old has kept him off the England bench.
Tigers have a history of high class tight head props, Heyes is very good I just don’t think he’s at that level yet. If he does mature when he’s 28 that’s 4 years maturing to do.

Like many clubs there is a tendency towards rose tinted glasses for our players just IMO

Oh the point about Hanro not being capped is to do with circumstances other than his ability.

It wasn't just a 36 year old that kept him off the bench though was it? It was the best TH in the country that was on the bench ahead of him. Same reason why he didn't get as many starts as he would have wanted - Coley has been the best TH in the country and he's having to compete against him. Just because he didn't get as many starts does it mean that he's not breaking through quick enough or that he's not good enough. Like i say, every time he comes on, his side of the scrum shows zero dip in quality - that shows his ability is equal to Cole. We're blessed that we have two top quality options at TH, every other side in the league would like to have a Cole/Heyes combination.

There's also no circumstances stopping Hanro being picked for SA - he's available should they want him.Having people like Hanro and Heyes who are on the border of being International quality is a blessing. There is no issue if Heyes does not become a world class prop - he's still good enough to be a starter for us.

[Rugbygramps]

I’m not calling for him to be dropped. You say Heyes is gradually improving maybe that improvement is too gradual. The top class props are capped multiple times by his age and he should have been helped by injuries to Stewart and Sinclair drop in form, yet a 36 year old has kept him off the England bench.
Tigers have a history of high class tight head props, Heyes is very good I just don’t think he’s at that level yet. If he does mature when he’s 28 that’s 4 years maturing to do.

Like many clubs there is a tendency towards rose tinted glasses for our players just IMO

Oh the point about Hanro not being capped is to do with circumstances other than his ability.

It wasn't just a 36 year old that kept him off the bench though was it? It was the best TH in the country that was on the bench ahead of him. Same reason why he didn't get as many starts as he would have wanted - Coley has been the best TH in the country and he's having to compete against him. Just because he didn't get as many starts does it mean that he's not breaking through quick enough or that he's not good enough. Like i say, every time he comes on, his side of the scrum shows zero dip in quality - that shows his ability is equal to Cole. We're blessed that we have two top quality options at TH, every other side in the league would like to have a Cole/Heyes combination.

There's also no circumstances stopping Hanro being picked for SA - he's available should they want him.Having people like Hanro and Heyes who are on the border of being International quality is a blessing. There is no issue if Heyes does not become a world class prop - he's still good enough to be a starter for us.

Agree to disagree Heyes is a fine player. IMO he should be further ahead than he is especially as you point out he has played 100 games. Have you seen the quality SA have at blindside btw.
You have your opinion I have mine and there will always be counter arguments such as if he is coming on as replacement he will be against either a tiring or replacement prop.
Difference of opinion is what makes forums interesting