Postiger2 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:44 pm
Another game killed stone dead by a red card
We were the better team for the majority of the time when we had 15...
Yep - we were in the game with 15 but not with 14 for 40mins against the best team in the league.
I do worry for next season, we’ve lost Wiese and unless we sign some top end players (which isn’t the case by all accounts) I think we’ll be worse in September which puts in perspective where we are compared to Saints and others.
The lack of fitness is also noticeable - with Aled I always felt if it was tight with 20mins to go we’d win due to our superior conditioning. Half our players are out of breath after 45mins.
Hope I’m wrong for the next year and even if not I hope it’s one step back to go two forward but this season has been a tough old slog and realistically down to a real lack of quality ball in hand.
Im not surprised our players looked knackered, we arrived in our seats 45 mins before KO, our forwards were already going hell for leather into each other, tackle bags and scrummaging, the backs were flogging themselves, we were going too hard, they played an extra half in that warm up.
By the way Ben Youngs looked so out of condition when he came on, he also kicked ball away when we were a man down, why give the ball back to them?
Saints backs looked like express trains, ours looked like cart horses. Very very disappointed by that performance today, Steward really looked unhappy on the wing, but my you have to admire the speed of Saints backs and their superb off loading.
I think we need to move the coach on , it is obvious that he can’t get anything out of the team , and the fact his game plans our woeful .
In saying that the club needs to clean out the dead wood , there’s a lot of players who don’t seem to put in , and I know that our two half’s are internationals but they don’t seem to add anything in attack come parted to other top teams half’s .
On yesterday’s game how the hell do we get caught down a short blind so often ,
On the ref , he was as one sided as anyone could see , and watching the game I fear for the game’s existence the TMO and these rules are killing the game , the high shot on chessum was more him running into defender, and Kata hit him on the chest , yes his head hit him but it was after the tackle it was a accident, everything above is just my thoughts , on a very poor season
I said nothing for fear of being called miserable but I thought the coaches beneath DMK were not top notch when they were announced - ie Dickens and the fitness guy. I know it’s hard to compare with Aled, but he’s so far off and we similarly look so far off.
I also feel we recruited poorly when the 3 clubs went under. I appreciate it’s not a straightforward situation to deal with.
And we’ve been v poorly served the injuries to Gorgeous George following international matches. I hope he gets the summer off.
I don’t think we should exit DMK. Consistency and stability and letting people build are key. I hope we do the same with him.
Got to be honest but that we pretty much what I expected. I took Saints -18.5 at 10/3 pre-game and thought there was a chance they could have won by 30+. We battled and put in a decent first-half, but it was always a case of ‘when’ not ‘if’ Saints would pull away. They are in form, have confidence and a very credible game plan. We went into that more rested, but I’m not sure the week off did us any favours. Then again, I don’t think a month off would have made a lot of difference.
I’d like to talk about our wingers. Austin picked out OHC on the broadcast a number of times. Lack of effort and unwillingness to try and secure a turnover in the second half were exactly right. When things are going well and you are on the front foot OHC seems an asset, but yesterday he just wasn’t. Poor.
As for Steward, he needs a re-boot. No one denies he is awesome in the air but his criminal lack of pace and inability to use his size to get over the gain-line is painful. He should be an absolute weapon in terms of yards after contact. He’s rightly lost his England place in the last 3 months and yesterday he seemed pretty anonymous. Not what you’d expect from a player with such a high pedigree. That said, greedy Shillcock didn’t help by not gifting him a try in the corner early doors.
I think the league table is about right. We are 7th/8th best team in the league this year. Painful to say but Saints have been the best, especially this year.
Goshengareth wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:34 am
I said nothing for fear of being called miserable but I thought the coaches beneath DMK were not top notch when they were announced - ie Dickens and the fitness guy. I know it’s hard to compare with Aled, but he’s so far off and we similarly look so far off.
I also feel we recruited poorly when the 3 clubs went under. I appreciate it’s not a straightforward situation to deal with.
And we’ve been v poorly served the injuries to Gorgeous George following international matches. I hope he gets the summer off.
I don’t think we should exit DMK. Consistency and stability and letting people build are key. I hope we do the same with him.
I totally agree we and that is precisely why we are where we are in then table and the competition has moved on and we are still kicking the ball away for fun..
Without hope we are nothing, keep the faith, a Tiger for eternity
I cannot think of any club above Tigers that have gone through so much change or disruptions in the last few years. Other clubs have coaches who have been in place and had time with the players. Losing half your coaches mid season was not great.
It is going to take time and a World Cup season was always going to be a challenge, with a reduced salary cap.
Tigerbeat wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 8:36 am
I cannot think of any club above Tigers that have gone through so much change or disruptions in the last few years. Other clubs have coaches who have been in place and had time with the players. Losing half your coaches mid season was not great.
It is going to take time and a World Cup season was always going to be a challenge, with a reduced salary cap.
Yes and all we hear on TV etc is how clubs such as Exeter are in 'a transition', excuse me, please define transition? Isn't a complete change in coaching staff exactly that?
RagingBull wrote: ↑Thu Apr 18, 2024 10:18 am
Honestly Kicking is prob our best chance of beating Saints.
But obviously the kicking needs to be spot on and the chase needs to be great.
Steward v Hendy in the air I feel would net us positive yardage.
You don't play in your own half against a team like Saints.
My biggest worry is how good Saints are with first phase ball off set pieces and how vulnerable we have been too them
Given the season so far, the Saints first phase will slice and dice the Tigers. The Tigers will be in it for the 80 but errors like those in Dublin will get punished very quickly. If the Tigers back row are at full strength then maybe the Saints can be slowed down. I wish Ford was still there to manage the game for the Tigers.
Managed it well for 40mins. Cards cost heavily leading to the slice and dice. Plenty of top talent out there in a Tigers shirt, makes me now wonder what on earth the coaching staff are actually trying to do. Deja vu of seasons past. Is Pat Howard available!!
Whoever said "one person cannot change the world' never ate undercooked bat
Those that want McKellar gone, have you thought of the implications of that ? We’d have to pay him off for starters, then who would we get in ? Then that coach would want a new coaching set up and his players and round we go again. After Murphy and Borthwick, is that what we want ?
I get losing isn’t great, especially to Saints, but regardless of the end result we were right in that game until the red card. We’re not the first team to get pulled apart by Vesty’s attack. Accusations of players giving up are a) not helpful and b) not right. It’s already been said, finish those two chances and we’d have been further ahead. Small margins.
Tigers have had 7 head coaches in 7 years since Cockers left
Cockers
Mauger
MOC
Murphy
Borthwick
Wigglesworth
McKeller
So don't blame people for wanting a new coach already they don't know any different really. The fact people still cry for Howard shows how weak our attack has been for ages.
I don't know if McKeller is good enough, on current showing maybe not. I don't think he has been given a fair crack at it yet though. So unless someone big is available right now and is wanting to come I feel it's really pointless sacking him. But if I was the club I would be announcing a new attack coach quickly.
RagingBull wrote: ↑Thu Apr 18, 2024 10:18 am
Honestly Kicking is prob our best chance of beating Saints.
But obviously the kicking needs to be spot on and the chase needs to be great.
Steward v Hendy in the air I feel would net us positive yardage.
You don't play in your own half against a team like Saints.
My biggest worry is how good Saints are with first phase ball off set pieces and how vulnerable we have been too them
Given the season so far, the Saints first phase will slice and dice the Tigers. The Tigers will be in it for the 80 but errors like those in Dublin will get punished very quickly. If the Tigers back row are at full strength then maybe the Saints can be slowed down. I wish Ford was still there to manage the game for the Tigers.
Managed it well for 40mins. Cards cost heavily leading to the slice and dice. Plenty of top talent out there in a Tigers shirt, makes me now wonder what on earth the coaching staff are actually trying to do. Deja vu of seasons past. Is Pat Howard available!!
TBF I don't think we practiced how to get cards on the training field. What went on in Kata's mind I have no idea? Maybe he thought he was getting subbed off soon so therefore put in one last big hit? so dumb
Apologies in advance if what I am about to say upsets anyone. I have heard management and coaches say things like "keeping the Tigers DNA" in how we play....strong scrum, powerful forwards, driving mauls. In fact I think AP even said DMK was hired partly because he would keep this "Tigers way". I can't remember when we had a dominant scum in a match and I think all teams have developed forward play to match Tigers. It just doesn't work anymore and other teams have developed very efficient attacking play. Even Sarries and Exeter have moved on in style.
I think we need to stop the talk of the "Tigers DNA" because it doesn't work and whilst ever we plough that furrow we won't get the fast attacking play with forwards/backs interplay we now see with other teams and it will block progress. We have heard talk of developing the attacking game, and seen flickers of it, but for me Tigers are falling between 2 stools at the moment. Its as if the players on the pitch are confused.
Someone earlier said similar, make the switch now and build for next season. And give DMK some more time in a more settled period.
