LEICESTER TIGERS 2023/24 - KANGAROO MCKELLER: Do you come from a land down under? (Squad thread pt 2)

[kpj tiger]

Just spit balling but if Jordie Barrett has signed for Leinster that probably spells the end for Charlie Ngatai, he is 33 so he may well hang up his boots but he could be a good shorter term punt to fill one of those center shirts

[Rugbygramps]

Barrett only going to be there for 5 months so he will be interesting to see what role he plays.
Ngatai seems to be a little down their pecking order

[sam16111986]

Barrett only going to be there for 5 months so he will be interesting to see what role he plays.
Ngatai seems to be a little down their pecking order

He's been injured. Normally a go to during international windows but didn't play at all during the 6N which is the giveaway. With Osbourne coming through well he might be seen as no longer required. Ngatai is now 33 so somewhat winding down.

Jordie Barrett I presume is joining in December then playing through to the end of the season in May. Get a good six months out of him before he goes back to NZ for the summer internationals and half a season of Super Rugby.

Some rumours that the IRFU are putting pressure on Frawley to move up to Ulster for next season so that he gets more starts and more game time at 10. As he's a utility back currently for club (started at 10/12/13/15 last season for Leinster) and country but refining his playmaking skills would provide Ireland with the near perfect 23 option in a 6-2 bench split. As well as helping out Ulster who are scratching around for a 10 whilst Leinster have both Byrnes and Pendergast piling up.

[Rugbygramps]

Thanks Sam. Yes it would appear that Barrett will be missing the super rugby season with the Canes.
Interesting what you say about Frawley and yet our Irish friends insist there is no interference from their Union

[sam16111986]

Thanks Sam. Yes it would appear that Barrett will be missing the super rugby season with the Canes.
Interesting what you say about Frawley and yet our Irish friends insist there is no interference from their Union

When central contracts are involved there's always going to be an element of interference. Frawley is a talented and very versatile player, he's unlikely to command a starting spot in the Irish or Leinster teams but as a squad member is pretty much ideal. Would make sense if he's on a central contract that the IRFU will want him to be getting regular game time to justify it.

[Wayne Richardson Fan Club]

Just spit balling but if Jordie Barrett has signed for Leinster that probably spells the end for Charlie Ngatai, he is 33 so he may well hang up his boots but he could be a good shorter term punt to fill one of those center shirts

Ngatai is an excellent player, but frequently injured, think he alsk had a concussion issues earlier in his career, he was good enough to play for the ABs but was coming through at just the wrong time along with his inquiries...

[Rugbygramps]

Big fan of Ngatai not only powerful but great hands and a kicking game too. Just saying he hasn’t been selected obviously through injury which means that Leinster have gone down another route

[kpj tiger]

RIL saying Connaught are close to signing Piers O'Connor from Bristol, not sure if that makes the Kelly to Munster rumour more or less realistic

[sam16111986]

RIL saying Connaught are close to signing Piers O'Connor from Bristol, not sure if that makes the Kelly to Munster rumour more or less realistic

Less. Tom Farrell at Connaught has been linked with Munster.

[Tigersunited]

Yes, excellent points, and your opinion. Mine is different, I don’t have confidence at this point, happy to be proved wrong. my opinion is that finishing in the second tier of Europe, with this squad would be dire, especially compared to the fantastic job Wiggy did, retiring, taking his first head coach job and leading us to 3rd.

However unless they go for the revamp to the Champions Cup where the prem drops to 5 teams (not heard any whispers of that simce August so highly unlikely to happen for next season) then 8 teams qualify for the Champions Cup. i.e. we stay in the top tier of Europe unless we drop behind Gloucester.

If people are going to be hyper-critical of others, they should probably make more of an effort to avoid making mistakes of their own. Glass houses and all that...

If McKellar should be sacked after 8 wins in 14, then I assume Lam, Sanderson, Baxter, Matson, McCall and Van Graan should be sacked too?

This idea that Head Coaches should be sacked based on previous results is not the whole picture - they should be assessed on what their future results are likely to be, and previous results is just one part of that. You don't sack a Head Coach to change results that have already happened, you sack him to improve future results.

There is plenty to suggest that next season, without a World Cup and with an attack coach, results will be better.

To be equal second on wins so far, and have the best defence in the league, is not what I would call "dire".

Why I would call dire is what I mentioned before, and that was projecting to the end of the season and not now - if we win the next 4, great, if we are 6th or below with this squad I am calling it dire. My opinion, not asking anyone to agree, and if DM wins trophies i will gladly eat my words and say I was wrong……

[johnthegriff]

Where ever we finish this season I would be amazed if McKellar was sacked before being given time to show what he can do. Success is not an overnight thing, where there is overnight success is usually when the previous incumbent was actually better than thought and impatient Directors lacked the patience to see good work come to fruition. Deano's team had aged and needed a rebuild he was not given time. McKellar has taken over a squad with a blend of youth and age but not necessarily with all the skills he requires for his brand of rugby. Next season there will be a full.pre season with the majority of the players. There may or may not be additions to the coaching staff and of course possible new signings. We may not win a trophy this year or next but we will want to see clear signs of progress, for me success is finishing top two and a couple more young players establishing themselves in the team.

[TTRITH]

Where ever we finish this season I would be amazed if McKellar was sacked before being given time to show what he can do. Success is not an overnight thing, where there is overnight success is usually when the previous incumbent was actually better than thought and impatient Directors lacked the patience to see good work come to fruition. Deano's team had aged and needed a rebuild he was not given time. McKellar has taken over a squad with a blend of youth and age but not necessarily with all the skills he requires for his brand of rugby. Next season there will be a full.pre season with the majority of the players. There may or may not be additions to the coaching staff and of course possible new signings. We may not win a trophy this year or next but we will want to see clear signs of progress, for me success is finishing top two and a couple more young players establishing themselves in the team.

Loffreda was sacked after two finals, and after a world cup year.

I don't think I see much difference between the two situations, except Loffreda arguably did better.

I don't want McKellar sacked, I think the issues around Dickens has caused issues within both the squad and the game plans, but I'm not sure I'd be surprised if he was sacked. Let us not forget, albeit there were extenuating circumstances, O'Connor was sacked after one game.

I wouldn't blame Andrea for wanting to bring someone else in, assuming they've got a plan in place, but if we're going to replace McKellar it has to be immediately at the end of the season with the new coaching set up in place almost immediately.

[AViewFromLe2]

We won't be sacking McKellar. You also don't let McKellar sign players for next season, then sack him at the end of this season, that is beyond absurd.

For all the noise about McKellar, from the Quins game at home onwards, we have played 10 games in the league and have won 7. A 70% win percentage historically gets you into the top 4 and in some years is good enough for top 2.

As Raging Bull has stated previously, we were second most affected team by the World Cup, and that wasn't including JvP being injured by England. Include that, and we were the joint most affected team from the World Cup.

This is why context is key, as is patience.

[Rugbygramps]

Where ever we finish this season I would be amazed if McKellar was sacked before being given time to show what he can do. Success is not an overnight thing, where there is overnight success is usually when the previous incumbent was actually better than thought and impatient Directors lacked the patience to see good work come to fruition. Deano's team had aged and needed a rebuild he was not given time. McKellar has taken over a squad with a blend of youth and age but not necessarily with all the skills he requires for his brand of rugby. Next season there will be a full.pre season with the majority of the players. There may or may not be additions to the coaching staff and of course possible new signings. We may not win a trophy this year or next but we will want to see clear signs of progress, for me success is finishing top two and a couple more young players establishing themselves in the team.

Loffreda was sacked after two finals, and after a world cup year.

I don't think I see much difference between the two situations, except Loffreda arguably did better.

I don't want McKellar sacked, I think the issues around Dickens has caused issues within both the squad and the game plans, but I'm not sure I'd be surprised if he was sacked. Let us not forget, albeit there were extenuating circumstances, O'Connor was sacked after one game.

I wouldn't blame Andrea for wanting to bring someone else in, assuming they've got a plan in place, but if we're going to replace McKellar it has to be immediately at the end of the season with the new coaching set up in place almost immediately.

Fairly sure Loffreda wasn’t sacked but returned home of his volition due to family issues. Happy to be corrected

[Leicestertinytiger]

SB basically had his first season as a free shot, so I think the same should be afforded to DMK. Agree with other comments, we were massively affected being a WC year and have probably done okay overall.

That being said, the two results against Gloucester did make me massively question the direction things were going. The attack coach situation has been farcical and hasn’t helped. Whilst happy to give DMK the benefit of the doubt, he and the club have to accept that most won’t be as forgiving next season and really don’t want the same excuses again.