LEICESTER TIGERS 2023/24 - KANGAROO MCKELLER: Do you come from a land down under? (Squad thread pt 2)

[Postiger2]

I would be interested to know what posters are still unconvinced about re Mckellar.
Often this season results/performances have been down to individual errors or not sticking to the game plan, which imo is down to the players. The coach can only do so much and then players have to hold their hands up

Surely that's at least in part down to coaching? Well-drilled teams don't make these errors. Not looking for an argument btw, I agree that players should hold their hands up. However, there has to be some sort of joint responsibility when these errors happen.

FWIW, I've said it's too soon to judge DMK as we have looked all at sea at times this season. However, equally, we've also looked good in parts (e.g. for much of the Leinster game) so it's hard to quantify how well he's doing (in my opinion).

[RagingBull]

On Kelly, he isn't Munster's favourite to replace Frisch. Tom Farrell is far more likely to be it.
They don't have the budget and in reality IRFU are not going to buy him out of contract, if Kelly wants to play for Ireland they can wait a year and get him for free.
We will see, but I doubt Tigers would release a leavers list if they are in talks with Munster over releasing Kelly. Would be a dumb move.

Written by Fissler though...

If it were to happen, then Marchant would not be a bad replacement...

I can understand why people don't really like Fissler, but love him or loathe him, he often gets it right.

No he doesn't he throws enough :censored: that some will stick.
Like he broke the news about Perese, BUT then said Quins was scuppering the move and was after him week later he was announced by Tigers. He linked like 6 clubs with Sprink and he didn't go to any of them.

Just need to look at this latest article to see he's struggling for some new news
https://www.rugbypass.com/news/fissler- ... one-exits/
He reported that Scott was off to Scotland, now he's saying it's Japan
and half the article is repeats of stuff he's already said

[Rugbygramps]

I agree that it’s a joint responsibility thing and the buck stops with the coach.
There are other examples but the one that springs to mind is Shilcock v Gloucester, not his goal kicking, but the Harris try which was caused by him not moving up with the rest of the line which meant he was in a bad position and missed a simple one on one tackle. That’s not coaching it’s poor concentration and technique

[No6_Flanker]

On Kelly, he isn't Munster's favourite to replace Frisch. Tom Farrell is far more likely to be it.
They don't have the budget and in reality IRFU are not going to buy him out of contract, if Kelly wants to play for Ireland they can wait a year and get him for free.

If Kelly wants to further his international ambitions, I’m not sure why he would move and try compete against Bundee Aki (my player of the RWC) and Henshaw (a British and Irish Lion).

He’d be better off sticking around, regaining his form, and trying to establish himself as England’s next 12, in combination with Lawrence.

[AViewFromLe2]

I might well be being too relaxed about the DK thing, but does Fissler's article today say anything more than what RIL did on Tuesday? We all felt it was a thin rumour then.

There's no mention of Munster approaching us or speaking with DK. The article only says that they are interested and that we would demand a fee. Well that is nothing new, neither is that that newsworthy.

I don't mind Fissler, his hit rate is ok however he's under pressure at Rugby Pass to get stuff out. Today feels like an article he has to write to get something out, and to keep up with RIL if it does go further. But currently, I don't feel it's a story generating much more traction.

As it goes, i am not convinced DK leaves. He'd be leaving a big, famous club for another big, famous club, Munster and us both compete at the top end of the table and I'm not convinced he gets any closer to International honours by going. We know Steve rates him enough that he will be under consideration for England.

[sam16111986]

On Kelly, he isn't Munster's favourite to replace Frisch. Tom Farrell is far more likely to be it.
They don't have the budget and in reality IRFU are not going to buy him out of contract, if Kelly wants to play for Ireland they can wait a year and get him for free.

If Kelly wants to further his international ambitions, I’m not sure why he would move and try compete against Bundee Aki (my player of the RWC) and Henshaw (a British and Irish Lion).

He’d be better off sticking around, regaining his form, and trying to establish himself as England’s next 12, in combination with Lawrence.

Aki is 34 and Henshaw is 30 shortly to be 31. They can't carry on forever. McCloskey is heading over to France. Ireland are going to need to develop alternative centre options, probably starting next summer.

[No6_Flanker]

Aki is 34 and Henshaw is 30 shortly to be 31. They can't carry on forever. McCloskey is heading over to France. Ireland are going to need to develop alternative centre options, probably starting next summer.

This is true, although are they showing any signs of slowing down?

[sapajo]

Very curious to see who our new backs coach is for next season. Would be quite disappointed if it ends up being an internal 'promotion'. I think we are in dire need of new ideas.

Yep it's Matt Smith

[sapajo]

I would be interested to know what posters are still unconvinced about re Mckellar.
Often this season results/performances have been down to individual errors or not sticking to the game plan, which imo is down to the players. The coach can only do so much and then players have to hold their hands up

Well our 3 post 7 week break performances were atrocious and that does not attest to make me feel convinced about Mckellar when we should have been better given the time together

[Tigersunited]

Plus Borthwick had a free pass season to start with!

I get fans frustration I just don’t understand the mind set. If Mckellar were to go what happens next season if his replacement fails in the mind of fans, do we get rid of them too, then rinse and repeat until we luck on a successful one.
It is no coincidence that Exeter and Sarries have long standing head coaches. Even at Saints Dowson and Vesty have had a few seasons now initially learning their trade under Boyd who still consults from afar

And the success of the team in that period was now all down to Borthwick. You can’t underestimate the input by Sinfield and Walters.. both of whom have left so it’s a big hole that we are trying to fill.. it’s not all down to DMK and he definitely deserves some time to get his feet under the table with the whole squad

Walters definitely, Sinfield, really don’t think so, he has been pushed aside at England. SB ran everything, as a great leader does….

[Tigersunited]

What makes you say that with all his experience. You earn over a period of time were you expecting miracles. Again I cite the examples of the head coaches at Bath and Gloucester

Plus Borthwick had a free pass season to start with!

I get fans frustration I just don’t understand the mind set. If Mckellar were to go what happens next season if his replacement fails in the mind of fans, do we get rid of them too, then rinse and repeat until we luck on a successful one.
It is no coincidence that Exeter and Sarries have long standing head coaches. Even at Saints Dowson and Vesty have had a few seasons now initially learning their trade under Boyd who still consults from afar

I don’t expect anyone to understand my mindset, I don’t have confidence in him, at the moment - I think we could well end up outside the top 6, which with our squad, would be huge underachievement, if we make top 4 I’ll gladly eat my words.
I would change any coach that fails and struggle to get my head around keeping someone just because a potential replacement my not succeed.

[Ian Cant]

When have we seen anything near a full strength squad turn out this season!
Yes, all teams get injuries etc but when I’m not watching Tigers home and away I watch the other Premiership teams and they manage to get settled squads out.
Borthwick had a season of awful performances before turning things round then the season he left we lost badly at home to Sale then away at Saracens before he left. Wigglesworth then turned us into a decent side before he too of course left.
4 games to go but all are against teams that could easily beat us!
One game at a time so off to Saints just hoping we do compete with their much improved side.
On that matter, this week fans probably read about Sam Vesty’s coaching style as told by Saints’ players. Yes he has great attacking ideas but his ethos is to instil players to be brave enough to play what’s in front of them and to trust each other.
It helps when the backs at Saints have been together a while and largely stay fit: Furbank is back this weekend and Mitchell was back last weekend!

[sam16111986]

I get fans frustration I just don’t understand the mind set. If Mckellar were to go what happens next season if his replacement fails in the mind of fans, do we get rid of them too, then rinse and repeat until we luck on a successful one.
It is no coincidence that Exeter and Sarries have long standing head coaches. Even at Saints Dowson and Vesty have had a few seasons now initially learning their trade under Boyd who still consults from afar

And the success of the team in that period was now all down to Borthwick. You can’t underestimate the input by Sinfield and Walters.. both of whom have left so it’s a big hole that we are trying to fill.. it’s not all down to DMK and he definitely deserves some time to get his feet under the table with the whole squad

Walters definitely, Sinfield, really don’t think so, he has been pushed aside at England. SB ran everything, as a great leader does….

Great leaders bring the best out of those around them, they don't run everything. Micro managing every area yourself is normally the sign of a weak and inefficient manager.

Sinfield is a good defence coach. The world cup proved that. There's plenty of guys who were with Tigers for that title winning season who've spoken so highly of him you've got to assume he had a positive impact. Wigglesworth as well.

McKellar has been fine so far, not good though. We always struggle on world cup years and losing the attack coach is a blow. Next season there will be no excuses he must deliver something better.

[Tigersunited]

They do run everything imo- they don’t do everyone’s job, they know what each person is doing and how they are doing it. SB had a defence coach that had no experience in Union, an attack coach that was still
playing and had little coaching experience and he plucked his scrum coach from the academy.
Contrast that with DM if you will.

[Tigersunited]

When have we seen anything near a full strength squad turn out this season!
Yes, all teams get injuries etc but when I’m not watching Tigers home and away I watch the other Premiership teams and they manage to get settled squads out.
Borthwick had a season of awful performances before turning things round then the season he left we lost badly at home to Sale then away at Saracens before he left. Wigglesworth then turned us into a decent side before he too of course left.
4 games to go but all are against teams that could easily beat us!
One game at a time so off to Saints just hoping we do compete with their much improved side.
On that matter, this week fans probably read about Sam Vesty’s coaching style as told by Saints’ players. Yes he has great attacking ideas but his ethos is to instil players to be brave enough to play what’s in front of them and to trust each other.
It helps when the backs at Saints have been together a while and largely stay fit: Furbank is back this weekend and Mitchell was back last weekend!

All teams had a World Cup and as you say all teams have injuries. I’m not sure how you prove other teams have more settled teams than us.