Saracens are relegated!

[RichieB]

So, they admit to being guilty but just don't want to accept the penalty?

[anz3001]

So, they admit to being guilty but just don't want to accept the penalty?

They admit to an 'oversight', have cooperated, and volunteered information that wasn't asked of them. All quite convenient, as the investigation has found.

[Noggs]

There is no excuse for this. It was very clearly a scheme to make payments to player outside of the cap and even if they thought it was 'legal' it was a 'legal' way of avoiding the rules and therefore cheating. I have no sympathy for any of those involved. It akin to stealing in that you are depriving those who follow the rules of both honors and associated financial rewards.

In accordance with the hearings findings and assuming they do not change to my mind Nigel Wray has shown himself to be a person unfit to run a Premiership club. If I was the chairman of Tigers or any other Premiership club I would not be happy at having to welcome him and administer the normal hospitality, nor to receive the same at an away fixture. It will be interesting to see if he turns up at Glos.

The whole matter is not in the spirit of the game, nor does it meet the professional standards you would rightly expect.

Any review should be time limited.

[cheltexile]

My issue around the 'oversight' thing is that if this really was a legitamate business investment (to them) that they believe it was absolutely above board, they would have disclosed it in its totality as and when it happened, as there is no reason not to. The reality is it took the Daily Mail actually doing some real journalism for once to uncover it all, and its only then that they 'volunteered' the information (and not even all of it!). It absolutely stinks, so I'm not surprised that the panel threw the kitchen sink at them.

[CitizenSmiff]

Sarries' defence according to the finding was ludicrous, essentially that they did break the salary cap but that the cap itself is unfair because it's a restraint on their trade. Why they're appealing I don't know, 35 points and a bit of Nigel's pocket money for three years of unfair competition is buttons.

[voice of the crumbie]

Sarries' defence according to the finding was ludicrous, essentially that they did break the salary cap but that the cap itself is unfair because it's a restraint on their trade. Why they're appealing I don't know, 35 points and a bit of Nigel's pocket money for three years of unfair competition is buttons.

I couldn't agree more. I believe they should forfeit the league titles for the years during which this scheme operated. Previously I considered them worthy champions. However now that it has been shown that they have unfairly manipulated the rules to be able to employ the raft of star players / internationals they have I no longer consider them as legitimate champions for those seasons.

[Jimmy Skitz]

make them nominate a squad that is under the cap, players not named can only play in Europe and ban them from signing new senior pros until they are below the cap again

[strawclearer]

Sarries' defence according to the finding was ludicrous, essentially that they did break the salary cap but that the cap itself is unfair because it's a restraint on their trade. Why they're appealing I don't know, 35 points and a bit of Nigel's pocket money for three years of unfair competition is buttons.

I couldn't agree more. I believe they should forfeit the league titles for the years during which this scheme operated. Previously I considered them worthy champions. However now that it has been shown that they have unfairly manipulated the rules to be able to employ the raft of star players / internationals they have I no longer consider them as legitimate champions for those seasons.

This is a very sad day for rugby and for our Premiership.

[nasher]

The whole situation is ludicrous ,presumably the players have lawyers vet their contracts before signing and the lawyer questions the situation of payments outside of salary. The tax implications themselves should lead any lawyer to question the situation. Rugby is going to the dogs, the conduct of Wray and the players is against the original spirit of the game but in the 21st century cash rules.

[anz3001]

The whole situation is ludicrous ,presumably the players have lawyers vet their contracts before signing and the lawyer questions the situation of payments outside of salary. The tax implications themselves should lead any lawyer to question the situation. Rugby is going to the dogs, the conduct of Wray and the players is against the original spirit of the game but in the 21st century cash rules.

The players have lawyers to look after their own interests but how could the lawyers possibly know the financial details of all the other squad members both individually and as a collective.

[BFG]

I've always thought that clubs should be allowed more cap for providing England players.
I thought it after the World Cup in 03 when Leicester suffered and still think it.
I don't mind that Sarries support their players with investments.
I do mind that these things might be hidden to gain an advantage.
What I really dislike though above all else are male England players receiving £25k per match and sharing millions of pounds of a World Cup bonus.
In the meantime grassroots clubs such as a South Leics have their budgets decimated and lose all of their players.
The women also don't get the same even when they were World champions and arguably putting on a better brand of rugby.
It's all a very messy situation and enough to be put off.

[ABClub]

I've always thought that clubs should be allowed more cap for providing England players.

They do.

- £50k credits for homegrown players (up to max £600k per season)
- £40k credits per season for EPS players.
- £5k additional credit for each Prem or Euro game missed by EPS player due to international call-up.
- £10k credits for each Prem or Euro game missed by non EPS player due to international call-up.
- Maximum of £80k in credits per player per season across home grown player credits and international credits.

The cap is £7m if clubs access all £600k credits for home grown players, which almost all do. Add in 2 marquee players, £400k injury dispensation and international credits.

The max salary for an academy player is £30k, above this they are considered senior players under the cap. There is an academy ceiling of £100k for non home grown academy players.

[CitizenSmiff]

I might file a small claim for the price of my tickets to the Sarries game just to make a nuisance of myself, they weren't cheap and we'd have won that if they were playing fair.

[BFG]

I might file a small claim for the price of my tickets to the Sarries game just to make a nuisance of myself, they weren't cheap and we'd have won that if they were playing fair.

Imagine how Chiefs fans must feel!

[BFG]

I've always thought that clubs should be allowed more cap for providing England players.

They do.

- £50k credits for homegrown players (up to max £600k per season)
- £40k credits per season for EPS players.
- £5k additional credit for each Prem or Euro game missed by EPS player due to international call-up.
- £10k credits for each Prem or Euro game missed by non EPS player due to international call-up.
- Maximum of £80k in credits per player per season across home grown player credits and international credits.

The cap is £7m if clubs access all £600k credits for home grown players, which almost all do. Add in 2 marquee players, £400k injury dispensation and international credits.

The max salary for an academy player is £30k, above this they are considered senior players under the cap. There is an academy ceiling of £100k for non home grown academy players.

Blimey there is some money floating around the highest level.
I'm even more put off now.