Saracens Cap Investigation

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Traveller
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Traveller » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:34 am

mol2 wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:00 am
There are two likely reasons why this won't be seriously investigated and addressed.

1) The legal complexities regarding the enforceability of a salary cap. (If indeed the salary cap is legal under the law of the land)

2) For some of the clubs the old saying "People in glass houses...." Some clubs will be within the salary cap fair and square but I suspect that quite a number have overstepped the boundary even if not by much. This makes it difficult to get a consensus to go after one club when others are guilty of the same actions.
I agree with all of the above. But if that is the case then the charade of the cap should end. I really don't know if Saracens are in breach or not. I don't have an opinion. But if I was Nigel Wray I would rather own a club that a) wins fair and square b) Wins - but is known to operate outside of the cap without fear of any punishment due to employment law.

The one thing I wouldn't want is to be subject constantly to innuendo, media reports about cheating and faux investigations announced by those who have oversight responsibility for the competition, and who then sweep their own investigations under the carpet.

Scott1
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Scott1 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:48 am

As someone has already posted,I don't see the cap lasting long. And once that is lifted it could be the beginning of the end!

Traveller
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Traveller » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:00 pm

Scott1 wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:48 am
As someone has already posted,I don't see the cap lasting long. And once that is lifted it could be the beginning of the end!
Not being argumentative. Honestly. Just interested to know what the elaboration of 'the end' would be. Do you mean 'the end' in so far as a number of clubs would go to the wall and what are left would become part of some mega-european competition? Or the pro game would implode in its entirety. Or....... Or what will the game look like if the cap goes? I'm interested in opinions / views.

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Scott1 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:58 pm

Traveller wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:00 pm
Scott1 wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:48 am
As someone has already posted,I don't see the cap lasting long. And once that is lifted it could be the beginning of the end!
Not being argumentative. Honestly. Just interested to know what the elaboration of 'the end' would be. Do you mean 'the end' in so far as a number of clubs would go to the wall and what are left would become part of some mega-european competition? Or the pro game would implode in its entirety. Or....... Or what will the game look like if the cap goes? I'm interested in opinions / views.
The demise of the international team. We would have a league littered with the world's best players and with the CVC injection with possibly more to come I doubt there would be a cap of foreign players,the club game would be their priority. Couple that with the problems at the RFU and the fact that one day the club's might be able to survive without the RFU player reimbursement (clubs already hate, especially Sarries from what I've read,giving their players to England) and the game could go to pot. Rowe already mentioned a "champions League" of rugby. We already have the RCC so I took that to mean an elite season long league. I could be wrong on all of the above though 😂

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Scott1 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:35 pm


Dangerous4
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Dangerous4 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:39 pm

Scott1 wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:48 am
As someone has already posted,I don't see the cap lasting long. And once that is lifted it could be the beginning of the end!
Or the end of the beginning. Some clubs would most likely fold.

Traveller
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Traveller » Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:29 pm

My word, doesn't time fly. We are now midway through July and still no publication of an investigation into the potential breach of the salary cap by Saracens. Anyone want to bet on whether I will be writing along the same theme as July drifts into August.

sam16111986
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by sam16111986 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:57 pm

Traveller wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:29 pm
My word, doesn't time fly. We are now midway through July and still no publication of an investigation into the potential breach of the salary cap by Saracens. Anyone want to bet on whether I will be writing along the same theme as July drifts into August.
You'll be writing the same in July next year.

wellstiger
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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by wellstiger » Wed Jul 17, 2019 10:10 am

Or.... waiting for an extremely Good/Bad news day to slip it in unnoticed???? :smt019

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Dangerous4 » Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:53 pm

The situation at Saracens needs to be clarified asap. imo. Reasons and explanations should be given, whichever way the dice falls, and should be thoroughly explained. The salary cap seems to have brought more problems than it has resolved.

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Scott1 » Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:03 pm

Dangerous4 wrote:
Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:53 pm
The situation at Saracens needs to be clarified asap. imo. Reasons and explanations should be given, whichever way the dice falls, and should be thoroughly explained. The salary cap seems to have brought more problems than it has resolved.
Maybe their end goal is to have the cap done away with?

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by BigDan50 » Thu Jul 18, 2019 1:07 am

I'm convinced that any findings on Saracens salary cap investigation will be swept under the carpet.
The reason being that 5 or 6 clubs when investigated were found to have been creative with their accounting concerning the salary cap, Tigers being one of them, I know many posters on here think Tigers are whiter than white and would not be involved in something like that but think back to the original investigation, Leicester were one of the clubs who were against the powers that be taking it any further or to court.

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by Traveller » Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:51 am

BigDan50 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 1:07 am
I'm convinced that any findings on Saracens salary cap investigation will be swept under the carpet.
The reason being that 5 or 6 clubs when investigated were found to have been creative with their accounting concerning the salary cap, Tigers being one of them, I know many posters on here think Tigers are whiter than white and would not be involved in something like that but think back to the original investigation, Leicester were one of the clubs who were against the powers that be taking it any further or to court.
What happened in 2012 has been well documented and I agree with everything you write.

The difference this time is that Premiership Rugby the organising body, who are in their own words 'responsible for all aspects of the governance, regulation, delivery and promotion' themselves announced an investigation into a single one of its members. I have no idea if Saracens are in breach or not. However having announced the investigation in early March 2019, it would clearly be in the competition bests interests, and that of Saracens, for the findings to be made public. Otherwise a new season will start and the smell will linger. That isn't good for the competition overall or for the club being investigated.

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by ay2oh » Thu Jul 18, 2019 9:02 am

Bigdan 50 have you got any evidence that tigers broke the salary cap rules ? If not suggest that you keep your opinions to yourself.
A2O

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Re: Saracens Cap Investigation

Post by BigDan50 » Thu Jul 18, 2019 10:11 am

ay2oh, yes I have verbal evidence from a member of the body investigating the cap that a number of clubs were in breach of the cap including Tigers.
is there any concrete evidence out there that saracens broke the cap, if so I think it would be published by now so we must call them innocent until proven guilty.
I will not keep my opinions to myself, isn't that the point of a forum to enable fans to discuss.

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