No Dan Cole in the England training squad

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Leicestertinytiger
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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Leicestertinytiger » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:30 pm

jgriffin wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:11 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:27 am
Poor England squad for me. This whole year we’ve been blitzed at the breakdown, yet Jones doesn’t pick Underhill and Kvesic in the squad and we’ll have the same old slow pack with a lock at 6.
I feel that way too.
Exactly, what’s the point with Jones selections when he never picks on form. We’ve also obviously had issues this year, yet his picks seem to show that he’s not doing anything to rectify these.

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Stephen18 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:46 pm

Leicestertinytiger wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:27 am
Poor England squad for me. This whole year we’ve been blitzed at the breakdown, yet Jones doesn’t pick Underhill and Kvesic in the squad and we’ll have the same old slow pack with a lock at 6.
Exactly, he seem to have gone through the same pattern as Lancaster and just keeps picking the same player no matter what, Kvesic has definitely been the form English backrower.
I think if he doesn’t win all the autumn internationals or at the very least beat except the all black and run them very close, the rfu will have to let him go, to give another coach at least the 6 nations. I’ve never know another coach have so many training camps to just keep picking the same players for them over and over just seems pointless how much more do you need to see robshaw, Brown, farrell...surely he knows what they can do in that set up.

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by BFG » Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:35 pm

Leicestertinytiger wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:30 pm
jgriffin wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:11 am
Leicestertinytiger wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:27 am
Poor England squad for me. This whole year we’ve been blitzed at the breakdown, yet Jones doesn’t pick Underhill and Kvesic in the squad and we’ll have the same old slow pack with a lock at 6.
I feel that way too.
Exactly, what’s the point with Jones selections when he never picks on form. We’ve also obviously had issues this year, yet his picks seem to show that he’s not doing anything to rectify these.
As much as I try to build positivity between international periods lately it doesn't seem take very long to disapate.
I watched an interview with Eddie this morning in which he said that England need to play like England and not copy others.
I have absolutely no idea what that is since he took charge and haven't even seen a glimpse of it.
I'm willing to give it another chance and see what he can come up with but think it's very risky to put it all on one players ability to perform and stay fit in midfield which I suspect is the case, and considering he and several others were born and raised for many years elsewhere it's a bit of a joke to hear an Aussie suggest that the English should stay true to their style with foreign born players, a skipper from New Zealand, and with the best scrummager potentially left out!
I know coaches are bombarded with questions etc but I just hope the teams actions on the pitch don't reflect the lack of sense in his talk!
Last edited by BFG on Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Grimlish
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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Grimlish » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:08 pm

Why hit the panic button? People weren’t talking like this when England were on their long unbeaten run, largely under Jones’s stewardship. He’s testing and embedding players so he has options in a year’s time, and/or he’s getting players on the fringes used to his preferred structures. All his predecessors have done it. Lancaster’s problem was to over-think it and get caught in the Burgess trap. I don’t see that happening with Jones.

Either way the squad announced this week remains a training squad and not even the likely squad for the AI’s. What is there about that people don’t get?

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Chobbsy » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:42 pm

Grimlish wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:08 pm
Why hit the panic button? People weren’t talking like this when England were on their long unbeaten run, largely under Jones’s stewardship. He’s testing and embedding players so he has options in a year’s time, and/or he’s getting players on the fringes used to his preferred structures. All his predecessors have done it. Lancaster’s problem was to over-think it and get caught in the Burgess trap. I don’t see that happening with Jones.

Either way the squad announced this week remains a training squad and not even the likely squad for the AI’s. What is there about that people don’t get?
we understand that, , but why would you leave out your number 1 ( arguably the only decent) tight head out, the EJ knows what he can do so why involve him doesn't fly as I am sure he knows what Ben Youngs can do etc.

But to clarify we UNDERSTAND it is a training squad, but we are still allowed to ask the question
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Stephen18 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:47 pm

Grimlish wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:08 pm
Why hit the panic button? People weren’t talking like this when England were on their long unbeaten run, largely under Jones’s stewardship. He’s testing and embedding players so he has options in a year’s time, and/or he’s getting players on the fringes used to his preferred structures. All his predecessors have done it. Lancaster’s problem was to over-think it and get caught in the Burgess trap. I don’t see that happening with Jones.

Either way the squad announced this week remains a training squad and not even the likely squad for the AI’s. What is there about that people don’t get?
That’s exactly the point this is a training squad, I could except him just nameingbtje same squad if it were a autumn squad as clear he thinks there his best players and will get him the wins he has to get now, after his terrible run with the 6 nations and the summer tour, but it’s a trainning squad so it should have anybody in it who he think he might possibly need at any point due to injuries, suspension or what ever, like Kvesic, Cipriani, Goode, woodward, armond, Spencer, Ludlow, slater, Lewington who ever in form, so they can know the system, the calls, moves so they could step in if needed. What are player getting out of it who have already been to 9/10 of these camps already. I don’t think he’s taken a single player to this camp who haven’t already been to a camp.

Mark62
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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by Mark62 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:11 pm

I think the issue with his omission is that other than that there are no other regulars omitted.
It could just be that he knows what Coley can do and the other 3 are in competition to be his replacement off the bench.
I can’t believe even Jones believes the others are all better than Dan. At 31 he is still to reach his peak as a prop

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by BFG » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:22 pm

I'm not so sure about the omissions being viewed as potentially more permanent.
With Hartley and George I believe that they will be hoping that the two better scrummaging hookers will allow more mobility and ball carrying ability off the other props.
It'll depend how they perform!

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by JP14 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:29 pm

I too feel anger at Kvesic’s, Cipriani’s and Underhill’s exclusion but also I thought Elliott Stooke, Slater, 36, Balmain, Trinder, Marchant, Morgan and Kruis’ and Te’o’s inclusion. Scratching my head here,
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by JP14 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:30 pm

Not sure this spells the death of Cole’s England career.
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by BFG » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:31 pm

Agree JP14 as none of the above have performed to date!

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by JP14 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:26 pm

BFG wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:31 pm
Agree JP14 as none of the above have performed to date!
Performed, they’ve barely played!
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by BFG » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:44 pm

JP14 wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:26 pm
BFG wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:31 pm
Agree JP14 as none of the above have performed to date!
Performed, they’ve barely played!
That's what I meant! :smt023

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by POSTIGER » Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:53 pm

6 Quins players and 3 Exeter players. Weird. Sarries and Exeter are the two best sides in the country by a distance and yet Sarries have 3x as many representatives.

A squad that on paper at least, doesn't look any more competitive at the breakdown than the last two squads that struggled in the 6Ns and then in SA.

Sam Simmonds is the form player in the league but no call-up. Te'o who hasn't done a great deal for anyone in the last 12 months is in. Obviously different positions but form has to count for something surely?
I saw Marika Vunibaka play

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Re: No Dan Cole in the England training squad

Post by JP14 » Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:56 pm

Dan Cole played well today I thought, anyone else agree on that?
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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