6 Nations 2022

[GB72]

If SA joined the 6N they wouldn't be in the RC too ,that's what I'm gathering. Talks of Japan taking their place

Still causes a problem as the 6 Nations players are around to cover the RC period. Clubs would be bare bones for the 6 Nations when you think of the amount of players they could lose.

[Tiglon]

Why not just add the Aussies and Kiwis, scrap the RWC and call it the Rugby World League?

I'm not quite sure where the game is going at the moment. On one hand we seem to be trying to create a cricket style environment where it's constant internationals and nothing else matters, but on the other hand we also seem determined to push for a football style model with star studded domestic leagues and hugely important Euro club competitions.

Can't have both...

Don't even get me started on the Rugby 10s or whatever ^&*% that was that Dallaglio and friends tried to start.

Unless you're football, the aim of any sport should be to consolidate the niche you have and focus on being unique, not trying to take over the world. It's almost as if Pinky and the Brain are running Rugby.

[Scott1]

If SA joined the 6N they wouldn't be in the RC too ,that's what I'm gathering. Talks of Japan taking their place

Still causes a problem as the 6 Nations players are around to cover the RC period. Clubs would be bare bones for the 6 Nations when you think of the amount of players they could lose.

Cancel the AI and play the PRC through the 6N getting rid of the fallow week or perhaps a slight rejig?

[Scott1]

Why not just add the Aussies and Kiwis, scrap the RWC and call it the Rugby World League?

I'm not quite sure where the game is going at the moment. On one hand we seem to be trying to create a cricket style environment where it's constant internationals and nothing else matters, but on the other hand we also seem determined to push for a football style model with star studded domestic leagues and hugely important Euro club competitions.

Can't have both...

Don't even get me started on the Rugby 10s or whatever ^&*% that was that Dallaglio and friends tried to start.

Unless you're football, the aim of any sport should be to consolidate the niche you have and focus on being unique, not trying to take over the world. It's almost as if Pinky and the Brain are running Rugby.

Id love a rugby world club league! The best from GP,URC,Top 14 and SR? Yes please! Or at least a world club championship one off game where the European champions play the winners of Super Rugby!

[ay2oh]

I’m only interested in Tigers so anything that takes players away from club games is a no no

[Tiglon]

Why not just add the Aussies and Kiwis, scrap the RWC and call it the Rugby World League?

I'm not quite sure where the game is going at the moment. On one hand we seem to be trying to create a cricket style environment where it's constant internationals and nothing else matters, but on the other hand we also seem determined to push for a football style model with star studded domestic leagues and hugely important Euro club competitions.

Can't have both...

Don't even get me started on the Rugby 10s or whatever ^&*% that was that Dallaglio and friends tried to start.

Unless you're football, the aim of any sport should be to consolidate the niche you have and focus on being unique, not trying to take over the world. It's almost as if Pinky and the Brain are running Rugby.

Id love a rugby world club league! The best from GP,URC,Top 14 and SR? Yes please! Or at least a world club championship one off game where the European champions play the winners of Super Rugby!

Not what I meant, once you add SA to the 6N then you're basically 2 teams away from creating the RWC in a league format played every single year. So what's the point of the RWC any more?

Sometimes less is more.

[Scott1]

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1116619401?-11081:2392

Here's another article, exciting times ahead!

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1116617412?-11081:2392

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1116627695?-11081:2392

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1116628232?-11081:2392

[Scott1]

Looking a done deal then for 2024

[Robespierre]

Springboks in the 6N? No thank you. The Italian side has been struggling for a while now but with the success of their U20 side, the future is looking better, and if the second tier, Georgia, Portugal, Spain, Russia, gets financial support, the future of European rugby is good. Simply put, if it ain’t broken, it doesn’t need fixing!

[Cardiff Tig]

Springboks in the 6N? No thank you. The Italian side has been struggling for a while now but with the success of their U20 side, the future is looking better, and if the second tier, Georgia, Portugal, Spain, Russia, gets financial support, the future of European rugby is good. Simply put, if it ain’t broken, it doesn’t need fixing!

Completely agree.

Happy with Italy. They're clearly making big improvements in their professional rugby teams and youngsters, and this will start to translate to the national side. Georgia or whoever could replace them in Europe would just be even more of a mismatch. And just no to SA in the 6N.

[Scott1]

Happy with a guaranteed TBP win for every team that plays Italy? Why? That's not competition ,waste of time!

[Robespierre]

Scott, you need to look at the wider picture.
Italy have always struggled in the 6N, but their U20 team looks very promising, which bodes well for the senior XV in a couple of years. Now what if South Africa appear and Italy get booted out, as is probable, what incentive is there for the younger players if they can't measure themselves against the other 6N teams? Answer - none!
The 6N is a European competition, and European it must remain.
However, with the multi millions that CVC want to put forward to bring South Africa in, coupled with the fact that South African sides are currently in the United Rugby Championship, there's a likelihood that money talks, to the detriment of the second tier nations (and I include Italy), and the Springboks may well come north. I sincerely hope not.

The second tier of European rugby needs developing.
Surprisingly, Spain are currently leading the Rugby Europe Championship after two rounds and Georgia are third (the others are Romania, Portugal, Russia, Netherlands). Now if a relegation play-off could be organised in the future between the last team in the 6N and the winner of the Rugby European Championship, it's a step in the right direction, with the winner guaranteed at least three seasons in the 6N to give them time to improve (just one season will surely see them be relegated).

Sadly, CVC's profiteering will probably tip the balance, which in my humble opinion will not be in the best interests of European International rugby.

[Robespierre]

Today's Telegraph article:-

Furious Italy will block move to replace them in Six Nations with South Africa
Azzurri suggest they have a veto over any change to the Six Nations participants - but reports suggest Springboks could join in 2025

By
Daniel Schofield,
DEPUTY RUGBY UNION CORRESPONDENT and
Ben Coles,
RUGBY REPORTER
17 February 2022 • 5:27pm

Italy will furiously block any attempt to allow South Africa to replace them in the Six Nations with a dire warning that being tossed out of the tournament would “kill the sport” in the country.

One well-placed Six Nations insider suggested that reports that the Springboks will take the Azzurri’s place in the Six Nations by 2025 were a “fantasy”, meaning the tournament would have to expand to seven teams to accommodate the reigning world champions.

The Italian Rugby Federation (FIR) would not comment publicly on Thursday but sources close to the Azzurri suggest that they would have a veto over any change to the Six Nations participants. “Do you think Italy at any stage is going to allow themselves to leave the Championship?” an Italian source said. “I don’t think so. It is never going to happen.”

Other sources were less confident in Italy’s status. Their run of 34 consecutive defeats in the tournament has been severely damaging. World champions South Africa would not only lift the standard of competition but it would enable the Six Nations to tap into a lucrative commercial market.

While the mechanism to remove teams from the Six Nations has not yet been employed, it is understood that Italy would have to be bought out of their 1/7th share of the tournament. Last year, CVC Capital Partners, the private equity group, paid £365million for a 14.3 per cent stake in the Six Nations Championship.

However, former Italian captain and current head coach of Benetton Treviso Marco Bortolami warned that bringing in South Africa would have severe consequences, not just in Italy but for the tournament as a whole. “It would be a disaster,” Bortolami told Telegraph Sport. “For exposure, the Six Nations has always been the highlight of the season for Italian rugby. It would be a disaster, 100 per cent. If you want to kill rugby in Italy that would be the best way to do it.

“In rugby, we always talk about values and history and legacy. To build that takes time. But you can destroy it instantly. If you want to destroy the Six Nations then it becomes a different commercial tournament. Maybe it is the United States next time in ten years. Maybe it will be Scotland and Wales who get pushed out if that’s the way we want to go. I am not sure that path makes sense.”


Ben Morel, the Six Nations chief executive, has always been lukewarm about the prospects fo South Africa joining the tournament. Last October, he described himself as “very cautious” about possible expansion and last month he pointedly defended Italy’s place in the tournament. “They’ve got young talent and they’re performing well at the under-20s regularly,” Morel said. “The conversion to the senior team has been their struggle. They’re putting a lot more resources behind it, and we’ve got all the faith in their management.”

There is also a reluctance to meddle with the format of the Six Nations, which is by far rugby’s biggest cash cow outside of the Lions tour. For now, Italy have the backing of the Six Nations hierarchy but there is also a recognition that their run of defeats cannot continue indefinitely.

Bortolami made his Italy debut soon after their admission into the Six Nations in 2000 and would go on to win 112 caps. While there was a significant tail-off in the results when he and the older generation of Sergio Parisse, Martin Castrogiovanni and Mauro Bergamasco retired, Bortolami insists there is hope on the horizon. He points to Italy Under-20s 6-0 defeat of Italy as well as Treviso’s victory in the Rainbow Cup as proof that a corner is being turned.

“We are rebuilding a team around a new generation of players,” Bortolami said. “That takes time. Rugby is not as established as it is in England and other countries. That’s the reality and if you want to support rugby in Italy you need to be patient.

“It does not mean we are not taking responsibility about the performances on the field. It must improve and there is a lot of pressure within Italian rugby to address our problems and to be competitive. I felt in the last four years we had opportunities but we let them slip away. We are not that far away. The reality is the Six Nations is a European tournament so I don’t know if it makes sense to throw out the weakest side.”

Certainly, there is no secret of South Africa’s desire to join the Six Nations, even if it has committed itself to the Rugby Championship through to 2025. The alignment with the northern hemisphere, which shares its time zone, has already begun with the incorporation of the Bulls, Sharks, Lions and Stormers into the United Rugby Championship which also features teams from Scotland, Wales, Ireland and Italy.

Yet South Africa’s desire to head north has never been fully matched by the Six Nations. World Rugby, who would have to sanction any new tournament, are keeping a keen eye on developments, particularly mindful of the implications for player welfare. However, it is understood that the priority of most of the game’s powerbrokers, including CVC, is on getting the Nations Championship signed off.

[Canuck]

Scott, you need to look at the wider picture.
Italy have always struggled in the 6N, but their U20 team looks very promising, which bodes well for the senior XV in a couple of years. Now what if South Africa appear and Italy get booted out, as is probable, what incentive is there for the younger players if they can't measure themselves against the other 6N teams? Answer - none!
The 6N is a European competition, and European it must remain.
However, with the multi millions that CVC want to put forward to bring South Africa in, coupled with the fact that South African sides are currently in the United Rugby Championship, there's a likelihood that money talks, to the detriment of the second tier nations (and I include Italy), and the Springboks may well come north. I sincerely hope not.

The second tier of European rugby needs developing.
Surprisingly, Spain are currently leading the Rugby Europe Championship after two rounds and Georgia are third (the others are Romania, Portugal, Russia, Netherlands). Now if a relegation play-off could be organised in the future between the last team in the 6N and the winner of the Rugby European Championship, it's a step in the right direction, with the winner guaranteed at least three seasons in the 6N to give them time to improve (just one season will surely see them be relegated).

Sadly, CVC's profiteering will probably tip the balance, which in my humble opinion will not be in the best interests of European International rugby.

I totally agree that the 6 Nations should be exclusively European. Perhaps the winner of the second tier Europe group playing off against the lowest 6 Nations side for a place the following year but nothing further. If SA want to take part in an annual tournament they should invest more in other African Nations to provide their own competition. I know it’s not attractive to the ‘money men’ who are beginning to influence the way our sport is organized but it certainly would be for the good of the game. Remember when the Springboks were all Afrikaans speaking white men?
We should learn a lesson from English Cricket - excessive white ball nonsense relegating the Counties, who nurture young talent, to a mere sideshow.

[Scott1]

Scott, you need to look at the wider picture.
Italy have always struggled in the 6N, but their U20 team looks very promising, which bodes well for the senior XV in a couple of years. Now what if South Africa appear and Italy get booted out, as is probable, what incentive is there for the younger players if they can't measure themselves against the other 6N teams? Answer - none!
The 6N is a European competition, and European it must remain.
However, with the multi millions that CVC want to put forward to bring South Africa in, coupled with the fact that South African sides are currently in the United Rugby Championship, there's a likelihood that money talks, to the detriment of the second tier nations (and I include Italy), and the Springboks may well come north. I sincerely hope not.

The second tier of European rugby needs developing.
Surprisingly, Spain are currently leading the Rugby Europe Championship after two rounds and Georgia are third (the others are Romania, Portugal, Russia, Netherlands). Now if a relegation play-off could be organised in the future between the last team in the 6N and the winner of the Rugby European Championship, it's a step in the right direction, with the winner guaranteed at least three seasons in the 6N to give them time to improve (just one season will surely see them be relegated).

Sadly, CVC's profiteering will probably tip the balance, which in my humble opinion will not be in the best interests of European International rugby.

Italy were at their best quite recently when Conor O’Shea was in charge and he had full running of the league teams as well as the international side. But they still wasn’t good enough I’m afraid. So we keep waiting around until they might be? It’s a mockery of elite sport imo that a team plays year in year out guaranteeing the other sides a big win and possibly helping toward points difference if there might be a tie at the top. Ok they pick up the very rare odd win but thats embarrassing for me for the elite international global competition,maybe the better idea might be to arrange the Pacific islands teams to tour Italy. Let them grow from there. We can’t keep giving them an out just because their U20 team might come up trumps.