Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

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Big Dai
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Big Dai »

Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:42 pm
Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 9:19 am Yes, shocker.....horror......but why not get at the source of the issue too. The over exuberant winding up?
Penalty then team yellow perhaps?
............used to a good old fashioned slap in the chops! 😄😄😇😇
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Scott1
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Scott1 »

Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:19 pm
Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:42 pm
Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 9:19 am Yes, shocker.....horror......but why not get at the source of the issue too. The over exuberant winding up?
Penalty then team yellow perhaps?
............used to a good old fashioned slap in the chops! 😄😄😇😇
Get Bakkies Botha on the case 😂👍
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
Big Dai
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Big Dai »

Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:54 pm
Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:19 pm
Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:42 pm

Penalty then team yellow perhaps?
............used to a good old fashioned slap in the chops! 😄😄😇😇
Get Bakkies Botha on the case 😂👍
Mr Maitland.

Disciplinary hearing, Gents loo, Dog and Duck, somewhere near Twickenham, not sure precisely where as you'll arrive blindfolded.

Panel Presiding. Botha, Johnson, Dooley and O'Connell.


Good luck mate.
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Scott1
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Scott1 »

Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 3:19 pm
Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:54 pm
Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:19 pm

............used to a good old fashioned slap in the chops! 😄😄😇😇
Get Bakkies Botha on the case 😂👍
Mr Maitland.

Disciplinary hearing, Gents loo, Dog and Duck, somewhere near Twickenham, not sure precisely where as you'll arrive blindfolded.

Panel Presiding. Botha, Johnson, Dooley and O'Connell.


Good luck mate.
Ouch! 😂
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
northerntiger
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by northerntiger »

If you look at the beginning, Maitland ruffles McGuigans hair and gives him a push, then turn away. As soon as he feel McGuigan touch his back, he spreads his arm and start to appeal. I was quite glad to then see McGuigan then throw him to the floor
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by chris111 »

northerntiger wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 4:09 pm If you look at the beginning, Maitland ruffles McGuigans hair and gives him a push, then turn away. As soon as he feel McGuigan touch his back, he spreads his arm and start to appeal. I was quite glad to then see McGuigan then throw him to the floor
Why were you glad? Because you think that ‘appeal in’ and ‘winding up’ are more serious offences than a violent loss of control?
Just to be clear - I don’t like the growing tendency for ostentatious celebration purely done to provoke a response. It is absolutely against the spirit in which rugby is meant to be played; I’d like to see referees take action against it but more significantly coaches at every level of the game have a responsibility to leave players in no doubt that it is unacceptable. It’s even crept into junior rugby - I see it more and more on a Sunday morning.

However, there is no excuse for McGuigan’s behaviour - it wasn’t even a momentary instinctive lashing out but a prolonged piece of ill-tempered nastiness.

To those on this forum and elsewhere using this as another reason to indulge in nostalgia for ‘the good old self-policing days’ - well, you’re entitled to your opinions, of course, but the world has moved on and the rugby ain’t going back to the days of Julian White and Martin Johnson enforcing their own ‘moral code’ on the game. If I’m in a minority here in being happy that this is the case - I can live with that.
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by ay2oh »

Agree that the celebrations for winning a scrum penalty, knock-on etc are tiresome. When no crowds were present could understand players trying to motivate themselves but not now.
If the referee starting giving penalties this would soon stop it happening.
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by northerntiger »

I was pleased slightly tongue in cheek, but I really don’t like the appealing for innocuous contact which is creeping into the game. He clearly went to wind McGuigan up, was ready to appeal, probably expecting a bit of a push. Didn’t expect to be thrown to the ground
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Big Dai »

chris111 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 5:44 pm
northerntiger wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 4:09 pm If you look at the beginning, Maitland ruffles McGuigans hair and gives him a push, then turn away. As soon as he feel McGuigan touch his back, he spreads his arm and start to appeal. I was quite glad to then see McGuigan then throw him to the floor
Why were you glad? Because you think that ‘appeal in’ and ‘winding up’ are more serious offences than a violent loss of control?
Just to be clear - I don’t like the growing tendency for ostentatious celebration purely done to provoke a response. It is absolutely against the spirit in which rugby is meant to be played; I’d like to see referees take action against it but more significantly coaches at every level of the game have a responsibility to leave players in no doubt that it is unacceptable. It’s even crept into junior rugby - I see it more and more on a Sunday morning.

However, there is no excuse for McGuigan’s behaviour - it wasn’t even a momentary instinctive lashing out but a prolonged piece of ill-tempered nastiness.

To those on this forum and elsewhere using this as another reason to indulge in nostalgia for ‘the good old self-policing days’ - well, you’re entitled to your opinions, of course, but the world has moved on and the rugby ain’t going back to the days of Julian White and Martin Johnson enforcing their own ‘moral code’ on the game. If I’m in a minority here in being happy that this is the case - I can live with that.
We've gone well beyond those good old days. So much so that the snipers, chopsers, hair pullers, bag snatchers and other snide low-lives now prevail.

It's a shame in many ways that officiating bodies seem all too keen to punish retaliation, but do nothing to punish the cheapshot that started the altercation. In many cases it's not one incident that kicks it off. It's a series of digs that builds and builds until someone snaps.

In the "good old days" justice was swift but even then excesses were punished, both with citings and latterly cards. There remained, however, a line that most did not cross.

It seems now that the wind up is seen to be part of the game. Back's running in to congratulate the forwards after winning a scrum penalty, gloating over a turnover, hair ruffling and taunting, keeping the ball or throwing it away....all a bit....poor, a bit non sporting, a bit ......irritating......a bit non rugby to be honest.

Time for penalties, penalty reversals, and cards for such actions.

Harrumph!
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chris111
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by chris111 »

Big Dai wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:04 pm
chris111 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 5:44 pm
northerntiger wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 4:09 pm If you look at the beginning, Maitland ruffles McGuigans hair and gives him a push, then turn away. As soon as he feel McGuigan touch his back, he spreads his arm and start to appeal. I was quite glad to then see McGuigan then throw him to the floor
Why were you glad? Because you think that ‘appeal in’ and ‘winding up’ are more serious offences than a violent loss of control?
Just to be clear - I don’t like the growing tendency for ostentatious celebration purely done to provoke a response. It is absolutely against the spirit in which rugby is meant to be played; I’d like to see referees take action against it but more significantly coaches at every level of the game have a responsibility to leave players in no doubt that it is unacceptable. It’s even crept into junior rugby - I see it more and more on a Sunday morning.

However, there is no excuse for McGuigan’s behaviour - it wasn’t even a momentary instinctive lashing out but a prolonged piece of ill-tempered nastiness.

To those on this forum and elsewhere using this as another reason to indulge in nostalgia for ‘the good old self-policing days’ - well, you’re entitled to your opinions, of course, but the world has moved on and the rugby ain’t going back to the days of Julian White and Martin Johnson enforcing their own ‘moral code’ on the game. If I’m in a minority here in being happy that this is the case - I can live with that.
We've gone well beyond those good old days. So much so that the snipers, chopsers, hair pullers, bag snatchers and other snide low-lives now prevail.

It's a shame in many ways that officiating bodies seem all too keen to punish retaliation, but do nothing to punish the cheapshot that started the altercation. In many cases it's not one incident that kicks it off. It's a series of digs that builds and builds until someone snaps.

In the "good old days" justice was swift but even then excesses were punished, both with citings and latterly cards. There remained, however, a line that most did not cross.

It seems now that the wind up is seen to be part of the game. Back's running in to congratulate the forwards after winning a scrum penalty, gloating over a turnover, hair ruffling and taunting, keeping the ball or throwing it away....all a bit....poor, a bit non sporting, a bit ......irritating......a bit non rugby to be honest.

Time for penalties, penalty reversals, and cards for such actions.

Harrumph!
We’re actually pretty much on the same page, Dai - other than that I think it’s unfair to dump all the responsibility for dealing with this on referees, who have a horrendously difficult job already. It’s now so prevalent that although I can’t say coaches are actively encouraging players to do it, they are certainly not discouraging it - and they should.

We also should be honest on this forum - and accept that the team we follow are just as culpable!
northerntiger
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by northerntiger »

I’ve seen it occasionally, ref asks the TMO to check what started the incident. Be good if that became standard practice, and yellows followed
Scott1
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Scott1 »

Being a fan of MMA I was proud of his technique 😂
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by chris111 »

Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:42 pm Being a fan of MMA I was proud of his technique 😂
Speaking from 25 years experience of shotokan karate, 10 years jujitsu and a few years dabbling in aikido, I can tell you his technique was rubbish - pure grab and heave!
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Scott1 »

chris111 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:19 pm
Scott1 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:42 pm Being a fan of MMA I was proud of his technique 😂
Speaking from 25 years experience of shotokan karate, 10 years jujitsu and a few years dabbling in aikido, I can tell you his technique was rubbish - pure grab and heave!
BJJ? I expect you're a big fan of the Gracies then. Aikido is absolutely useless,Steven Seagal will tell you that when he was choked out by Gene Lebell and soiled himself haha. Lyoto Machida trained Shotokan didn't he? Loved his style,I always found it quite simple sparring against Karatekas ,hard to hit but very easy to destroy their lead leg.
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Re: Premiership Round 9 - 2021/22

Post by Old Hob »

I agree, Dai. Players do seem to be able to control themselves, however. The pushing and shoving that breaks out never seems to get as far as punches thrown, as it would have done in the past. Presumably, that is because of the fear of the sanction. Ergo, more sanctions. Hair pulling, shouting, screaming, yelling at referee blue card; 5 minutes in the bin to calm down
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