LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE V: Borthwick Strikes Back

[OakhamTiger32]

If Burns is such "quality" why was he dropped by us first then Bath and now plying his trade in Japan

That's a good question and one I don't have the answer to. I'm not saying I am desperate to see him back at the club, more that I want a dependable back up for George when he's away on International duty. Maybe Burns isn't the answer but at the moment it seems like Henry and Bonilla aren't the answer either and we need somebody. I for one hope that Henry settles in and develops into the player he has the potential to be but seeing Burns back at WR wouldn't be the worst bit of business we have done imho.

[kpj tiger]

If Burns is such "quality" why was he dropped by us first then Bath and now plying his trade in Japan

I can't speak for Bath but he was dropped by us because Ford was available, I feel like any team in the land would want Ford given the cap space

[DingDong]

If Burns were half the calibre the 38 Eng capped Hodgson was i'd take him at a shot, but the reality is that the 5 Eng cap Freddie is not, and in recent seasons more and more a grossly inconsistent player. For every decent pass or tactical kick he'll shank another, throw an intercept pass, snipe and get turned over.

Freddie's defence was also woeful, but what depresses me most about a return of Freddie is his lack of leadership to marshal the game plan. That skill has to be key in all our FH's to regain that backline continuity. Watch Fordy or even Henry after he's kicked to touch or converts, straight away barking the orders getting everyone on board for the next phase, watch Freddie and nothing, Cipriani was another guilty of not stepping up in that department.

[Nofrontteeth]

This may be for a seperate topic so please be tolerant.

This current thread includes reference to limits on none UK/accepted passports and need for international cover.

If pro rugby stopped their league whilst the internationals were played would that effect squad sizes (wage bill), player welfare (squad r&r). Home internationals already have to have statutory breaks, and;

If we accept rugby as an open pro entertainment, surely as long as we remain within the shrinking cap why should we have to worry about the colour of a players' passport?

Or am I just being naive?

[fentiger]

This may be for a seperate topic so please be tolerant.

This current thread includes reference to limits on none UK/accepted passports and need for international cover.

If pro rugby stopped their league whilst the internationals were played would that effect squad sizes (wage bill), player welfare (squad r&r). Home internationals already have to have statutory breaks, and;

If we accept rugby as an open pro entertainment, surely as long as we remain within the shrinking cap why should we have to worry about the colour of a players' passport?

Or am I just being naive?

Not naive, but remember the pro game is run by greedy blazers still resident in the dark ages!

[Wayne Richardson Fan Club]

I wonder what would of happen with Costelow if we knew (when he was assessing his options early last year), what was to come, could we of persuaded him to stop?
From the admittedly limited bits I have seen of him, he appears way ahead of anyone else bar Ford with us now or linked with us.

[RagingBull]

Most likely still have moved he got a lot of pressure from the WRU.
Same with Joe Heyes.
But Joe Heyes obviously want's to play for England

[sam16111986]

If Burns is such "quality" why was he dropped by us first then Bath and now plying his trade in Japan

I'd say because Bath were paying him equivalent cap for first choice fly half so needed to offload him so they could afford a first choice 10.

Which they haven't signed. I think Burns contract was up and he had no relationship with Hooper. Bath could use his cap to bring in Ben Spencer.

[sam16111986]

Most likely still have moved he got a lot of pressure from the WRU.
Same with Joe Heyes.
But Joe Heyes obviously want's to play for England

Easier to keep hold of Heyes because there's little relationship with Wales. His dad was born there only because his grandfather was playing for Swansea City at the time. I think his dad despite being born in Wales chose to represent England at age grade.

Sam Costelow was a proud Welshman. He trained with the full Welsh squad whilst being part of the under 20s. If your dream is to play international rugby for Wales and the WRU are showing you some love then you take the opportunity. It's not worked out for him though I suppose it might do yet.

[Wayne Richardson Fan Club]

If we had said 2nd choice to Ford, might of persuaded him to sign on for 2 or 3 years, he is 3rd/4th choice at the Scarlets...at the moment.

[mol2]

The budget for players is capped. The expectation that we could afford 2 fly haves of current international standard is unrealistic.

Burns was one of our best players and traded to get Ford. I would speculate he wasn’t exactly fired up by being sent to Bath who seem to be a side in the same sort of disarray but a year or two behind us.

Finding yourself out of favour at Bath, a Covid epidemic throwing domestic professional rugby into chaos and financial uncertainty and an acceptance that your England career is over would make a lucrative contract in Japan tempting. I wouldn’t criticise him or any player for making that call.

If he returns Burns would not be a downgrade. As no2 to Ford he is head and shoulders above Henry. Yes Burns had the odd brain fart but Henry is very limited and his errors are not rash or reckless but are just part of a lack of ability. Burns was here and burdened by feeling pressures of sparking something in a side with little flair. Easy to blame him for a sides overall deficiencies.

Look at other Premiership sides and ask how many of the other sides would be trying to sign our fly halves other than Ford.

[sapajo]

Bonilla from memory has hardly played if at all since joining us. Can anyone please tell me how an Argentine international given his lack of game time has apparently blotted his copybook to such a degree that he is rumoured to now be for the chop?

[Scott1]

Bonilla from memory has hardly played if at all since joining us. Can anyone please tell me how an Argentine international given his lack of game time has apparently blotted his copybook to such a degree that he is rumoured to now be for the chop?

Is it the foreign player quota?

[RichieB]

Good question - if only we were told the reasons rather than just guessing. If it is the overseas player quota, and given Montoya you'd think would be a shoe-in, surely the fly-half position is a much more pivotal role in the team than (for example) a centre or wing (Moroni). Not 100% sure who the overseas players are these days to be honest.

In other words, look at the options we have and if Bonilla is a better pick than Henry, I personally would rather go that route than to put Henry in just for the sake of keeping Moroni in. Nothing against Moroni, I like him better in the three-quarters than on the wing. Just saying a perceived 'weakness' at fly-half can be fatal for a team whereas there might be some positions you can try to make do.

[Tigerbeat]

Is Bonilla signed up for a few seasons? I thought that he was only here for this season before he went off elsewhere, due to Argentina not playing in The Championship.