Gallagher Premiership Round 6

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JP14
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by JP14 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:43 pm

In my opinion, (although admittedly could be biased as the incident did happen against Tigers), Hartley calling Barnsey a :censored: cheat is not the same as Sinckler reacting to a bad tackle and the two week ban is around about correct in my view.
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

TigerFeetSteve
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by TigerFeetSteve » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:14 pm

I recall Parisse missed a number of 6N games after he got a 4 week ban and was sent off for swearing at a ref? Someone may remeber more of the details but from recollection he claimed he never directed anything at the ref (not sure) and still got a 4 weeks, 2 weeks does seem quite light to me?
Used to run around with an 11, 14 or 15 on my back.

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by sam16111986 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:35 pm

JP14 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:43 pm
In my opinion, (although admittedly could be biased as the incident did happen against Tigers), Hartley calling Barnsey a :censored: cheat is not the same as Sinckler reacting to a bad tackle and the two week ban is around about correct in my view.
Hartley was warned about his conduct shortly before his red card so certainly deserved a longer sentence. I think two weeks is a bit weak. Had it been four weeks reduced to two for previous good behaviour and saying sorry then that would been more satisfactory.

Mr Hartley's incident.

https://youtu.be/2EV-aM3j0kg

sam16111986
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by sam16111986 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:37 pm

Cardiff Tig wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:54 am
sam16111986 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:37 pm
BengalTiger wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:49 pm
The citing of Sinckler totally undermines the ref, he heard the comment and dealt with it, what is the point in having a hearing, leave the refs to deal with it, if they do not see it or make a clear error OK but you must allow refs to remain in charge!
For me he should have got a yellow card, no way was it a red!
Dickson is a former teammate of Sinckler and hence probably cut him some slack. Sinckler swore at a referee that is a red card all day everyday immaterial of why he was complaining or how bad what he said was. This is rugby we complain about football antics creeping in and if you don't deal with cases like this then football antics is what you are going to get.
The problem is swearing at the ref is much more common these days. There's plenty of occasions when the ref has talked to the captain about players swearing at them e.g. Biggar, and noone has got cited or banned. Seems like double standards to charge Sinckler after the ref had spoke to him on the field.
The shout appeals and wave their arms at the ref. I can't remember any swearing though the lack of crowd noise made Sincklers screaming very audible whereas others might have their utterances muffled.

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by Cardiff Tig » Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:55 am

sam16111986 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:37 pm
Cardiff Tig wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:54 am
sam16111986 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:37 pm


Dickson is a former teammate of Sinckler and hence probably cut him some slack. Sinckler swore at a referee that is a red card all day everyday immaterial of why he was complaining or how bad what he said was. This is rugby we complain about football antics creeping in and if you don't deal with cases like this then football antics is what you are going to get.
The problem is swearing at the ref is much more common these days. There's plenty of occasions when the ref has talked to the captain about players swearing at them e.g. Biggar, and noone has got cited or banned. Seems like double standards to charge Sinckler after the ref had spoke to him on the field.
The shout appeals and wave their arms at the ref. I can't remember any swearing though the lack of crowd noise made Sincklers screaming very audible whereas others might have their utterances muffled.
I'm pretty sure Biggar has been warned before for shouting things like "He's offside again ref!" etc etc. I actually agree with the ban, I just think that if this is applied consistently then there will be quite a few bans for swearing at the ref.

Would Sinckler have been cited and banned if he hadn't included the swear word. It's not necessarily the fact that rugby is moving towards football, just that society uses that sort of language as the norm these days...

BFG
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by BFG » Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:49 am

I think it's wrong to simply blame this on football antics creeping into rugger.
Personally I recall hearing not so good language in both.
I've watched quite a bit of sport during lockdown and football is currently being refereed much better than rugby in my opinion.
For example in football a two footed challenge is heavily sanctioned whether it makes contact or not.
Rugby is being refereed on outcome.
If Sincker's knees get done and he is carried off with his career in tatters then we'd be talking about the tackle instead of Sinckler's frustration.

JP14
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by JP14 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:48 am

sam16111986 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:35 pm
JP14 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:43 pm
In my opinion, (although admittedly could be biased as the incident did happen against Tigers), Hartley calling Barnsey a :censored: cheat is not the same as Sinckler reacting to a bad tackle and the two week ban is around about correct in my view.
Hartley was warned about his conduct shortly before his red card so certainly deserved a longer sentence. I think two weeks is a bit weak. Had it been four weeks reduced to two for previous good behaviour and saying sorry then that would been more satisfactory.

Mr Hartley's incident.

https://youtu.be/2EV-aM3j0kg
Well on his instagram he was blurting some kind of Cipriani-esque nonsense as a form of accepting responsibility. Yes 2 weeks does seem weak at first but when you remember that's on top of Prem Rugby's circuit breaker it's a de facto 4 week ban anyway.
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

kk20gb30
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by kk20gb30 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:23 am

Personally, would have preferred to see longer for Sinckler.
A future deterrent (for others ) as well as a punishment for this incident was/is required.Not sure that this suffices.

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by Crofty » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:50 pm

BFG wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:49 am
Rugby is being refereed on outcome.
If Sincker's knees get done and he is carried off with his career in tatters then we'd be talking about the tackle instead of Sinckler's frustration.
This is a great point that needs sorting, the obvious answer is to tell the refs to start hitting the cards harder (in this case perhaps even a red each) but of course this will just incite choruses of, "the game's gone soft" from former players for whom it seems to be that the older they get the tougher they was at least in the studio/on twitter.
No, not that one!

Remember, whatever you do to the smallest of the backs you do to his prop, and you can't avoid the rucks and mauls forever...

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by BengalTiger » Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:11 am

Cardiff Tig wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:54 am
sam16111986 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:37 pm
BengalTiger wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:49 pm
The citing of Sinckler totally undermines the ref, he heard the comment and dealt with it, what is the point in having a hearing, leave the refs to deal with it, if they do not see it or make a clear error OK but you must allow refs to remain in charge!
For me he should have got a yellow card, no way was it a red!
Dickson is a former teammate of Sinckler and hence probably cut him some slack. Sinckler swore at a referee that is a red card all day everyday immaterial of why he was complaining or how bad what he said was. This is rugby we complain about football antics creeping in and if you don't deal with cases like this then football antics is what you are going to get.
The problem is swearing at the ref is much more common these days. There's plenty of occasions when the ref has talked to the captain about players swearing at them e.g. Biggar, and noone has got cited or banned. Seems like double standards to charge Sinckler after the ref had spoke to him on the field.
As I said it is the undermining of the ref that is the real problem here, they cite the player for showing disrespect to the ref but the citing itself disrespects the ref, it used to be the ref's word was law, now it seems it is just anther opinion!
To my mind that is a bigger problem than a bit of colourful language.
I would have sent him off myself but Dickinson is there to make these decisions in the heat of battle not me, not Leon Lloyd et al.

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by ay2oh » Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:25 am

Tackling a players knees is highly dangerous and potentially career ending and should be penalised with a red card
A2O

Tiglon
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by Tiglon » Fri Jan 15, 2021 11:29 am

BengalTiger wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:11 am
Cardiff Tig wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:54 am
sam16111986 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:37 pm


Dickson is a former teammate of Sinckler and hence probably cut him some slack. Sinckler swore at a referee that is a red card all day everyday immaterial of why he was complaining or how bad what he said was. This is rugby we complain about football antics creeping in and if you don't deal with cases like this then football antics is what you are going to get.
The problem is swearing at the ref is much more common these days. There's plenty of occasions when the ref has talked to the captain about players swearing at them e.g. Biggar, and noone has got cited or banned. Seems like double standards to charge Sinckler after the ref had spoke to him on the field.
As I said it is the undermining of the ref that is the real problem here, they cite the player for showing disrespect to the ref but the citing itself disrespects the ref, it used to be the ref's word was law, now it seems it is just anther opinion!
To my mind that is a bigger problem than a bit of colourful language.
I would have sent him off myself but Dickinson is there to make these decisions in the heat of battle not me, not Leon Lloyd et al.
You're arguing that we should show referees respect by allowing a player to get away with showing the referee zero respect - that doesn't make sense and would only lead to less respect shown to referees. Dickson might be happy with players swearing at him, but that attitude just makes it more difficult for other referees.

The ref's word is not law, the law is law and referees are there to enforce it. When they fail, someone else needs to pick up the slack, as has been done in this case.

Wayne Richardson Fan Club
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club » Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:20 pm

Unfortunately at present far too many incidents are not being either picked up or officiated correctly on match days despite there being 3 on field officials plus one watching on TV.
To win is not as important as playing with style!

ay2oh
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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by ay2oh » Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:37 pm

Wayne Richardson Fan Club wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:20 pm
Unfortunately at present far too many incidents are not being either picked up or officiated correctly on match days despite there being 3 on field officials plus one watching on TV.
I appreciate that the referees have a difficult job but to my mind there is far too much inconsistency. The same infringement is treated differently by each ref. Also the laws around foul play are a farce to the extent that even when viewed multiple times by the TMO they still manage to come to the wrong conclusion. As fans all we want is consistency from week to week so that we know how these infringements are being policed . It is alright picking this foul play with the citing procedure but this doesn’t punish the team at the time and leads to fans questioning the impartiality of the officials.
A2O

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Re: Gallagher Premiership Round 6

Post by GETHIN EXILE » Fri Jan 15, 2021 2:17 pm

ay2oh wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:25 am
Tackling a players knees is highly dangerous and potentially career ending and should be penalised with a red card
When i was taught to play the game as an 11 year old some 50 years ago one of the maxims driven into us was "he can't run without legs!". Tackling a player around the knees was the norm as it brought them to the ground more quickly thus making the player release the ball. The problem with "modern rugby" is referees do not make the tackled player release the ball quickly enough, all this " tackler roll away" is concentrating on the wrong part of the tackle, until the ball is released or placed then the tackle is not complete. Too often a ruck is called when the tackled player is either holding the ball off the ground or still has a hand on top of the ball often with his hand behind the back foot of the last bound in defender.

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