Scott1 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:33 am
Great team,very much more than the sum of its parts. If you are picking a European 23 there wouldn’t be many players out of their squad you would pick. Baxter apparently had over 100 players to pick from at Exeter university and had some training software that no one had outside of the premiership so he did have a good start and works well with his 70 odd squad players. Interesting how they can have a squad that big tbf! Not to take anything away from their premiership exploits but it’s been a poor league for a while as European performances from our clubs show. There are * next to their Prem and European cups due to Sarries behaviour and there will be an * next to this one too with no one really to challenge them. Don’t like watching them and they make a peak AB and Leinster look like Saints with their in game shenanigans (which must be coached by Saint Baxter) and the love in makes me wretch!
Amused when Tigers supporters comment on the oppositions shenanigans / cheating. Ditto about the constant whinging about the quality of refereeing - when we lose - again and again. If Baxter had the wit to get his hands on software no one else had, good luck to him, for being one step ahead, is he supposed to try to be one step behind. Ditto access to Students. Having Loughborough University in spitting distance has hardly been a handicap to Leicester Tigers over the years. If it was a country Loughborough University would be ranked in the middle of the Olympic medal table. The athletic and research expertise there is literally as good as anywhere in the world.
Winners always write the history, shape the narrative, whilst the losers whinge about the winners. Only two things have made me wretch over the last few seasons. The love in of journalists with Saracens, when they actually knew that the club was corrupt; there is no suggestion Exeter are. Secondly, watching a Tigers team repeatedly capitulate and not care.
I look forward to the day when Exeter fans are writing about how Tigers have an unfair advantage, and cheat, and get an easy time in the media, and refs let them cheat, because it will mean we are winning again. I think we are.
You crack on being amused
And you can carry on whinging about the well deserved success of other clubs.
Exeter are deservedly European and Premiership champions AND the only premiership team to have been profitable in the last two full years (Covid excepting as I don't think anything has been published about 2019 finances). https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/ ... -june-2018
Personally think this is an incredible achievement - don't think any recent European winner has managed it without significant funds from a wealthy owner or a "very supportive" rugby body (i.e. for Leinster).
Once upon a time, this was Tigers - all the more reason I admire Exeter and what they have done/achieved. I imagine players join the club for salaries less than the market rate as they are keen to be part of a winning team. Use to happen at Tigers (according to Cockerill) - players voting with their feet!
Bristol Tiger wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:42 pm
Exeter are deservedly European and Premiership champions AND the only premiership team to have been profitable in the last two full years (Covid excepting as I don't think anything has been published about 2019 finances). https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/ ... -june-2018
Personally think this is an incredible achievement - don't think any recent European winner has managed it without significant funds from a wealthy owner or a "very supportive" rugby body (i.e. for Leinster).
Once upon a time, this was Tigers - all the more reason I admire Exeter and what they have done/achieved. I imagine players join the club for salaries less than the market rate as they are keen to be part of a winning team. Use to happen at Tigers (according to Cockerill) - players voting with their feet!
Overhyped? No. Premiership and European champions - very few clubs have achieved that.
As for the journey, well it probably is hyped up a bit, it wouldn't have been possible without the money behind them. It certainly isn't rags to riches - more a case of riches to successful riches. However, which other club has won the European Cup so soon after making it to the top division for the first time ever? This wasn't a top club returning to the top division (like almost every other club that's ever been promoted to the Premiership) - I think they only spent one season in the Championship, before that they were in the tier below. Journos are always looking for a story to tell, and this is an obvious one so no surprises that it is being talked about.
All clubs spend equally because of the cap? That's a bit naive. Some clearly don't spend up to the cap. Some do spend up to the cap but still couldn't afford players like Piutau or Randrada, let alone both of them! Some clubs can't tempt players with brand new state of the art facilities. What's the betting Pat Lam is one of the best paid DoR's or HC's in the world?
People ask how Chiefs can afford their squad - perhaps they can now get players on lower salaries because they have other benefits (i.e. winning things), just like Bristol have their facilities etc. Would you take £200k to play for Exeter, £225k to play for Bristol or £250k to play for Worcester? Assuming you're in the first XV for whichever you choose, I suspect few would consider Worcester in that scenario. So, no, the salary cap does not mean all teams are equal.
Scott1 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:33 pm
the only premiership team to have been profitable in the last two full years
This is where I get a little wary, assuming Exeter spend up to the cap, and have a gate of 50% less than of Tigers, how can they possibly produce a profit unless they charge double what Tigers charge?
I know this is being simplistic but the owner of Exeter also owns their main sponsor so we will never know how much cross subsidy is occurring and how much expense is being taken off book to make the story more fairy tale than it really is.
I for one will be pleased when the refs start to police the dubious practices that Exeter have made their trademark, however I also waited for the AB's to be picked up when Mr McCaw was plying his questionable trade!
Have to be careful what I say as it’s a public forum. But sometimes I think about the boxers who shout the loudest about their opponents taking peds and then end up testing positive for them
"Rugby isn't a contact sport,ballroom dancing is a contact sport. Rugby is a collision sport" Heyneke Meyer
I'm sure we've been round the issue of revenue from gate receipts etc before. Last time, someone said that Exeter have the highest ticket prices in the league. Also, approximately one third of revenue is from gate receipts, the remainder being RFU hand-outs, TV, commercial activities etc. A friend of mine works for one of the Chief's sponsors and he tells me that hospitality is a big deal at Sandy Park. So, largest crowd does not necessarily equate to ability to spend up to the cap.
Scott1 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:33 pm
the only premiership team to have been profitable in the last two full years
This is where I get a little wary, assuming Exeter spend up to the cap, and have a gate of 50% less than of Tigers, how can they possibly produce a profit unless they charge double what Tigers charge?
I know this is being simplistic but the owner of Exeter also owns their main sponsor so we will never know how much cross subsidy is occurring and how much expense is being taken off book to make the story more fairy tale than it really is.
I for one will be pleased when the refs start to police the dubious practices that Exeter have made their trademark, however I also waited for the AB's to be picked up when Mr McCaw was plying his questionable trade!
I wouldn't read too much into published profitability of professional rugby clubs, there is a lot going on there.
For example, Chiefs posted around £200k in depreciation in 2018 and 2019, whereas Tigers' was £1.3m both years. Take that out, and both clubs were profitable. Personally, I would take EBITDA (earnings before interest, taxation, depreciation and amortisation) as gauge of profitability. Depreciation is basically an imaginary number - but I would say that because I'm an operator not an accountant.
Profit and profit are not always the same things. To say Chiefs were profitable and Tigers were not is a huge simplification and doesn't necessarily indicate that one is better run and more sustainable than the other.
Worth noting that Tigers pay £1.2m more than Chiefs in payroll costs. Sounds like we are overpaying salaries or employing too many people...
h's dad wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 5:21 pm
I think you're conflating facts with opinions, guesses and errors. HNY.
It’s an opinion they get away with murder then? Yeah ok lol HNY
If we're being accurate, we should probably say it's a lie that they get away with murder...
Sorry Scott 1. I bet you wish you'd never expressed an opinion (which is what the forum is about) and I wish I'd not responded in such a nibbly manner. So in the spirit of a better New Year over the horizon and a wave goodbye to an ugly 2021 time to draw stumps. A genuinely Happy New Year to all.
