Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

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Big Dai
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Big Dai » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:17 pm

Over simplification again but.

Take off their second try for in at the side.

Add Genge's effort and a conversion.

Forgive George's abotion of a kick to the corner and add the three points he should have taken.

.......With due respect to Bill

Keep the Faith.
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Truefollower » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm

In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.

OakhamTiger32
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by OakhamTiger32 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:21 pm

Truefollower wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm
In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.
And how many times did they show the potential Lavanini swinging arm high tackle so desperate to get him sent off.. pathetic
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Big Dai
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Big Dai » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:22 pm

Truefollower wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm
In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.
+1
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Crofty » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:23 pm

loretta wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:16 pm
OakhamTiger32 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:12 pm
Jimmy Skitz wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:09 pm
sorry Tigerbeat I'm not having that first time they have played together thing be an excuse that is totally within our control and we CHOSE not to do it, apparently targeting the Challenge cup, well then in that case why on earth didn't we play that back line together when we had the chance, you you and others on here explained away odd selections?
The reason we lost wasn’t because our back line hadn’t played together.. it was a frustrating combination of poor kicking, missed tackles, poor calls by the officials and Toulon taking their chances. That’s it. Frustrating night but we have to move on... better team won.. could have been different but we can’t argue with the fact that the better team won.
I can
Me too, their first two tries shouldn't have stood, the 5m scrum penalty they won by having their tight head belly flop, Genge's try that was off a pass that was no more forward than one they scored off, dozens of other little things around the park. Have the game officiated properly and it's likely we're talking about Leicester dog, a gritty win against the odds, Tigers winning ugly like we have so many times before...

Granted it'd be a win we shouldn't have got but we're going to need a few of those I think to kick start the recovery.
Last edited by Crofty on Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by daktari » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:26 pm

Cardiff Tig wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:16 pm
I actually don't think the officiating made a bit of difference. I agree it was poor though.

The first try was one of those things that gets missed plenty of times in every match,
I think that’s the problem - the TMO should have checked, the question has to be asked, why didn’t he? It’s what they are there for - everyone else with a screen saw it, what was he doing?
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by MCC1964 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:29 pm

Big Dai wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:17 pm
Over simplification again but.

Take off their second try for in at the side.

Add Genge's effort and a conversion.

Forgive George's abotion of a kick to the corner and add the three points he should have taken.

.......With due respect to Bill

Keep the Faith.
Ah yes, but you’re assuming that from the first point of the game that you say should be different (their second try) that what actually happened would still have happened. Very unlikely, if not impossible to say with any degree of certainty.

I’ll get me coat...... :smt004

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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by WiggoTiger » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:32 pm

He wanted toulon in the final. French producers go to the crowd before bothering to show passages of play. In UK BT show contentious decisions over and over for the TMO.
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by OakhamTiger32 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:33 pm

Crofty wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:23 pm
loretta wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:16 pm
OakhamTiger32 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:12 pm


The reason we lost wasn’t because our back line hadn’t played together.. it was a frustrating combination of poor kicking, missed tackles, poor calls by the officials and Toulon taking their chances. That’s it. Frustrating night but we have to move on... better team won.. could have been different but we can’t argue with the fact that the better team won.
I can
Me too, their first two tries shouldn't have stood, the 5m scrum penalty they won by having their tight head belly flop, Genge's try that was off a pass that was no more forward than one they scored off, dozens of other little things around the park. Have the game officiated properly and it's likely we're talking about Leicester dog, a gritty win against the odds, Tigers winning ugly like we have so many times before...

Granted it'd be a win we shouldn't have got but we're going to need a few of those I think to kick start the recovery.
So I agree that their first 2 tries shouldn’t have stood and I agree that the 5m scrum was our penalty all day long but Genge’s try was a forward pass.. close call but it was forward. Take all of that into account and it’s game on at 20-19 to them.. add in the usual Ford display and we win. But over the 80 minutes, poor officials or not I think they played the better rugby. We had too many missed tackles, missed kicks, poor box kicks, kicks that went dead and poor decision making. I am as frustrated at the diabolical officiating as everyone else but I don’t think we played well enough to win that over the 80 minutes sadly
Last edited by OakhamTiger32 on Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Big Dai
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Big Dai » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:34 pm

MCC1964 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:29 pm
Big Dai wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:17 pm
Over simplification again but.

Take off their second try for in at the side.

Add Genge's effort and a conversion.

Forgive George's abotion of a kick to the corner and add the three points he should have taken.

.......With due respect to Bill

Keep the Faith.
Ah yes, but you’re assuming that from the first point of the game that you say should be different (their second try) that what actually happened would still have happened. Very unlikely, if not impossible to say with any degree of certainty.

I’ll get me coat...... :smt004
...... I'm sorry I'll read that agsin....
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Scuttle » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:42 pm

Truefollower wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm
In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.
+1
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MCC1964
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by MCC1964 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:01 pm

Scuttle wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:42 pm
Truefollower wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm
In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.
+1

To be fair, though, Jaco should have / could have been carded for a high tackle at one point so Toulon weren’t the only ones to benefit from shocking officiating and/or TV coverage.

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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by westwinds31 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:20 pm

There’s some positives in there for sure, but the alarming inconsistency at 9 and 10, from two of our most experienced operators is a worry. I mean, an off day yes, but (I think) at 14-21....we kick to the corner....and the ball goes dead. Take the 3 please !! The amount of kicks that went dead. The exits that gave possession right back to Toulon.

Anyone who can’t see an improvement may as well give up. New squad, coaches & playbook. Best performance from Genge for a while, Cole snarling....Lavanini’s hit after hit, Scott, Nadolo, Potter...our attack is a lot better. Between now and next season we have to work so so hard, and come out firing.

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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Scuttle » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:28 pm

MCC1964 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:01 pm
Scuttle wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:42 pm
Truefollower wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:18 pm
In the 35 years I have followed this team I have never seen such inept officiating, we were probably not going to win but with a referee with a modicum of knowledge of the rules of the game and non FRENCH touch judges and TV official we may of had a chance. The whole event in my opinion brings the integrity of the competition into disrepute and should be viewed as a skewed match. On the whole we were better than the final score suggests, the tackling needs to improve however our attack is showing green shoots. The Lavanini yellow was a farce promoted by the FRENCH 4th official, it wasn't even a tackle. I believe we are seeing improvements as a squad.
+1

To be fair, though, Jaco should have / could have been carded for a high tackle at one point so Toulon weren’t the only ones to benefit from shocking officiating and/or TV coverage.
That's true but Taute was "lucky" the ref was playing an advantage and they scored so things moved on....if it was the passage of play I am thinking of. However, I think if Toulon play like that against Bristol, Bristol will put a cricket score on them.
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Re: Toulon v Tigers - Challenge Cup Semi

Post by Offside » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:40 pm

OakhamTiger32 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:55 pm
Crofty wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:51 pm
Scott1 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:45 pm
Can’t believe people are still clinging to the officiating excuses! Time to wake up and smell the coffee for Gods sake!
We didn't deserve to win that game, but neither did Toulon and if the game had been officiated fairly its entirely possible that they didn't deserve to win a little bit more than we didn't...
My thoughts exactly! We were very poor but given that their first 2 tries should have been penalties to us their 20-11 should have been 11-6 to us.. the better team on balance won but you can’t help but think had a decent referee been in charge then maybe things might have been different. Shame..
This would be my analysis too. Once you start chasing the fame the metaphorical wheels fell of George and a few others. All did carry on going though. A win from the remaining fixtures is important for momentum into next season.

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