LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

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RichieB
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by RichieB » Tue Jul 21, 2020 10:19 am

Just watched the Brink highlights posted above. I know they are highlights, but what a difference to what we have seen recently at Welford Road. Breaking the first tackle, getting over the game line, drawing in multiple defenders, off-loading where appropriate. Last few years we have seen a lot of our ball carriers at first receiver getting knocked backwards from the first tackle.

Let us hope Brink can Bring it to WR.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Dangerous4 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:43 pm

RichieB wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 10:19 am
Just watched the Brink highlights posted above. I know they are highlights, but what a difference to what we have seen recently at Welford Road. Breaking the first tackle, getting over the game line, drawing in multiple defenders, off-loading where appropriate. Last few years we have seen a lot of our ball carriers at first receiver getting knocked backwards from the first tackle.

Let us hope Brink can Bring it to WR.
I watched it myself, and Brink looked like a human battering ram.

Highly astute signings all round, and also clever. We shall be able to keep the nucleus of the team together all season, allowing players to gel even more. All good news. :smt023

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by TigerFeetSteve » Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:43 pm

https://twitter.com/Argentina_2027/stat ... 10115?s=19

This is a tweet from the guy in Argentina who was the first source to link us to Moroni, and has been getting accurate information on the Jaguares destinations in Europe in general.

He seems to think Montoya is going to be announced within the next few days
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Mark62 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:55 pm

TigerFeetSteve wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:43 pm
https://twitter.com/Argentina_2027/stat ... 10115?s=19

This is a tweet from the guy in Argentina who was the first source to link us to Moroni, and has been getting accurate information on the Jaguares destinations in Europe in general.

He seems to think Montoya is going to be announced within the next few days
You wonder with very little rugby likely for the Jaguares before next March, whether he will come for the 20/21 season, with a release clause for the Pumas

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by ABClub » Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:57 pm

Mark62 wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:55 pm
TigerFeetSteve wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:43 pm
https://twitter.com/Argentina_2027/stat ... 10115?s=19

This is a tweet from the guy in Argentina who was the first source to link us to Moroni, and has been getting accurate information on the Jaguares destinations in Europe in general.

He seems to think Montoya is going to be announced within the next few days
You wonder with very little rugby likely for the Jaguares before next March, whether he will come for the 20/21 season, with a release clause for the Pumas
It would be a huge coup for the coming season (i.e. the one due to start in Nov/Dec) to have Montoya here. He's so good in the loose you could pretty much play him at flanker given we've got a solid set of hookers already.

That said I'd pick Montoya at hooker and really target the opposition at scrum time with one of the best hookers in international rugby partnered by our strong set of props.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Mark62 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:14 pm

ABClub wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:57 pm
Mark62 wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:55 pm
TigerFeetSteve wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:43 pm
https://twitter.com/Argentina_2027/stat ... 10115?s=19

This is a tweet from the guy in Argentina who was the first source to link us to Moroni, and has been getting accurate information on the Jaguares destinations in Europe in general.

He seems to think Montoya is going to be announced within the next few days
You wonder with very little rugby likely for the Jaguares before next March, whether he will come for the 20/21 season, with a release clause for the Pumas
It would be a huge coup for the coming season (i.e. the one due to start in Nov/Dec) to have Montoya here. He's so good in the loose you could pretty much play him at flanker given we've got a solid set of hookers already.

That said I'd pick Montoya at hooker and really target the opposition at scrum time with one of the best hookers in international rugby partnered by our strong set of props.
Totally agree. So much is up in the air at the moment. Not sure if the Pumas had any test matches lined up for November, but they must surely be in doubt. Even if they had some games, possibly arrange a January 1st start with Tom Youngs retiring to the farm. So many variables it is impossible to predict anything, with any certainty.

As an aside if Tom Youngs does retire, I hope he and the Youngs family are given the respect they deserve for truly being a one club family.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by ABClub » Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:50 pm

I really hope Tom plays on for a year or two yet without the burden of captaincy during a rough time for the club and himself.

His form has dropped over the last few years, I've been as critical as others of him still being an automatic starter, but he's still a good Premiership player. It's not Tom's fault that he's remained an automatic starter regardless of his form due to a lack of competition after poor player recruitment. It certainly isn't his fault he's been captain during a poor period for the club on the pitch. Being viewed as a good captain largely comes down to the players you're leading more than anything else.

I hope Tom can play on for a more successful couple of seasons under a stronger coaching set-up and alongside a better squad. He was a brilliant player for Tigers and deservedly a winning Lions tourist at his best. With everything he's been through I'd be over the moon to see him sign off in a few years time with us hopefully back in Champions Cup qualification and pushing the play-offs again.

The senior side has a long way to go but realistically there is a big drop off from Sarries (asterisk there I know) and Chiefs to the chasing pack of Sale, Bristol and Saints. There is then another big drop off to the mid/lower mid table clubs. I don't think Tigers are two years away from challenging full strength Chiefs but we should be targeting 5/6th in the table that fairly average Bath and Wasps sides currently occupy ASAP.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by TigerFeetSteve » Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:06 pm

ABClub wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:50 pm
I really hope Tom plays on for a year or two yet without the burden of captaincy during a rough time for the club and himself.

His form has dropped over the last few years, I've been as critical as others of him still being an automatic starter, but he's still a good Premiership player. It's not Tom's fault that he's remained an automatic starter regardless of his form due to a lack of competition after poor player recruitment. It certainly isn't his fault he's been captain during a poor period for the club on the pitch. Being viewed as a good captain largely comes down to the players you're leading more than anything else.

I hope Tom can play on for a more successful couple of seasons under a stronger coaching set-up and alongside a better squad. He was a brilliant player for Tigers and deservedly a winning Lions tourist at his best. With everything he's been through I'd be over the moon to see him sign off in a few years time with us hopefully back in Champions Cup qualification and pushing the play-offs again.

The senior side has a long way to go but realistically there is a big drop off from Sarries (asterisk there I know) and Chiefs to the chasing pack of Sale, Bristol and Saints. There is then another big drop off to the mid/lower mid table clubs. I don't think Tigers are two years away from challenging full strength Chiefs but we should be targeting 5/6th in the table that fairly average Bath and Wasps sides currently occupy ASAP.
Think OTY has (prior to pandrmics) already suggested his plans are likely to retire at the end of the 20/21 season. Montoya is a world class replacement. If we need to take him now we should as players of his caliber are rare to find. Add him to Clare, Kerr, Mamukashvili & Youngs that leaves us 5 hookers, normal circumstances I'd say that's too many. 2 quality young ones coming through and 2 international class hookers would suggest that OTY would be the more logical choice to step aside (however much my sentiment says otherwise).
To counter that with midweek and compressed seasons we could probably just about keep them content even if OTY doesn't get huge game time....
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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Traveller » Tue Jul 21, 2020 5:13 pm

TigerFeetSteve wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:06 pm
ABClub wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:50 pm
I really hope Tom plays on for a year or two yet without the burden of captaincy during a rough time for the club and himself.

His form has dropped over the last few years, I've been as critical as others of him still being an automatic starter, but he's still a good Premiership player. It's not Tom's fault that he's remained an automatic starter regardless of his form due to a lack of competition after poor player recruitment. It certainly isn't his fault he's been captain during a poor period for the club on the pitch. Being viewed as a good captain largely comes down to the players you're leading more than anything else.

I hope Tom can play on for a more successful couple of seasons under a stronger coaching set-up and alongside a better squad. He was a brilliant player for Tigers and deservedly a winning Lions tourist at his best. With everything he's been through I'd be over the moon to see him sign off in a few years time with us hopefully back in Champions Cup qualification and pushing the play-offs again.

The senior side has a long way to go but realistically there is a big drop off from Sarries (asterisk there I know) and Chiefs to the chasing pack of Sale, Bristol and Saints. There is then another big drop off to the mid/lower mid table clubs. I don't think Tigers are two years away from challenging full strength Chiefs but we should be targeting 5/6th in the table that fairly average Bath and Wasps sides currently occupy ASAP.
Think OTY has (prior to pandrmics) already suggested his plans are likely to retire at the end of the 20/21 season. Montoya is a world class replacement. If we need to take him now we should as players of his caliber are rare to find. Add him to Clare, Kerr, Mamukashvili & Youngs that leaves us 5 hookers, normal circumstances I'd say that's too many. 2 quality young ones coming through and 2 international class hookers would suggest that OTY would be the more logical choice to step aside (however much my sentiment says otherwise).
To counter that with midweek and compressed seasons we could probably just about keep them content even if OTY doesn't get huge game time....
The very first Tigers Values that is being posted on boards and in full view during LLTV interviews is 'Club First' & followed by 'Tough'. Given the fact that Tom Youngs is the epitome of Club First, irrespective of his form from match to match, I doubt very much if he would object to Sr Montoya joining tomorrow if it made the squad even more competitive - which it surely would do. It shouldn't be beyond the wit and wisdom of a first class coaching team to make all the players feel valued for a year, and if Messrs Clare & Kerr are the players we think they are (and I am sure they are), then presumably they too would would like to be able to learn by training alongside one of the worlds leading hookers. If we have the chance - snap him up. Walk the walk - Club First - Tough.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Mark62 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:18 pm

Following my comment above, please don’t think I’m desperate to pension OTY off early, I was just suggesting a possible course of action should Montoya come early, whilst keeping Mamukashvili and Kerr happy.
I’m sure Tom would be happy spending time with his prize winning pigs anyway.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Knightonian » Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:54 pm

Maybe we could mould Tom’s later years into being a third or fourth choice who spends his days chopping wood and tipping cows - Julian White styley- Farmer strong

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by johnthegriff » Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:11 pm

I could be wrong of course but I see nothing in Mamakashvili's record that indicates he has come here to start ahead of Tom Youngs, to me he seems to be experienced cover to compete for a bench spot with Kerr. Monyoya joining would I am sure be as a starter for the big games, Kerr I feel needs to step up to replace Tom, he looks capable of doing this but has not done so yet. With the new signings plus developing youngsters I think we are going to have genuine competition for places throughout the team, I think our D.O.R and Head Coach are going to have weekly problems of the right sort when it comes to selection.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Mark62 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:24 pm

johnthegriff wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:11 pm
I could be wrong of course but I see nothing in Mamakashvili's record that indicates he has come here to start ahead of Tom Youngs, to me he seems to be experienced cover to compete for a bench spot with Kerr. Monyoya joining would I am sure be as a starter for the big games, Kerr I feel needs to step up to replace Tom, he looks capable of doing this but has not done so yet. With the new signings plus developing youngsters I think we are going to have genuine competition for places throughout the team, I think our D.O.R and Head Coach are going to have weekly problems of the right sort when it comes to selection.
Good point JTG, he is a 70 capped international, admittedly for a tier 2 nation, and Borthwick will know him well, as the Georgians have trained against England.
IMO it will start as a level playing field, but were Montoya to arrive early, one would probably have to take a bit of a step back, and the obvious candidate would be OTY, given Kerrs age and that Mamukashvili has only just arrived.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by kk20gb30 » Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:49 am

Strength and depth of squad is vital.Aside from reputation - however it has been garnered - I would sincerely hope that form becomes and remains a deciding factor in the selection process.Whether this has always been the case is open to debate.

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Re: LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD EPISODE IV: A New Hope

Post by Traveller » Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:06 am

kk20gb30 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:49 am
Strength and depth of squad is vital.Aside from reputation - however it has been garnered - I would sincerely hope that form becomes and remains a deciding factor in the selection process.Whether this has always been the case is open to debate.
You are being very diplomatic, but in recent years there has been no correlation between form and selection. I agree with your sentiment - that is what we need to get back to.

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