LEICESTER TIGERS 2020/21 SQUAD/TRANSFERS/CONTRACT THREAD Part 2

[chewbacca]

Que Sera. I don't mind if Manu joins another English club. He can occupy a large amount of their cap and not play many games for them instead. Bit of a win for Tigers.

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Unless Tigers are paying half his wages...

[GB72]

It may sound insane but I do not think that too many English clubs would want him. Over the next year there is the potential for more international absence than usual and those injury worries will not simply go away. If he had no ties to the club and was playing elsewhere, would you see Manu as a good signing for the Tigers at the wages he would expect, I am not sure that I would. No doubt he can change a game and I am not questioning his quality but as value for money, I just do not think it is there. Clubs abroad may see more value in that it would end his international absence.

[rdracup]

Unless Tigers are paying half his wages...

Have I missed something but if we pay we decide if he plays and who he plays for surely. He can sit in his home gym until he agrees settlement with us and then moves on. He will be claiming compensation for his lost 25% but we need not hurry. Obviously at end of contact (soon?) He can move on and the claim may have some force. Haven’t read full thread so may have been covered already.

[mol2]

Being reported that Manu is willing to go to another Premiership club on less money ! That for me is rubbing salt in after all Tigers have done for him over the last 10 years!

From that you can only suspect that Tigers may well be paying a chunk of that in compensation or contractually binding payments.

[Mark62]

I think until confirmation is given by a lawyer with contract knowledge we are all somewhat in the dark

[GB72]

Whilst not my particular area of practice, my understanding is that these fixed term sporting contracts can only be terminated by mutual consent unless either party can show a material breach which would allow the contract to be cancelled by the non breaching party and for damages to be sought. Obviously they are all different and so there is no one solid answer but this is my general understanding.

[Traveller]

Just caught this,be interesting to see who breaks the pact. Any takers?

"In principle, the leading English clubs are thought to have made a pact not to poach each other's players in the event of universal pay cuts creating the threat of a mass exodus. This was a stance to try to force players to accept lower wages and stop them claiming the shortfall later."

or which player decides to sue them under competition laws, all clubs agreeing not to do something which stifles competition is highly suspect, no matter how well meaning.

Also I wouldn't rule out Manu eventually re-signing, so long as he is under contact the door should be open, same for the other players

Pretty certain if there is an 'informal agreement' pact, informal cartel, call it what you will then the clubs would lose in any case bought against them under competition / restraint of trade and rightly so.

[kend]

My overwhelming feeling about this is sadness. Particularly over Manu.

Hard to judge fault. We don't know what discussions went on between the parties or why they failed. I think you can be certain the relationship between those players and the club broke down catastrophically. The club will obviously create a narrative of reasonableness and have the platform to do so (IMHO the 'tigers family' bit has long been a marketing device, not a reality). I wonder how much past actions have influenced the present situation; I recall Veainu tweeting out his disillusionment over the manner of Mauger's departure.

I imagine Manu's destination will depend on his discussions with Jones and England. My expectation is he will be playing at Sale or Quins unless the amounts of Euro on offer in France are too much to turn down. The club has said the players have left so any notional 'pact' will be null anyway as they are free agents.

What is done is done. In the hands of m'learned friends and the intricacies of contract law.

[CitizenSmiff]

I'm gutted to see him go, the Tuilagi dynasty has been a powerful draw since my first game at WR as a nipper and this is a rubbish way for it to end.

[Tiglon]

If Tigers unilaterally terminated Tuilagi's contract for no good reason and he was only able to get a contract at another club on a lower wage, he could well be entitled to claim the difference as compensation for damages arising from breach of contract.

However, I don't think that is the situation. I understand he is still employed and I assume is still being paid. I can only think he is still being paid in full because otherwise he could claim breach of contract and sue for the full amount for the remainder of his contract. If those assumptions are correct, he cannot join another club without himself breaching contract - he would have to ask to be released, hence mutual agreement, hence no possibility of Tigers having to pay the difference.

If he could argue constructive dismissal then that would be different, but as trendylfj pointed out that is very unlikely. Being paid your full salary in return for doing zero work would probably not be seen as enough to give you no option but to quit. On reflection I strongly agree. Surely one of the foundations of any professional sports contract is that the club decides who plays and who doesn't - no judge is going to rule that failure to select a player constitutes constructive dismissal, that would set a terrifying precedent.

The problem is, he could sit at home, do nothing, and receive his full salary (although if he's not playing for Tigers, he is unlikely to get in the England squad and earn his match fees). Tigers have to pay him and it still counts towards the cap. No one wins in that situation, but if he is really that bitter then perhaps he is willing to cut off his nose to spite his face.


As for clubs agreeing not to sign players in this situation:

a) prove it.
b) if you can, the clubs may lose the case and be fined, but there's no way the court will force a club to employ anyone so the player still loses out. Plus that case takes a couple of years, by which point if the clubs are still in business then they've succeeded. Better to stay afloat and maybe pay a fine in 2 years time than go under now.

[Mark62]

My overwhelming feeling about this is sadness. Particularly over Manu.

Hard to judge fault. We don't know what discussions went on between the parties or why they failed. I think you can be certain the relationship between those players and the club broke down catastrophically. The club will obviously create a narrative of reasonableness and have the platform to do so (IMHO the 'tigers family' bit has long been a marketing device, not a reality). I wonder how much past actions have influenced the present situation; I recall Veainu tweeting out his disillusionment over the manner of Mauger's departure.

I imagine Manu's destination will depend on his discussions with Jones and England. My expectation is he will be playing at Sale or Quins unless the amounts of Euro on offer in France are too much to turn down. The club has said the players have left so any notional 'pact' will be null anyway as they are free agents.

What is done is done. In the hands of m'learned friends and the intricacies of contract law.

Agree with a lot of what you say except Manus destination. With Marchant returning can’t see him going to Quins, and as been commented Sale sorted things out early and I doubt they would want his arrival to possibly cause issues.
France or Japan for me, Jones has ample cover at 13 with Slade or Joseph

[Mark62]

I'm gutted to see him go, the Tuilagi dynasty has been a powerful draw since my first game at WR as a nipper and this is a rubbish way for it to end.

Controversial I know but that dynasty has caused many issues within the ranks over the years

[Tiglon]

As for Manu's destination, Rugby League may still be a possibility. Failing that, I'd guess France.

Imagine you're a Premiership player who's just agreed a pay cut because your club tells you they can't afford your contract and has sold you a story about "doing it for the club" and "we're in this together", then you find out they have enough cash to shell out a few hundred thousand at short notice for an injury prone 29 year old with disciplinary issues. Nope.

[jgriffin]

Interesting.

the LTTV interview is very good. Its very clear, and the justifications of the circumstances are now much clearer. I have to say she and the club do come across much better than the press lead us all to believe.

Its now starting to become clear that the other clubs are a) not a PLC, b) saying things are great when it might only be a short term success they have.

I hope my change of view isn't going to lead to further disappointment.

I would be very sad if Taufua goes on top of Veainu (HE was only just coming good again after the broken jaw that significantly affected him).

No one will have the budget for the big ticket losses in the UK - and then France and Japan leads to a loss of England. I guess the people leaving just didnt get the money or length of contract they wanted.

You can’t have watched the same thing I did. Bleating on about ‘#tigersfamily’ and at the same time berating the media for leaking this. Come on. This whole situation is disgraceful. This is not a brave new dawn. It’s an all time low. I’ve never felt like this about this club before, I feel absolutely disgusted by their antipathy towards their own staff and supporters.

Don't recognise Duncan B's post in the TV broadcast or the position we are in, rather it's starting afresh after an awful couple or more of years (complete with disappearing stars) with a good coaching team and a pile of players who want to be there, during an awful time for the planet. I have never bought the "TigersFamily" thing since they banned us from the old bars BUT there was no 'bleating'.