J. MAY ESQ.

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Smudge
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by Smudge »

I too am very unhappy with Jonny leaving but the elephant in the room is the months our best players are away playing for England during the season. Its :censored: ridiculous and has to change or the club game will fold spectacularly.
Look what happened to county cricket with central contracts. Hampshire (where I live now) had Kevin Peterson signed as a player but we never saw him. CC has broken the counties, everyone of which is struggling. A Complete joke. I would move the six nations and the AIs to the summer. Yes it would affect the SH club's tours but frankly, we have to take care of business at home before considering them. .
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LE18
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by LE18 »

His new contract with Glous starts 1st July, so he could end up playing against us if the current season extends beyond that date! Could there be a row brewing over contract dates, 1st July effects most players moving club?
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by JP14 »

As long as contracts are signed I can’t see the issue. The only issue is that Gloucester will have access to May before we have access to Nadalo because I believe he is still in France, so if clubs are signing players from July 1 who are currently oversees they might not be able to arrive for the recommencing of the season (if that goes ahead) straight away.

Lots of ifs and buts, proves the right mess everything is in right now.
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TigerBoy1880
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by TigerBoy1880 »

LE18 wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:57 pm His new contract with Glous starts 1st July, so he could end up playing against us if the current season extends beyond that date! Could there be a row brewing over contract dates, 1st July effects most players moving club?
I was briefly reading something along these lines. If May has signed a 3 year contract from 1st July 2020, will Gloucester really be happy about him not actually starting until December, for example where they only get 2.5 years of him? It could get messy.
LE18
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by LE18 »

TigerBoy1880 wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:30 pm
LE18 wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:57 pm His new contract with Glous starts 1st July, so he could end up playing against us if the current season extends beyond that date! Could there be a row brewing over contract dates, 1st July effects most players moving club?
I was briefly reading something along these lines. If May has signed a 3 year contract from 1st July 2020, will Gloucester really be happy about him not actually starting until December, for example where they only get 2.5 years of him? It could get messy.
It certainly could, I understand that all Professional Contacts in UK end on 30th June and new ones start on 1st July, I'm not sure if that applies elsewhere so cannot speculate on Nadolo.
Old Hob
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by Old Hob »

The concerns over contracts are;
1) If the season is extended does the player take up the new contract immediately and potentially play against his old club? (This also means that the club that started the season doesn't finish it in terms of registration)
2) If the old club insists he stays and fulfils his contract is this restraint of trade?
3) If player x joins club y on July 1st as usual and the old season is extended to finish in (say) August does his salary count against the cap for the season 2019/20 or 2020/21?
Answers on the back of a very large cheque to your lawyers.
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voice of the crumbie
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by voice of the crumbie »

Old Hob wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:57 pm The concerns over contracts are;
1) If the season is extended does the player take up the new contract immediately and potentially play against his old club? (This also means that the club that started the season doesn't finish it in terms of registration)
2) If the old club insists he stays and fulfils his contract is this restraint of trade?
3) If player x joins club y on July 1st as usual and the old season is extended to finish in (say) August does his salary count against the cap for the season 2019/20 or 2020/21?
Answers on the back of a very large cheque to your lawyers.
To me it seems there is a very simple way to cut through all this. There are 2 scenarios:

1. This season is eventually completed. In this scenario all players stay with existing clubs unti l their season is finished and then move to new club. For salary cap purposes current club pays up to leaving date at which point new club takes over.
2. This season is written off. In this scenario players move to new club as soon as is practically possible (I'd imagine clubs and players would want this). For salary cap purposes current club pays up to leaving date at which point new club takes over.

In both scenarios to save things dragging on and to enable the salary cap to work effectively for next season PRL agree a date by which all moves need to be completed and that the new season's salary cap starts from then. That date will be determined by whichever scenario described above plays out. If an added "incentive" is required to ensure the new salary cap start date is adhered to if any player does not move by that date then both clubs involved will be deemed to have broken the salary cap regulations and be fined an agreed amount per player.

The above applies only to player moves between premiership clubs. Where a player moves to/from a non-premiership club that will be managed as it is now between the 2 clubs in question and the player will cease to fall under the premiership salary cap when he leaves and join the salary cap when he joins.

I believe that all that is required for PRL to sanction this process and away we go.
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by fleabane »

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/leic ... 6c70c2cf38

Article in today’s Times by Stuart Barnes, making sense of May’s departure from the clubs point of view.

One international class winger being replaced with another international class winger (Nadolo) for much less money, and one who will not be missing for 4 months next season.
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JP14
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by JP14 »

Perhaps an amalgamation of this season and next season might be best, but that could be really messy contract wise, however it would ensure not much rugby is lost because of the plan by the RFU to have a 7 test autumn international scenario.
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TomWeston
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by TomWeston »

voice of the crumbie wrote: Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:23 am
Old Hob wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:57 pm The concerns over contracts are;
1) If the season is extended does the player take up the new contract immediately and potentially play against his old club? (This also means that the club that started the season doesn't finish it in terms of registration)
2) If the old club insists he stays and fulfils his contract is this restraint of trade?
3) If player x joins club y on July 1st as usual and the old season is extended to finish in (say) August does his salary count against the cap for the season 2019/20 or 2020/21?
Answers on the back of a very large cheque to your lawyers.
To me it seems there is a very simple way to cut through all this. There are 2 scenarios:

1. This season is eventually completed. In this scenario all players stay with existing clubs unti l their season is finished and then move to new club. For salary cap purposes current club pays up to leaving date at which point new club takes over.
2. This season is written off. In this scenario players move to new club as soon as is practically possible (I'd imagine clubs and players would want this). For salary cap purposes current club pays up to leaving date at which point new club takes over.

In both scenarios to save things dragging on and to enable the salary cap to work effectively for next season PRL agree a date by which all moves need to be completed and that the new season's salary cap starts from then. That date will be determined by whichever scenario described above plays out. If an added "incentive" is required to ensure the new salary cap start date is adhered to if any player does not move by that date then both clubs involved will be deemed to have broken the salary cap regulations and be fined an agreed amount per player.

The above applies only to player moves between premiership clubs. Where a player moves to/from a non-premiership club that will be managed as it is now between the 2 clubs in question and the player will cease to fall under the premiership salary cap when he leaves and join the salary cap when he joins.

I believe that all that is required for PRL to sanction this process and away we go.
Surely players’ contracts are governed by end dates of the contract of employment not of RFU Premiership seasons. As such you would expect Jonny to be a Glos player on 1st July come what May.
Wayne Richardson Fan Club
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club »

The issue contract wise us how the salary cap is worked out, is in as per the season or contract period ie 1st July to 30th June, if it's the season then unless everyone becomes cheats as per Sarries in won't work, reports suggest meetings to clarify between PRA, PRL & RFU.
I worry that the might not be 12 clubs to restart season anyway...
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aslongaswebeatsaints
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by aslongaswebeatsaints »

Sad to see JM go. It is indisputable that he is a world class winger and a loss. He’s going back to his ‘home’ club and probably getting more money while he can as pace doesn’t last forever. I wish him the best. Pretty obvious he’ll join the brace of ex Tigers that will score a brace against us at WR! I also see the need to rebalance and reprioritise the team finances towards putting grunt and resilience in the ‘Engine Room’ and broadly agree with the current recruitment and retention campaign. Losing JM is sad. But losing Genge or GF would have been catastrophic.

But I still can’t yet shake off the bad recruitment mistakes of the last 4-5 years that led us to such a mess - in this case getting JM was a coup but not worth the loss of one of our best locks at the time in Ed Slater. And Glaws now have both........
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by Dangerous4 »

Ian Cant wrote: Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:38 pm TV can and will score more tries and is, in my opinion, our most exciting and most dangerous attacker. As I said in my earlier post, Jonny is great but in term of a team player TV is our best back after George Ford. TV too would get into most international sides.
People probably forget that TV and Olowefella were superb in setting up May’s tries v Bristol.
As for Holmes I think it unlikely the Welsh regions will be encouraged to sign Jonah as there are 3-4 wingers ahead of him in the pecking order!
I have to echo the above post.
J.M.'s departure is a bitter pill to swallow, although most of us could see his leaving coming. Whatever his true reasons for going are, we must concentrate on the personnel we bring in for next season, remembering that no one person is bigger than the club. I am sure that Steve Borthwick will be a success here, and will bring better days than of late, with his knowledge of the game.
Well good luck to J.M. and thanks for some great memories, both in a Tiger's and England shirt.
To conclude, I hope to see a couple of our youngsters step up and be successful next season, and look forward to seeing just who will be coming in.
Stay safe everyone.

Losing Johnny is a bitter pill to swallow, although we all probably could see his departure coming
AngusMcCoatup
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by AngusMcCoatup »

Well said Dangerous4 and for once a good article from Barnes in the Times ( so pleased to be able to read it without the barrier) Yes Iam very sorry to lose Jonny May and thanks for the entertainment he provided in scoring tries and arm waving on the wing to get him the ball.. whether his delay meant we had filled his position with Nadolo or not (ala Salvi ) but it sounds as if he wanted to return to his family roots if another big pay day was not forthcoming. He lived in Gloucester, family there, original club there and now he probably wants to try and settle down and attempt to lose the "headless chicken!" reputation and start a family etc in the twilight of his career. He has hopefully 3 years left to excell and try to avoid injury, as he had a few knocks here with jaws & hia's. Let us not forget that ex Tiger Hurrell has had to retire this week, Rob Horne of Saints on our pitch & David Denton retired through injury this season..
So thanks Jonny for your services to Tigers but we will move on with our younger squad and give new openings to the team void of international disruption.
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Re: J. MAY ESQ.

Post by rich1576 »

What really annoys me is that we lost a great player in Ed Slater for Johnny. He stays with us for 2 years, most of which was with England and now Gloucester get Johnny and Ed. Makes the club look at bit foolish really.
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