Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Forum to discuss everything that is Tigers related

Moderators: Tigerbeat, Rizzo, Tigers Press Office, Tigers Webmaster

fleabane
Super User
Super User
Posts: 5178
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:26 pm
Location: Occitanie

Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by fleabane »

Better than the government's medical advice anyway.

The RFU decided to follow the advice and so Mako Vunipola, having stopped over in Hong Kong on his way back from Tonga, was made unavailable for England selection, and we were told he was self-isolating.

No he wasn't.

He was training with Sarries, who clearly decided that they knew best.

Arrogant or what?

I hope that he is not infected, and I hope that our players aren't either!
Valhalla I am coming!
oxontiger
New Member
Posts: 17
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 10:47 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by oxontiger »

Would you expect anything else from Sarries? After all, player welfare is looked after so much better at Allianz Park...
RichieB
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 688
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:50 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by RichieB »

Doesn't make logical sense does it? He is either self-isolating or he isn't. If he should be self-isolating then he shouldn't be training and/or playing with his club side. If he doesn't need to self-isolate, he should be with the England squad.

But as the previous post says, Sarries make up the rules to suit themselves.
Cardiff Tig
Gold Member
Gold Member
Posts: 1390
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 9:25 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Cardiff Tig »

No, the RFU aren't following the advice. They are being over cautious, probably because the hit of canceling an international game is much worse than a league game.

But don't let that stop you from bashing Sarries at any opportunity for no reason.
Traveller
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 741
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:46 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Traveller »

Cardiff Tig wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:40 am No, the RFU aren't following the advice. They are being over cautious, probably because the hit of canceling an international game is much worse than a league game.

But don't let that stop you from bashing Sarries at any opportunity for no reason.
Overall I agree.

However given Saracens current standing in the game, you'd think the new CEO might have ensured the messaging from the media department was better. Not hard to join the dots with the RFU and get it right. 'Vunipola Out for Welsh Clash. Good news for Saracens.'

If you don't, because your lazy, or arrogant, or incompetent or all three, don't be surprised if people jump to their own conclusions, based on their experience of your past behaviours.

Basic rule: What's the headline
Answer: 'Sarries playing by their own rules again'.
Baz
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:27 am

Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Baz »

"No, the RFU aren't following the advice. They are being over cautious, probably because the hit of canceling an international game is much worse than a league game.
But don't let that stop you from bashing Sarries at any opportunity for no reason."

You make no sense. If the RFU was being overcautious, they would have cancelled the game! Whatever advice there is, Sarries are not following it either. But this is not the issue; why is Mako Vunipola available for Saracens, but not for England?
Wayne Richardson Fan Club
Super User
Super User
Posts: 3837
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:53 am
Location: The Salt Mines

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club »

It would appear England are wrong in this case, tbh Cole will take apart at scrum time if he plays anyway, it's the rest of his game that's the issue.

Still it is far better just to blame the massive cheats, Sarries join Dayglo in my book in always being in the wrong regardless of the issue or the facts.
To win is not as important as playing with style!
Cardiff Tig
Gold Member
Gold Member
Posts: 1390
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 9:25 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Cardiff Tig »

Baz wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:10 am "No, the RFU aren't following the advice. They are being over cautious, probably because the hit of canceling an international game is much worse than a league game.
But don't let that stop you from bashing Sarries at any opportunity for no reason."

You make no sense. If the RFU was being overcautious, they would have cancelled the game! Whatever advice there is, Sarries are not following it either. But this is not the issue; why is Mako Vunipola available for Saracens, but not for England?
No, the advice is to self-isolate if you are showing any of the list of minor symptoms. The RFU have stated that Vunipola isn't showing symptoms but they still want him to stay away from the England camp. There is no scientific basis for the RFU decision to keep him away, other than being over cautious. Hence Sarries, who are following the expert advice, are happy for him to play. There is no issue here other than trying to make one up to criticise Sarries with.
Traveller wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am Overall I agree.

However given Saracens current standing in the game, you'd think the new CEO might have ensured the messaging from the media department was better. Not hard to join the dots with the RFU and get it right. 'Vunipola Out for Welsh Clash. Good news for Saracens.'

If you don't, because your lazy, or arrogant, or incompetent or all three, don't be surprised if people jump to their own conclusions, based on their experience of your past behaviours.

Basic rule: What's the headline
Answer: 'Sarries playing by their own rules again'.
So because Sarries haven't aligned there media team with the RFU they should be criticised? Again, seems like any excuse to knock them no matter what the occasion.
Traveller
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 741
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:46 pm

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Traveller »

Cardiff Tig wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:27 am
Baz wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:10 am "No, the RFU aren't following the advice. They are being over cautious, probably because the hit of canceling an international game is much worse than a league game.
But don't let that stop you from bashing Sarries at any opportunity for no reason."

You make no sense. If the RFU was being overcautious, they would have cancelled the game! Whatever advice there is, Sarries are not following it either. But this is not the issue; why is Mako Vunipola available for Saracens, but not for England?
No, the advice is to self-isolate if you are showing any of the list of minor symptoms. The RFU have stated that Vunipola isn't showing symptoms but they still want him to stay away from the England camp. There is no scientific basis for the RFU decision to keep him away, other than being over cautious. Hence Sarries, who are following the expert advice, are happy for him to play. There is no issue here other than trying to make one up to criticise Sarries with.
Traveller wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am Overall I agree.

However given Saracens current standing in the game, you'd think the new CEO might have ensured the messaging from the media department was better. Not hard to join the dots with the RFU and get it right. 'Vunipola Out for Welsh Clash. Good news for Saracens.'

If you don't, because your lazy, or arrogant, or incompetent or all three, don't be surprised if people jump to their own conclusions, based on their experience of your past behaviours.

Basic rule: What's the headline
Answer: 'Sarries playing by their own rules again'.
So because Sarries haven't aligned there media team with the RFU they should be criticised? Again, seems like any excuse to knock them no matter what the occasion.
Opening line of my response - Overall I agree.

However when you have dug a huge hole for yourself the three standard crisis management rules are a) admit the crisis, b) over respond, c) over communicate.

Saracens are where they are, like it or not, and so they should be acutely aware of how everything they do will be scrutinised, and be assessed thru the prism of cheating, doing what they want to do, and there is greater likelihood of continued damage to their reputation, no matter how unfair or inaccurate. Media teams are employed to manage the message. The fact that the same headlines have appeared in the national press today proves the point.

I repeat, overall I agree with what you say, I think it is unfair, but it doesn't matter what I think, perception counts.
jgriffin
Super User
Super User
Posts: 8074
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 5:49 pm
Location: On the edge of oblivion

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by jgriffin »

Since HK airport is a potential nexus for the virus, a 14 day self-isolation seems advisable. Neither Vunipola will know whether they have been in contact with the virus, and as very fit young men, may be subclinical/carriers - I assume Sarries will have ensured they have been tested? If not, then are Tigers and the rest of Sarries at risk? :smt017
Leicester Tigers 1995-
Nottingham 1995-2000
Swansea (Whites) 1988-95
A game played on grass in the open air by teams of XV.
wellstiger
Gold Member
Gold Member
Posts: 896
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:56 am

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by wellstiger »

jgriffin wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:28 pm Since HK airport is a potential nexus for the virus, a 14 day self-isolation seems advisable. Neither Vunipola will know whether they have been in contact with the virus, and as very fit young men, may be subclinical/carriers - I assume Sarries will have ensured they have been tested? If not, then are Tigers and the rest of Sarries at risk? :smt017
+1
I'm not Sorrys knocking. I am hoping common sense is being applied for the sake of both teams and sets of supporters.
Having worked in NHS, Isolation and prevention are key, especially coming through a "Hot zone"
teds
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 670
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:02 pm
Location: london

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by teds »

Cardiff Tig wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:27 am No, the advice is to self-isolate if you are showing any of the list of minor symptoms. The RFU have stated that Vunipola isn't showing symptoms but they still want him to stay away from the England camp. There is no scientific basis for the RFU decision to keep him away, other than being over cautious. Hence Sarries, who are following the expert advice, are happy for him to play. There is no issue here other than trying to make one up to criticise Sarries with.
Can you tell us more about the expert medical advice Saracens have been given?
Was it more expert than the advice given to England?
Tigerbeat
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7249
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2007 9:14 pm
Location: The big wide world

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Tigerbeat »

Seems that Sarries are following the advice that is being given publicly. England look to have been more cautious and protective to the squad and decided that he should be away from the team environment.
Dont see any problems with the actions being undertaken by Sarries or England.
SUPPORT THE MATT HAMPSON TRUST
www.matthampson.co.uk
teds
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 670
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:02 pm
Location: london

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by teds »

Tigerbeat wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:51 pm Seems that Sarries are following the advice that is being given publicly. England look to have been more cautious and protective to the squad and decided that he should be away from the team environment.
Dont see any problems with the actions being undertaken by Sarries or England.
If all they did was log onto the NHS website after the Rugby England had already advised Mako to self-isolate then I think it’s fair to criticise Saracens.

That said, it’s not clear what medical expertise England based their advice on either.

To spell out my view, the type of physical proximity that is involved in rugby makes it more likely that infections (if present) will be passed on to other players. The second issue is that this virus seems to be asymptomatic for many people presumably especially for fit young men, and that means that the risk of a mini outbreak are higher. We don’t get an early warning, it’s only when it passes onto players families and friends that we start to see people being hospitalised and some potentially dying.

Rugby clubs should be seeking advice that is specific to rugby as an occupation.
Noggs
Super User
Super User
Posts: 2287
Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Leicestershire

Re: Coronavirus: Sarries know best!

Post by Noggs »

In the circumstances you might have thought that Sarries would have adopted the same 'better safe than sorry' approach that England have adopted.

The chances of infection are slim but if he has picked it up and it can be passed on prior to the first signs of illness then there is a good chance that both Sarries and Tigers players will become infected and in turn pass it on to others when they next play and so on.....

The current strategy is to delay the spread for as long as and where possible by containment but clearly our friends don't see it that way. :smt009
Life can be unpredictable, so eat your pudding first!
Post Reply