Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

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strawclearer
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by strawclearer » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:19 pm

Some nice tries (apologies if posted elsewhere).....

https://www.epcrugby.com/video/highligh ... source=twi
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JP14
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by JP14 » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:27 pm

The pop from Reffell to Worth was sublime, good to see Taute make the immediate impact too.
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Traveller
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by Traveller » Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:06 am

Grimlish wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 9:20 pm
Who says it’s a binary choice between accepting mediocrity and supporting the team when they need it the most? It’s your attitude JGT that is most worrying. With that attitude 11 of the 12 sides don’t deserve support because they aren’t winners. It’s that attitude that got us to Saracen’s’ salary cap abuse. It is undermining the spirit of the game and threatens every attempt to build the fan base. I don’t know whether you have seen us play this season in person JGT but there’s a process of re-building going on after a hard couple of seasons - no-one I know of is saying anything/everything is right yet and I for one reserve judgement on the ability of the coaching group as currently configured to get the significant stuff that remains right - but there are certainly improvements over last season, the players seem better motivated to fight for the club and each other, and that’s an expression of support in the coaches. The players approach to the inevitable set backs and disappointments is critical and is exactly why they need our support not the trigger- happy key board warriors who demand instantaneous change without any idea what they are saying. It is not pompous or jingoistic to think this way, just realistic and, IMO important.
Why undermine your own argument by referring to those whose opinions are no doubt as strongly held as yours, but just different as 'happy keyboard warriors'. "My mind is open" the man said................"completely open".

No doubt your own contributions are in contrast, considered, thoughtful, reasoned and above all 'brave'. The keyboard warrior phrase is the juvenile equivalent of sticking your tongue out at someone when they use a word you don't understand.

I don't agree with everything JGT says, but lest my opinion be utterly worthless, because it does not coincide with yours, there is absolutely no connection at all between Saracens (means justify ends) and Tigers slide into mediocrity. It's like saying that the collapse of Enron and Woolworths were similar. One criminal racket, the other proof that selling pick n mix only goes so far.

I've supported Tigers for half a century and I can remember decades when we were stuffed by Bath, couldn't get a result against Saints, but still supported the club. I still do. But the '11/12 clubs' observation is bogus.

Last October, on this forum I said that I thought Tigers would be in a relegation fight 'because having seen them play three times, it struck me that they had none of the characteristics of what I understand 'a team' to be. They were unfit, rudderless, didn't seem to care about each other. I was told by some I was being unduly negative, that I should 'support the team'. Rugby's equivalent of 'Britain's Got Talent' - your all wonderful and brilliant and marvellous - even when you're not.

I agree that turning the ship around will take time. We have conceded fewer points on average in the first four games 19+/= as opposed to 27 than we did last season. The squad seems better balanced. There is at least some stability on the coaching staff.

But a coaching team assembled because (to quote Murphy) 'Phil (Blake) is available (unemployed), lives locally, knows the club' "we've been mates for a long time and Mike's coming in as a consultant for the last few games", Pat Howard (mentor to the HC), not to mention the circumstances behind GM's appointment. (Saint -Boyd / Glos -Ackermann / Bristol - Lam / Irish - Kidney - now experience isn't everything, but generally it beats no experience).

Sadly, I think Saracens will ease past Tigers between 11-25 April (if their players do play in the 6N) or around Feb 25 if they don't, by which time we will be bottom of the Prem and headed for the Championship. Don't panic.

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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by DingDong » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:00 am

Traveller wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:06 am
Sadly, I think Saracens will ease past Tigers between 11-25 April (if their players do play in the 6N) or around Feb 25 if they don't, by which time we will be bottom of the Prem and headed for the Championship. Don't panic.
Last year we finished on 41pts and Sarries on 78pts, replicate that this year and deduct the 35pt penalty and you're right!
Despite your positivity about stability within the coaching and conceding less points, we are currently on 4pts and this time last year after the same amount of games we were on 9pts, this ship not only needs turning but also needs a more powerful engine to catch up!

RagingBull
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by RagingBull » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:07 am

so the stats from the game are up a couple things from a defence POV
Tigers centres Reid and Manu made 11 tackle and didn't miss one between them.
The smaller amount of tackles made might have something to do with the amount of tackles made by the pack.
84 tackles made by the starting 8.

With Youngs and Reffell leading the stats
Youngs 15 tackles 0 missed
Reffell 14 tackles 0 missed.
Spencer and Lavanini combined for 24 tackles 3 missed.

The biggest thing against us was discipline though (Surprise) in the pack 8 penalties conceded by the starting pack (although Reffell, Youngs, Gigena and Boladau kept clean sheets in that department), highlights our lack of ability to read the ref still.

Taute also made a impact in defence making 4 tackles 0 missed, 28 meters in 3 runs and 1 try assist in his 20 mins.

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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by RagingBull » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:14 am

DingDong wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:00 am
Traveller wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:06 am
Sadly, I think Saracens will ease past Tigers between 11-25 April (if their players do play in the 6N) or around Feb 25 if they don't, by which time we will be bottom of the Prem and headed for the Championship. Don't panic.
Last year we finished on 41pts and Sarries on 78pts, replicate that this year and deduct the 35pt penalty and you're right!
Despite your positivity about stability within the coaching and conceding less points, we are currently on 4pts and this time last year after the same amount of games we were on 9pts, this ship not only needs turning but also needs a more powerful engine to catch up!
Interesting comparisons
Also something i would add although Tigers are down 5 points from last season so are Saracens are down 7 points from the first 4 games last season compared to this one (20 points last season v 13 this season)

so assuming things follow a similar path which it won't so this is pointless.
Saracens 78 - 35 - 7 = 36 points
Tigers 41 - 5 = 36

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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by Tigerbeat » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:29 am

DingDong wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:00 am
Traveller wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:06 am
Sadly, I think Saracens will ease past Tigers between 11-25 April (if their players do play in the 6N) or around Feb 25 if they don't, by which time we will be bottom of the Prem and headed for the Championship. Don't panic.
Last year we finished on 41pts and Sarries on 78pts, replicate that this year and deduct the 35pt penalty and you're right!
Despite your positivity about stability within the coaching and conceding less points, we are currently on 4pts and this time last year after the same amount of games we were on 9pts, this ship not only needs turning but also needs a more powerful engine to catch up!
This time last year we did not lose our Internationals for the start of the season.......so the underpower is understandable.
Cany treally compare it to last year at this stage1
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Traveller
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by Traveller » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:52 am

DingDong wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:00 am
Traveller wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:06 am
Sadly, I think Saracens will ease past Tigers between 11-25 April (if their players do play in the 6N) or around Feb 25 if they don't, by which time we will be bottom of the Prem and headed for the Championship. Don't panic.
Last year we finished on 41pts and Sarries on 78pts, replicate that this year and deduct the 35pt penalty and you're right!
Despite your positivity about stability within the coaching and conceding less points, we are currently on 4pts and this time last year after the same amount of games we were on 9pts, this ship not only needs turning but also needs a more powerful engine to catch up!
Sorry if I appeared positive. Really, I didn't mean to. I can't see us winning more than a couple of games all season. Particularly not if the coaching set up doesn't change. If Sarries do keep their players over the 6N and our contingent go and play. I think we are doomed. I am supporting the team. But I am not positive. -44 in the points column is not a good sign after 4 matches.

DingDong
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by DingDong » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:01 am

RagingBull wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:14 am
so assuming things follow a similar path which it won't so this is pointless.
Saracens 78 - 35 - 7 = 36 points
Tigers 41 - 5 = 36
...so then, your theory is its a playoff for relegation RB! whose your money on? hmmmmmm... :smt017

All hypothetically of course :smt023

drc_007
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by drc_007 » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:02 am

RagingBull wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:07 am
so the stats from the game are up a couple things from a defence POV
Tigers centres Reid and Manu made 11 tackle and didn't miss one between them.
The smaller amount of tackles made might have something to do with the amount of tackles made by the pack.
84 tackles made by the starting 8.

With Youngs and Reffell leading the stats
Youngs 15 tackles 0 missed
Reffell 14 tackles 0 missed.
Spencer and Lavanini combined for 24 tackles 3 missed.

The biggest thing against us was discipline though (Surprise) in the pack 8 penalties conceded by the starting pack (although Reffell, Youngs, Gigena and Boladau kept clean sheets in that department), highlights our lack of ability to read the ref still.

Taute also made a impact in defence making 4 tackles 0 missed, 28 meters in 3 runs and 1 try assist in his 20 mins.
French teams tend to be very forward oriented so no surprise the forwards did most of the tackling, and whilst they creaked at times in general they held up well.
One thing that is not captured however is occasions like the second Pau try where a forward runs past most of the Tigers pack without anyone reacting.
I agree giving away soft penalties is something that keeps coming back to haunt Tigers.
Also thought Worth had a good game, shaping up to be a solid premiership performer. Good under high ball, solid in defence, reads the game well, and works hard off the ball.

RagingBull
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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by RagingBull » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:16 am

DingDong wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:01 am
RagingBull wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:14 am
so assuming things follow a similar path which it won't so this is pointless.
Saracens 78 - 35 - 7 = 36 points
Tigers 41 - 5 = 36
...so then, your theory is its a playoff for relegation RB! whose your money on? hmmmmmm... :smt017

All hypothetically of course :smt023
Between those two option relegation is more likely to happen.
But you didn’t really give me much middle ground was either feast or famine.

We got some big prem games leading into the new year and just beyond.
If we can somehow pick up 8-9 picks from Saints (A), Exeter (H), Quinn (A), Bristol (H) then who knows.

8 seems unlikely but it will be a good test too see where this squad is with it’s big name internationals.

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Re: Tigers v Pau Saturday Nov 16th

Post by Noggs » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:14 pm

To try to project the full season when the 'first team' have hardly played together for the shirt is in my view a pointless exercise. The play against Pau, whilst far from perfect, was much improved on any game I witnessed last season and as such I am looking forward to the improvement being built on as the new players bed in.

In the words of a famous Bill, 'Keep the Faith' :smt041
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