Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

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TigerBoy1880
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by TigerBoy1880 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:22 pm

BFG wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:15 pm
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:21 am
I don’t know how many calories I have a day, how many I “should” have a day and what foods are the “right” things to eat. I eat what I like when I like but if I was a teenager again and had my time in the academy again, if I was given a strict diet to follow, I’d follow it. After all, you have to make sacrifices in professional sport and life in general.
It sounds easy when you put it like that but at what time in a professional sportspersons life are they allowed to fully relax!
That's before it's even considered that a demanding sport like rugby does require a quick turnaround in recovery and the pressure is much greater.
You have to eat X amount of calories and at X times during the day, several times each day, every day of every week.
In bed at X and up at X.
In the gym at X and on the training pitch at X.
On the coach at X and on the plane at X managed alongside eating and sleeping at X.
Then you've got knocks and injuries, media demands and match days etc.
Start that at 15/16 years old and are still doing it at 27 years old.
It doesn't sound so easy.
Meanwhile normal life is going on around you.
That’s the compromise you make as a pro sportsman I suppose and one I’d certainly be willing to make. You retire at about 35 so have the rest of your life to relax and not worry about what you eat.

sk 88
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by sk 88 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:46 pm

I wouldn't focus too much on calorie intake, lots of fitness focused people do that kind of thing these days and to be frank it is a prerequisite of being a top pro.

Myall's points on England were interesting to me, the whole narrative of playing for England is that it is your "childhood dream", "an honour", "#EnglandIsAll". It's also a huge amount of cash. £20k+ per game and 11 games a season, plus commercial deals on top of that.

Takes a big man to go, actually, I can take it or leave it. Julian White did that. Refused to go to RWC 2007 because he didn't want to be away for that long hardly playing.

If you look at football the internationals earn nothing, but they are all on millions from their clubs. Loads of players have dropped out in the past so these days no one goes to England unless they genuinely want to be involved and therefore they have a much happier camp.
Goooooodeeeeeyyyyy!

sk 88
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by sk 88 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:15 pm

For club players you'll get different pressures at different levels but broadly speaking it's security and money.

Reserve and fringe players aren't earning huge sums as far as I'm aware. The salary cap, including all credits, is going to be about £7.25 - £7.5m max (excluding the marquee players). That covers 63 players. So a "mean" of £115k. With respect we can all see that Genge, Cole, Ford, May, etc are on a lot more than that. So a lot of players will be sub £100k.

If you're a guy like Harry Wells with young twins and a mortgage you're desperately paying off before your skills begin to expire around 30, at best, you're never on longer than a 24 month contract that's often not renewed until the final 4 months you are one injury away from genuinely wondering how to meet the mortgage.

That's not an "easy" situation, and other than the twins bit is fairly similar to Myall.

Thanks to restrictions on foreigners in most leagues, and the total lack of money in the Champ there are precious few opportunities outside the Premiership and they all come with the risk of a move to France which is not for everyone. In the very small world of Prem rugby poison is spread pretty quickly, we've all seen that on message boards from people "in the know", and mud sticks.

Personally I am very surprised that the players (or their agents) don't push for longer contracts to at least get more security, even if there is a trade off for some money.
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BFG
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by BFG » Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:40 pm

TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:22 pm
BFG wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:15 pm
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:21 am
I don’t know how many calories I have a day, how many I “should” have a day and what foods are the “right” things to eat. I eat what I like when I like but if I was a teenager again and had my time in the academy again, if I was given a strict diet to follow, I’d follow it. After all, you have to make sacrifices in professional sport and life in general.
It sounds easy when you put it like that but at what time in a professional sportspersons life are they allowed to fully relax!
That's before it's even considered that a demanding sport like rugby does require a quick turnaround in recovery and the pressure is much greater.
You have to eat X amount of calories and at X times during the day, several times each day, every day of every week.
In bed at X and up at X.
In the gym at X and on the training pitch at X.
On the coach at X and on the plane at X managed alongside eating and sleeping at X.
Then you've got knocks and injuries, media demands and match days etc.
Start that at 15/16 years old and are still doing it at 27 years old.
It doesn't sound so easy.
Meanwhile normal life is going on around you.
That’s the compromise you make as a pro sportsman I suppose and one I’d certainly be willing to make. You retire at about 35 so have the rest of your life to relax and not worry about what you eat.
Not sure Rob Horne and others would quite see it that way!

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by jgriffin » Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:51 pm

As someone who weight trained from 14, athletics with some rugby till 19, a long break with some casual rugby for the decadent 70s, then a decade of running, a decade of (M40) athletics and rugby (till 45), fitness training continuing into my 60s with a bit of orienteering - I have arthritic knees, hands, elbows and ankles with a wonky lumbar spine (too much squatting 200k+).
That's without the weekly collision, contusions and concussion.
I cannot imagine what state some of these guys will be in by the time they are 50, let alone my age. Privilege?
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TigerBoy1880
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by TigerBoy1880 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:36 pm

BFG wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:40 pm
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:22 pm
BFG wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:15 pm


It sounds easy when you put it like that but at what time in a professional sportspersons life are they allowed to fully relax!
That's before it's even considered that a demanding sport like rugby does require a quick turnaround in recovery and the pressure is much greater.
You have to eat X amount of calories and at X times during the day, several times each day, every day of every week.
In bed at X and up at X.
In the gym at X and on the training pitch at X.
On the coach at X and on the plane at X managed alongside eating and sleeping at X.
Then you've got knocks and injuries, media demands and match days etc.
Start that at 15/16 years old and are still doing it at 27 years old.
It doesn't sound so easy.
Meanwhile normal life is going on around you.
That’s the compromise you make as a pro sportsman I suppose and one I’d certainly be willing to make. You retire at about 35 so have the rest of your life to relax and not worry about what you eat.
Not sure Rob Horne and others would quite see it that way!
It’s awful what happened to Horne but I don’t see the relevance? He will have made sacrifices when trying to become a pro rugby player and whilst he was a pro rugby player. His career has come to a very unfortunate early end but my point about making sacrifices is a worthy one.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by BFG » Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:14 am

Everything is relevant to the pressure that players might suffer.
Add it all up and it's a potential cocktail for mental health issues.
Even though it was hard in different ways when I think back about thirty years ago only half the amount of matches were played and players were lighter which equates to more quality downtime from rugby.

TigerBoy1880
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by TigerBoy1880 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:43 am

BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:14 am
Everything is relevant to the pressure that players might suffer.
Add it all up and it's a potential cocktail for mental health issues.
Even though it was hard in different ways when I think back about thirty years ago only half the amount of matches were played and players were lighter which equates to more quality downtime from rugby.
30 years ago the game was amateur. Players now get paid as it’s their job and like all jobs, there’s things you have to do as part of it. Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by BFG » Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:58 am

TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:43 am
BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:14 am
Everything is relevant to the pressure that players might suffer.
Add it all up and it's a potential cocktail for mental health issues.
Even though it was hard in different ways when I think back about thirty years ago only half the amount of matches were played and players were lighter which equates to more quality downtime from rugby.
30 years ago the game was amateur. Players now get paid as it’s their job and like all jobs, there’s things you have to do as part of it. Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.
30 years ago the game was amateur which is precisely the point that you are completely missing regarding the impact of the pro game on players as human beings!
Are memory loss, alcoholism and suicidal thoughts a part of the job description!
:smt013

TigerBoy1880
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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by TigerBoy1880 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:07 pm

BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:58 am
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:43 am
BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:14 am
Everything is relevant to the pressure that players might suffer.
Add it all up and it's a potential cocktail for mental health issues.
Even though it was hard in different ways when I think back about thirty years ago only half the amount of matches were played and players were lighter which equates to more quality downtime from rugby.
30 years ago the game was amateur. Players now get paid as it’s their job and like all jobs, there’s things you have to do as part of it. Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.
30 years ago the game was amateur which is precisely the point that you are completely missing regarding the impact of the pro game on players as human beings!
Are memory loss, alcoholism and suicidal thoughts a part of the job description!
:smt013
I was actually talking more about the diets of pro players which is why I said “Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.”

Apologies for the confusion.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by sam16111986 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:16 pm

BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:58 am
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:43 am
BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:14 am
Everything is relevant to the pressure that players might suffer.
Add it all up and it's a potential cocktail for mental health issues.
Even though it was hard in different ways when I think back about thirty years ago only half the amount of matches were played and players were lighter which equates to more quality downtime from rugby.
30 years ago the game was amateur. Players now get paid as it’s their job and like all jobs, there’s things you have to do as part of it. Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.
30 years ago the game was amateur which is precisely the point that you are completely missing regarding the impact of the pro game on players as human beings!
Are memory loss, alcoholism and suicidal thoughts a part of the job description!
:smt013
No but this wouldn't be the only profession where those issues have been found amongst the practitioners.

Clearly most clubs should be now looking to hire a psychologist to work with the team. Good employers are making such services available to their staff and given the high pressure nature of professional sport a lot of players would benefit both in performance and personally. There will always be issues with players and egos there are ways to counter act that.

Plenty of big name sports stars have taken to psychologists to help them with pressure, depression, anxiety and so on. Ronnie O'Sullivan famously uses Steve Peters among a catalogue of others. He is based near Sheffield and I would hope that Tigers have approached him or someone similar in order to help the players. Particularly during the scrutiny of last season they will have needed it.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by BFG » Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:44 pm

TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:07 pm
BFG wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:58 am
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:43 am


30 years ago the game was amateur. Players now get paid as it’s their job and like all jobs, there’s things you have to do as part of it. Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.
30 years ago the game was amateur which is precisely the point that you are completely missing regarding the impact of the pro game on players as human beings!
Are memory loss, alcoholism and suicidal thoughts a part of the job description!
:smt013
I was actually talking more about the diets of pro players which is why I said “Part of being a pro rugby player is making sure you eat the right food and keeping yourself fit for 365 days of the year.”

Apologies for the confusion.
All a part of the strain on pro players that has the potential to combine with a pressure cooker effect.
Every single factor is a contributing factor no matter how big or small.
Given the amount of training and games they play now pro players are living to work with no release.
They are making that choice as young teenagers, more brutal camps are/were introduced to show what lies ahead but the pressure not to let anyone down is already present.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by LE18 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:39 pm

TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:21 am
I don’t know how many calories I have a day, how many I “should” have a day and what foods are the “right” things to eat. I eat what I like when I like but if I was a teenager again and had my time in the academy again, if I was given a strict diet to follow, I’d follow it. After all, you have to make sacrifices in professional sport and life in general.
TB1880, belated in adding my comment, but with regard to yourself, a normal adult male, living a normal life should consume approx 2200-2500 calories per day. I'm not sure about you eating what you like when you like, I hope its a well balanced diet, fruit and veg, with some meat, if not you could later end up like me with type 2 diabetes, (type 2 is not inherited, its earnt) but I don't know why I got it, as I was always active in sport and generally ate well, but liked a pint or 3.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by TigerBoy1880 » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:12 am

LE18 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:39 pm
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:21 am
I don’t know how many calories I have a day, how many I “should” have a day and what foods are the “right” things to eat. I eat what I like when I like but if I was a teenager again and had my time in the academy again, if I was given a strict diet to follow, I’d follow it. After all, you have to make sacrifices in professional sport and life in general.
TB1880, belated in adding my comment, but with regard to yourself, a normal adult male, living a normal life should consume approx 2200-2500 calories per day. I'm not sure about you eating what you like when you like, I hope its a well balanced diet, fruit and veg, with some meat, if not you could later end up like me with type 2 diabetes, (type 2 is not inherited, its earnt) but I don't know why I got it, as I was always active in sport and generally ate well, but liked a pint or 3.
Meat and vegetables pretty much everyday. Hardly any fruit. Chocolate pretty much every day. Very rarely drink alcohol.

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Re: Food for thought for the keyboard warriors?

Post by LE18 » Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:58 pm

TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:12 am
LE18 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:39 pm
TigerBoy1880 wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:21 am
I don’t know how many calories I have a day, how many I “should” have a day and what foods are the “right” things to eat. I eat what I like when I like but if I was a teenager again and had my time in the academy again, if I was given a strict diet to follow, I’d follow it. After all, you have to make sacrifices in professional sport and life in general.
TB1880, belated in adding my comment, but with regard to yourself, a normal adult male, living a normal life should consume approx 2200-2500 calories per day. I'm not sure about you eating what you like when you like, I hope its a well balanced diet, fruit and veg, with some meat, if not you could later end up like me with type 2 diabetes, (type 2 is not inherited, its earnt) but I don't know why I got it, as I was always active in sport and generally ate well, but liked a pint or 3.
Meat and vegetables pretty much everyday. Hardly any fruit. Chocolate pretty much every day. Very rarely drink alcohol.
Hi TB, Don't know how old you are but would suggest you eat fruit, greens, salads and chicken, but chocolate in moderation. Type 2 tends to get you later in life as you become less active and can lead to blindness and amputations.

Wish you well but do take care.

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