Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

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Brutus
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Brutus » Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am

For those moaning about that wedding at half time, the newlyweds obviously share a passion for the club and are fellow fans. Its not really fair to them to keep banging on about their wedding not being to your tastes and it having a negative impact on the club - it makes those moaning seem like mardy old farts. :smt018
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that but it brought money into the club :smt038 Those who didn't want to witness it could have nipped for a pint or a :censored:.
I do not know anyone involved in the wedding so my views are entirely impartial.

ourla
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by ourla » Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am

Brutus wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that
But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Brutus » Fri May 17, 2019 11:19 am

ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am
Brutus wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that
But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
They'll be building a hotel next !! :smt005
As long as the commercial activities don't impact the players and distract them from their primary job I see no issue. The wedding happened while the players were inside so no issue for me.
I agree that things shouldn't go much further than that - the regular fans shouldn't be snubbed in favour of the corporate crowd.

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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Scuttle » Fri May 17, 2019 12:02 pm

Big Dai wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:50 pm
In an article on the website concerning Tom Youngs' desire to give Smithy a good send off our season was described as a rollercoaster ride. Funny? I thought rollercoasters sometimes went up?
Oh I thought he meant it made you want to scream, turn green, vomit and vow to never do it again :smt003
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by BFG » Fri May 17, 2019 12:57 pm

ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am
Brutus wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that
But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
Now I think you're hitting a bit closer to the nail with that.
I don't believe it's quite the same narrative but I do get where you could be coming from.
Many think the traditional amateur values are gone but they were imaginary at this level as it's always been cut throat.
Do you honestly believe that you are watching the best players on the pitch that were available in the country growing up because I can categorically tell you now that in most cases you are not, you're watching the players who played a good hand off the field!
Amateur teams do also have their share of problems of infighting and for the same reasons so it's not amateur values.
It's a control thing, and when that control is under the influence of those not good enough then the outcome is not good enough.
Of the 10-15 players a season that get shed there is the same group on big money and who equally haven't been good enough that survives the cull every year and get selected even when they are playing so badly that they wouldn't get into some National Two teams.
That's the cause of issues, accountability only works if everyone is accountable, EVERYONE!

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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Big Dai » Fri May 17, 2019 6:27 pm

:smt025
Scuttle wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 12:02 pm
Big Dai wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:50 pm
In an article on the website concerning Tom Youngs' desire to give Smithy a good send off our season was described as a rollercoaster ride. Funny? I thought rollercoasters sometimes went up?
Oh I thought he meant it made you want to scream, turn green, vomit and vow to never do it again :smt003
I hadn't looked at it that way! :smt001
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1989Tiger
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by 1989Tiger » Fri May 17, 2019 7:43 pm

ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am
Brutus wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that
But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
Yes, if all of those things bring money into the club, then carry on.

The players are on the pitch for 80 minutes a week. All the other time can be spent being much needed money into the club.
Last edited by 1989Tiger on Fri May 17, 2019 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ourla
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by ourla » Fri May 17, 2019 7:51 pm

1989Tiger wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:43 pm
ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am
Brutus wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:36 am
The team are playing badly - the wedding didn't affect that
But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
Yes, if all of those things bring money until the club, then carry on.

The players are on the pitch for 80 minutes a week. All the other time can be spent being much needed money into the club.
You're not really getting it, which is fine... not everyone will.
You're either in or you're out

1989Tiger
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by 1989Tiger » Fri May 17, 2019 7:52 pm

ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:51 pm
1989Tiger wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:43 pm
ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 11:02 am

But that is the debate.... it's not personal against the couple getting married just as it's not personal about the players. Somebody wants to pay a few grand to get married on the pitch at half term, kerching. What next? I know let's have somebody with a giant flag run up and down the touchline whenever we score a try. Brilliant. Let's have the players ignore all the ordinary fans and head up to the corporate hospitality after the game. And what of the players themselves. Let's shed 10-15 players a season. Let's do a deal mid-way through someone's contract and pack them off to a rival and then ask other guys to put their body on the line and show some loyalty. Arguably, it's all part of the same narrative. Behaviours and values.
Yes, if all of those things bring money until the club, then carry on.

The players are on the pitch for 80 minutes a week. All the other time can be spent being much needed money into the club.
You're not really getting it, which is fine... not everyone will.
Ok, so what do you mean then?

ourla
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by ourla » Fri May 17, 2019 10:38 pm

1989Tiger wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:52 pm
ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:51 pm
1989Tiger wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:43 pm


Yes, if all of those things bring money until the club, then carry on.

The players are on the pitch for 80 minutes a week. All the other time can be spent being much needed money into the club.
You're not really getting it, which is fine... not everyone will.
Ok, so what do you mean then?
The players aren't immune to the commercial side just as the commercial side are not immune to what is going on on the playing side. The blend into each other and cross contaminate. The players do not buy tickets from the office, kit from shop or buy food/drink on match days but I am sure they hear from family, mates, neighbours, people they meet going about their daily business, that do. They might not see everything that goes on on match days but they get a flavour of it. And the commercial director said that it really knocks the staff when the team underperform. Worst still when good players/coaches are binned or when players just don't seem to be trying. Imagine working your socks every day marketing the club or selling tickets only to see the team fall apart on the weekend and get gubbed. Marketing is a necessity, painting your club in the best light is of course what you are going to do but when things are not working on or off the field have someone take responsibility, have someone admit things are not what they should be and explain the plan to fix it. The fact that we can't run a :censored: up in a rugby club and sack our head coach one game into the season are two sides of the same coin. It's not a coincidence. You don't have the best run club in the world and the crappiest team or vice versa. They run in parallel. All IMVHO.

I'm still not sure you get it but that could well be down to my lack of eloquence not your intelligence!
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1989Tiger
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by 1989Tiger » Sat May 18, 2019 10:25 am

ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:38 pm
1989Tiger wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:52 pm
ourla wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 7:51 pm

You're not really getting it, which is fine... not everyone will.
Ok, so what do you mean then?
The players aren't immune to the commercial side just as the commercial side are not immune to what is going on on the playing side. The blend into each other and cross contaminate. The players do not buy tickets from the office, kit from shop or buy food/drink on match days but I am sure they hear from family, mates, neighbours, people they meet going about their daily business, that do. They might not see everything that goes on on match days but they get a flavour of it. And the commercial director said that it really knocks the staff when the team underperform. Worst still when good players/coaches are binned or when players just don't seem to be trying. Imagine working your socks every day marketing the club or selling tickets only to see the team fall apart on the weekend and get gubbed. Marketing is a necessity, painting your club in the best light is of course what you are going to do but when things are not working on or off the field have someone take responsibility, have someone admit things are not what they should be and explain the plan to fix it. The fact that we can't run a :censored: up in a rugby club and sack our head coach one game into the season are two sides of the same coin. It's not a coincidence. You don't have the best run club in the world and the crappiest team or vice versa. They run in parallel. All IMVHO.

I'm still not sure you get it but that could well be down to my lack of eloquence not your intelligence!
I can see where you are trying to come from but you are focussing more on marketing. I’m talking more about the business as a whole. The idea of a business is to make money and although Tigers made losses last year, I believe we were the club with the lowest amount of losses. Only Exeter made money so I see it as Exeter and Tigers are the two best run clubs (businesses). Of course, marketing is important but ultimately, making money is what business is all about.

We are all aware things such as catering and the shop are poor and could be improved but other than that, I don’t see where the club are doing much else wrong from a business point of view.

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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Scuttle » Sat May 18, 2019 10:57 am

Lewis Moody in The Mail sums it up well.

https://newsdesk.moreover.com/click/?p= ... 57bb856c03
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by BFG » Sat May 18, 2019 12:03 pm

Scuttle wrote:
Sat May 18, 2019 10:57 am
Lewis Moody in The Mail sums it up well.

https://newsdesk.moreover.com/click/?p= ... 57bb856c03
I think he is covering for the old boys club.
He talks about OTY but fails to recognise that Thacker wanted more game time and although there was arguably a case that he deserved some he simply could not get ahead of OTY who lets be honest hasn't played well for quite a while but still seems to be a guaranteed starter when available.
For me OTY is an example of a problem.
Kerr will have the same problems that both Thacker and McGuigan faced if he can't get game time.
Mahoney always seemed to do alright with the 2's but never got a look in and is now released.
They need to play and if they can't get past a poor performing player ahead of them then that ethos Moody talks about goes out of the window.

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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by JP14 » Sat May 18, 2019 12:08 pm

Mahoney did struggle with concussion though BFG.
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Re: Thoughts & conclusions on the season.

Post by Scott1 » Sat May 18, 2019 12:09 pm

Nail. Hit. Head BFG,this is what scares me about Geordie. Will certain players always get a starting spot because of who they are even if it's at the expense of the team?

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