Squad Analysis

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strawclearer
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by strawclearer » Wed May 02, 2018 7:04 pm

JP14 wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 6:54 pm
strawclearer wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 6:34 pm
Fanks, JP bruv. Sorry fer being a total wasteman. Ain't from these ends fam.
(I understood him really!)
:smt043
That is one of the most cringiest things ever Strawclearer 😂
:smt003 :smt003 :smt003
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ellis9
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by ellis9 » Wed May 02, 2018 7:33 pm

Coops wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 5:10 pm
LE18 wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 4:43 pm
Just to add to one of the above statements, the first 3 line out throws by TPN all were overthrown or went wrong.
Yet on the training park (open day at WR) both TPN and TY's throwing was spot on to the mark.

You can't just blame a poor lineout on the thrower - there are plenty of other elements which can cause it to go wrong - jumpers in the wrong place, lifters not lifting at the right point, call wrong and that's before you factor in the opposition disrupting things.
So many people on here can and do blame the thrower!

TTRITH
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by TTRITH » Thu May 03, 2018 9:14 am

What am I missing about Mapapalangi? Don't get me wrong, he has scores of potential, excellent hands and is good on the burst, but I don't think he's done enough to be considered a top performer this season?

Ive watched him fall off tackles, stand on the wing (which is a massive bug bare for me and our flankers, get in the centre of the park :censored:) and it seems to me that when he has a bad game, its an absolute stinker.

Stats may tell another story, but I dont think he offers what a back row should, IMO. It may be that he's rarely been part of a balanced back row, but I'd personally have him in the jurys out section, over Worth their Bacon.
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Tiglon
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by Tiglon » Thu May 03, 2018 10:18 am

With regards to the lineout, I think it comes down to ability to execute under pressure. We've seen it in so many other areas of this team and it seems to be a real problem.

We all know they can execute a lineout in training, and they can make simple passes and catches in training. But far too often those basic skills have fallen apart in matches.

That's the difference between great sportspeople and merely very good sportspeople. What they do under pressure.

strawclearer
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by strawclearer » Thu May 03, 2018 10:44 am

It is always tempting (and often wrong) to seek a simple explanation for a complex problem, but...

We lack leaders on the field. Irrespective of how well players perform individually within a team context, sometimes great players can't lead. Maybe they're in the wrong position, maybe it's simply not in their nature. When you get a great player in a pivotal position with a brilliant rugby brain who commands respect - that player can make all the difference.

We have not been the same since Geordan Murphy retired.

Matt Toomua should be captain.
Happy days clearing straw from the pitch before the Baa-Baas games! KBO
Help save the Oceans - #RefuseTheStraw!

Rugbyflanker
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by Rugbyflanker » Thu May 03, 2018 10:54 am

Wasn't it TY fault for England then either? ;)

Leicestertinytiger
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by Leicestertinytiger » Thu May 03, 2018 11:56 am

TTRITH wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 9:14 am
What am I missing about Mapapalangi? Don't get me wrong, he has scores of potential, excellent hands and is good on the burst, but I don't think he's done enough to be considered a top performer this season?

Ive watched him fall off tackles, stand on the wing (which is a massive bug bare for me and our flankers, get in the centre of the park :censored:) and it seems to me that when he has a bad game, its an absolute stinker.

Stats may tell another story, but I dont think he offers what a back row should, IMO. It may be that he's rarely been part of a balanced back row, but I'd personally have him in the jurys out section, over Worth their Bacon.
The guy is only 24 and definitely has bags of potential. He played really well against Bath. Put in some big hits on defence and made some really good carries. Also a good lineout jumper.

Him and Evans are good young backrowers with a lot of growth in them. Also Mapa will learn loads from Kalamafoni and Mafi. Good signing in my mind with a view to the future.

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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by JackFlashJonny » Thu May 03, 2018 1:20 pm

I personally think Ford is one of the most overrated players we have seen in a long time...the board panic bought him last year and it was a silly decision we were so much better this season with Toomua at 10 as results showed

He has been lucky England have no 12 therefore he has been playing with Farrell but I will be very surprised if he continues being the England 10 for much longer...he is an excellent passer and has worked well on his kicking game but as he is such little threat himself it makes defending against him much easier in comparison to say Toomua for instance who can do everything and actually tackle...

I hope Ford can prove me wrong but I think Leicester will struggle to win any trophies of note with him at 10 unless as with his Bath days he is surrounded by pace and has a monster pack

Rugbyflanker
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by Rugbyflanker » Thu May 03, 2018 1:25 pm

Excellent post JFJ,100% spot on!

strawclearer
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by strawclearer » Thu May 03, 2018 1:26 pm

JackFlashJonny wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:20 pm
He has been lucky England have no 12 therefore he has been playing with Farrell but I will be very surprised if he continues being the England 10 for much longer...
One of the criticisms of signing him was the long international absences. If you're right, that particular issue may soon disappear!
Happy days clearing straw from the pitch before the Baa-Baas games! KBO
Help save the Oceans - #RefuseTheStraw!

h's dad
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by h's dad » Thu May 03, 2018 1:33 pm

strawclearer wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:26 pm
JackFlashJonny wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:20 pm
He has been lucky England have no 12 therefore he has been playing with Farrell but I will be very surprised if he continues being the England 10 for much longer...
One of the criticisms of signing him was the long international absences. If you're right, that particular issue may soon disappear!
Less time for Toomua at 10 :smt022
I am neither clever enough to understand nor stupid enough to play this game

TTRITH
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by TTRITH » Thu May 03, 2018 3:44 pm

JackFlashJonny wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:20 pm
I personally think Ford is one of the most overrated players we have seen in a long time...the board panic bought him last year and it was a silly decision we were so much better this season with Toomua at 10 as results showed

He has been lucky England have no 12 therefore he has been playing with Farrell but I will be very surprised if he continues being the England 10 for much longer...he is an excellent passer and has worked well on his kicking game but as he is such little threat himself it makes defending against him much easier in comparison to say Toomua for instance who can do everything and actually tackle...

I hope Ford can prove me wrong but I think Leicester will struggle to win any trophies of note with him at 10 unless as with his Bath days he is surrounded by pace and has a monster pack
If he does lose his place with England, which I doubt as the Youngs, Ford, Farrell axis works so damn well, the Ford Toomua partnership will only get better. Everybody clamors for Toomua at 10, but who plays 12? Tait? He's played well in bursts this season, but all season at 12 will scare no one. Worth? He's promising but ultimately has a long way to go. Manu? Owen? Both 13s and both routinely injured.

What Ford lacks is a 10 of any note pushing him. He has the ability, and can spot holes, but is comfortable at Tigers. You give him a quality 10 to push him, to train with, you'll see a marked improvement in performances. At Bath he had Preistland, at Tigers he had Flood. Equally, with a better pack and a fully fit Youngs he will look much better.

Youngs, Ford, Toomua will come good for Tigers. Especially if we get a decent spell of Manu, with May and Holmes on the wings, those backs would be electric.

Whoever built a squad without a 10 to actually push Ford, or a 12 who is good enough to cause headaches for MoC to force him to play Toomua at 10 needs to firmly look at themselves. We have 4 13s, who can do a job at 12, but only one 12... it doesn't make sense.
Richard Burnett
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Grimlish
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by Grimlish » Thu May 03, 2018 4:33 pm

I’m with TTRITH. Folk on this forum too often mistake form for class. Ford and Manu are both class players, who have lacked some form this Season (in Ford’s case not so very much imo) and given an injury free run, a stable side and the right tactics, will come good.

ellis9
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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by ellis9 » Thu May 03, 2018 4:52 pm

Grimlish wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 4:33 pm
I’m with TTRITH. Folk on this forum too often mistake form for class. Ford and Manu are both class players, who have lacked some form this Season (in Ford’s case not so very much imo) and given an injury free run, a stable side and the right tactics, will come good.
Bang on! Someone talking sense at last!

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Re: Squad Analysis

Post by JP14 » Thu May 03, 2018 5:01 pm

It’s my believe that Tom Hardwick should be given a chance in order to push Ford out of his comfort zone. Unfortunately, a stubborn middle-aged disgruntled man is head coach who always revert to his plan A as he thinks it’s the best plan and won’t listen to anybody’s advice on whether to change his plan and give youngsters a chance.

To be honest, a stubborn, middle-aged, disgruntled man could be anybody? A forum member, several monarchs & leaders in history etc 😂
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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