Cohen, Glynn, to be sacked?

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Mark62
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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Mark62 » Sat May 05, 2018 7:38 pm

So he gets sacked and a new head coach comes in half through preseason and then next season starts badly and this forum gets its knickers in a knot about the new coach. Ever decreasing circles anyone.

Might it just be he was thinking that if his players had done their jobs and beaten at least one of Newcastle or Northampton they would have now been in the playoffs.

No more changes in coaching structure for at least a season please

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by MCC1964 » Sat May 05, 2018 8:42 pm

LE18 wrote:
Sat May 05, 2018 7:17 pm
Did you see MOC's face when interviewed after the game, such a miserable looking bloke! I don't expect him to be a smiling laughing guy, especially after the season he's just presided over, but gosh, who can't look just a little relaxed, perhaps he has foresight that something nasty is coming!
He’s generally is a positive bloke, but is clearly as disappointed with the season as we and the players are and that’s a good thing. Had he been laughing and joking there at the end you can guarantee he would get a slagging on here for not taking a poor season seriously enough. The last thing we need here is another coaching revolving door. How long were the setups and Sarries, Wasps, Exeter and Falcons in place before they had even a modicum of success? The bloke deserves more time and the club needs stability.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sat May 05, 2018 8:45 pm

Let's just pray he bucks his regressive coaching trend for next season!

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Tiglon » Sun May 06, 2018 9:11 am

I think the idea of sacking MOC now is ridiculous. After 6(?) losses in a row mid season and the team looking like it might be fighting Worcester for 3rd from bottom, fine, but now - no chance.

Only 3 league points less than last season, so hardly a huge regression there. Missed out on the playoffs by games won, with equal league points and a much much better points difference than Falcons, and more BPs.

We were a few moments of accuracy away from the playoffs this season. Not good, but not the disaster some make it out to be. Cheer up guys :smt023

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sun May 06, 2018 9:25 am

Broken records forgot? Less wins in RCC?

Tiglon
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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Tiglon » Sun May 06, 2018 9:52 am

IMO a failed RCC campaign is a failed RCC campaign. Whether it's 1 win or 4, all that really matters is the fact we didn't get out of the group.

Not terribly interested in records either, winning the Premiership and RCC is all that is important from my point of view. I think the possibility of that happening is closer now than it was 12 months ago, but maybe I'm over-optimistic!

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by G.K » Sun May 06, 2018 9:52 am

Despite the good win yesterday - two facts remain:

1. MoC has achieved the worst season results wise since I've been tracking performance from 2005 /2006 (yes i know). To give some perspective, this season by my 'tracker' Tigers got 12 'points' across all 3 competitions. Max is 35 (top all 'leagues' and win all playoffs). Best Tigers got was 30 points in 2006/2007 and the next worst score was 16 'points' in 2014/2015 & 2016/2017.

2. MoC has been given much more leeway than any other Head Coaches / DoRs during that period. BTW in the 2007/2008 season when Loffreda took over after the 2007 RWC cup Tigers got 18 'points'.

MoC a world class Head Coach? I for one remain to be convinced.
Nowadays referees decide matches, players by how much.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sun May 06, 2018 9:55 am

Completely overoptimistic!! We've gone backwards so how are we closer?! I think folk are getting excited over a very good win yesterday

Tiglon
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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Tiglon » Sun May 06, 2018 10:02 am

G.K wrote:
Sun May 06, 2018 9:52 am
Despite the good win yesterday - two facts remain:

1. MoC has achieved the worst season results wise since I've been tracking performance from 2005 /2006 (yes i know). To give some perspective, this season by my 'tracker' Tigers got 12 'points' across all 3 competitions. Max is 35 (top all 'leagues' and win all playoffs). Best Tigers got was 30 points in 2006/2007 and the next worst score was 16 'points' in 2014/2015 & 2016/2017.

2. MoC has been given much more leeway than any other Head Coaches / DoRs during that period. BTW in the 2007/2008 season when Loffreda took over after the 2007 RWC cup Tigers got 18 'points'.

MoC a world class Head Coach? I for one remain to be convinced.
Depends on your definition of World Class, but I would agree that no he hasn't yet proven himself to be World Class.

I like your system of tracking performances, but I think the difference with MOC and previous HC's is that the board now understand that sacking a coach after one poor season is not how you get long term success. Sacking Deano was short sighted.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sun May 06, 2018 10:05 am

There is no definition of world class when it comes to MOC,he isn't,at any level whatsoever!

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by G.K » Sun May 06, 2018 10:07 am

I take your point Tiglon, but I would have expected by now to be seeing an improvment on last year if a coach really was that good, rather than a worse season, despite a few good performances.

I really hope next season is better than this but that may be more down to Bakewell than O'Connor anyway and I have a fear that come Christmas time again we could be having the same discussions as the last one.
Nowadays referees decide matches, players by how much.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Tiglon » Sun May 06, 2018 10:18 am

I would also argue that the league has been more competitive this season than last, but that's always up for debate - next season sees moneybags Bristol added to the mix too. Even so, if we are in the same place at Christmas as we were last year, I will join the change bandwagon, but I'm fairly confident we will be significantly improved.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sun May 06, 2018 10:26 am

I think the league has been poor as has been portrayed in our RCC showings. Every team has been on a shocking run bar Chiefs and the Newcastle brilliant success story is balanced by Bath getting into the RCC after a very poor season after a good start. Quins and Saints worse than last season,LI whipping boys,Gloc still super inconsistent but some nice results from Wuss. The playoff race going on that long was more to do with the poor performances of the big guns than a competitive league imo.

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by Mark62 » Sun May 06, 2018 10:37 am

Tiglon wrote:
Sun May 06, 2018 10:18 am
I would also argue that the league has been more competitive this season than last, but that's always up for debate - next season sees moneybags Bristol added to the mix too. Even so, if we are in the same place at Christmas as we were last year, I will join the change bandwagon, but I'm fairly confident we will be significantly improved.
Completely agree with this. Playing squad next season is stronger than this, as a unit, which I don’t think can be said for all sides, looking at potential leavers and players retiring.
Being realistic minimum requirement for next season needs to be top 4 league finish, and a 3/3 record in the Champions Cup. In order to achieve this by Christmas we need to be a minimum of top 6 league and 2/2 in Europe.
I appreciate that this may not suit others lofty ambitions, but realistically we won’t be there to challenge Exeter or Saracens over the season, and without a heavy dose of Lady Luck any further than European quarters is beyond us.
As for other sides, we need to see how Bristol get on, yes there have been some big name signings, but some are nearing the end of their career and some are distinctly average.
For me the strugglers next season, will be Worcester, Quins and Newcastle, who are losing a shed load of experience as well as some of their key players reaching the end of their careers

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Re: MOC to be sacked?

Post by fleabane » Mon May 07, 2018 3:22 pm

The real question is what objectives was MOC set in a season when he has had his opportunity to mould the team. I cannot believe that they were less than ECC semis and Premiership final, (and thereby qualification for next seasons ECC). They could not have been as low as just get into the top six!

So what happens when you miss all your targets and your appraisal comes around?

Excuses? None!

I think that any inaction by the board would be to cover themselves and their inexplicable decision, after “scouring the world” for a top class coach, to appoint MOC.

They have said that the players liked him. That’s a lot like letting schoolchildren choose their own teachers because they like them, rather than appoint those who can teach and improve their chances, who can lead and motivate them to reach greater heights, whilst not being their best friends.
Valhalla I am coming!

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