Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

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markharbtiger
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Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by markharbtiger » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:58 am

Although I expect a highly competitive match against Exeter, I am also expecting Tigers and Saints to be in 9th/10th league positions after today...
No it’s not the end of the season, but I do wonder if this reflects a trend in the health of our local teams (and no, I’m not including that team from London).

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by G.K » Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:40 am

Coventry Wasps are in the West Midlands anyway.
Nowadays referees decide matches, players by how much.

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by WiggoTiger » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:25 am

Been on the cards for ages. Poor recruitment over the last few years mean weak back up players. Poor development from academy and getting the players into first team squads regularly.
Also lack of playing styles from both teams, both used to be solid up front but have tailed off regularly. Hartley was awful yesterday and mallinder jnr seemed to be rabbit in headlights.
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by jgriffin » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:34 am

IMO in both cases, the DORs took the fall for poor coaching teams. Mallinder should've kept King and shipped Nobby long ago, Cockers failed to get decent backs coaches or retain those that would've IMO made a difference in the forwards and tackle area as well. Both also have tried to live within their means, something several other teams (and increasing) have failed to do, and thus fed the inflation of wages. There is a parallel with pre-2008 economies, you can feed the inflationary beast so far, but then someone calls in a debt (e.g. the equivalent of a run on a bank). Wasps are the most obvious, unless they refinance to a Malaysian pension fund like Quins are or have a billionnaire fan ownng them.
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by Big Dai » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:45 pm

East or West Midlands, Nine or Noine, You or Yo? Does it matter? The Midlands team playing the best rugby at the moment is Wasps. In these days of success based following, razzmatazz and professionalism the evolution of one side above the other two in the area is inevitable. (Thank you Darwen). It may hack many off but The former London Wasps, Wycombe vagabonds or what ever you want to call them have found a niche and exploited it leaving the other two in their wake. Rugby in the East Midlands, at the top level at least. is in danger of extinction. The new breed, the franchise club, is taking over. (IMHO and TMID)
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by Rugbyflanker » Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:25 pm

Two words "coaching team"

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by JP14 » Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:55 pm

Don't fret, Hinckley is continuing its rise through the leagues and is currently in poll position to be promoted to National 1!!!!
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by BFG » Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:03 pm

It's far too easy to just say coaching team, but if you genuinely think that Leicester are good enough to be top dogs then fair enough!
Most probably know that I do have much sympathy for all top level coaches these days and I don't enjoy seeing them sacked left right and centre!
Everyone has money to spend these days, that is the first leveller in my opinion, and that was always the long term plan to make rugby's top tier more competitive!
The second big impact is academy and youth rugby, modern society does not allow the types of character building that once took place.
Things like health and safety, human rights and child protection have changed the upbringing, and that has affected the attitude of the young player, and they have everything done for them, yes they are soft.
Add to this the coaches son, the former players son, the cousin etc.
Leicester have a few, I know Saints have a few some of which will be lesser known to most on here, but it does go much deeper into the development process than most know or ever hear of, infecting the very process from start!
Why can being connected be so harmful?
They get away with things that others might not, and they are ultimately protected and they know it, a protected animal is not a true wild animal, and the young animals are the ones who push the old dogs!
It's all gone a bit soft from start to finish in my opinion!

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by JP14 » Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:04 pm

I believe that when MOC left, Cockers was free and that balance had gone. Add that to injury crisis, poor handling of the Lions players after the Australian tour, poor management from both coaching and board and not giving opportunities to players like Lewington, Odogwu and that lead to players such as Salvi, Parling, Waldrom, Scully, Morris, Gibson, Slater, Burns, Bell, Williams, Roberts, Fonua, Loamanu, Balmain, Ghirildini, Castro to leave
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by Jimmy Skitz » Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:01 pm

I remember some time ago there was a baseless rumour that King Power International, the parent company of Leicester City, were looking to buy the Tigers, at the time most seemed to say they didn't want it and club should stay in the "Tigers family", given the decisions taken by the board since I wonder how many would welcome it were it true now?

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by ellis9 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:47 am

Big Dai wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:45 pm
East or West Midlands, Nine or Noine, You or Yo? Does it matter? The Midlands team playing the best rugby at the moment is Wasps. In these days of success based following, razzmatazz and professionalism the evolution of one side above the other two in the area is inevitable. (Thank you Darwen). It may hack many off but The former London Wasps, Wycombe vagabonds or what ever you want to call them have found a niche and exploited it leaving the other two in their wake. Rugby in the East Midlands, at the top level at least. is in danger of extinction. The new breed, the franchise club, is taking over. (IMHO and TMID)
Yet have still won absolutely nothing.

Tigers have won more than Wasps have in the past few years.

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by Smudge » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:49 am

What Tigers in foreign ownership? Wash your mouth out!
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by Big Dai » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:22 pm

ellis9 wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:47 am
Big Dai wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:45 pm
East or West Midlands, Nine or Noine, You or Yo? Does it matter? The Midlands team playing the best rugby at the moment is Wasps. In these days of success based following, razzmatazz and professionalism the evolution of one side above the other two in the area is inevitable. (Thank you Darwen). It may hack many off but The former London Wasps, Wycombe vagabonds or what ever you want to call them have found a niche and exploited it leaving the other two in their wake. Rugby in the East Midlands, at the top level at least. is in danger of extinction. The new breed, the franchise club, is taking over. (IMHO and TMID)
Yet have still won absolutely nothing.

Tigers have won more than Wasps have in the past few years.
Not one for trends then Ellis? Ask not what they have won but what they will win. Of the three sides at the moment I know where the the signs of improvement are and where the signs of degradation are starting to show. You can change things, of course. But the threat remains and should not be ignored. Past records are now irrelevant, save to point to the future.
Support the Matt Hampson trust. Buy your mother a Hambo calendar. SHE WILL LOVE IT! (Especially the pictures of Owen Williams)

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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by strawclearer » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:35 pm

I've just read "Stuart Barnes' talking points: A look back on 2017 and some 2018 predictions." Other than referring to Manu, he doesn't mention Tigers. Not once. I look forward to the time when - love us or hate us - they can't ignore us.

Onwards and upwards - it will happen!
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Re: Rugby in E-Mids in decline?

Post by ellis9 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:53 pm

Big Dai wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:22 pm
ellis9 wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:47 am
Big Dai wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:45 pm
East or West Midlands, Nine or Noine, You or Yo? Does it matter? The Midlands team playing the best rugby at the moment is Wasps. In these days of success based following, razzmatazz and professionalism the evolution of one side above the other two in the area is inevitable. (Thank you Darwen). It may hack many off but The former London Wasps, Wycombe vagabonds or what ever you want to call them have found a niche and exploited it leaving the other two in their wake. Rugby in the East Midlands, at the top level at least. is in danger of extinction. The new breed, the franchise club, is taking over. (IMHO and TMID)
Yet have still won absolutely nothing.

Tigers have won more than Wasps have in the past few years.
Not one for trends then Ellis? Ask not what they have won but what they will win. Of the three sides at the moment I know where the the signs of improvement are and where the signs of degradation are starting to show. You can change things, of course. But the threat remains and should not be ignored. Past records are now irrelevant, save to point to the future.
If Tigers managed to turn it around and the forwards started to perform and we finished in the top 4, I'd say we would have a better chance than Wasps of winning the title.

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