Matt O'Connor

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BFG
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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by BFG » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:34 am

I don't think anyone has forgot those heavy defeats!
The way I saw it was Cockers was relitively inexperienced and had a fairly simple and honest approach to management and as a former forward a fairly simple game plan but that game plan was severely disrupted by injuries to players like Manu, and not forgetting he lost his best prop Cole for a considerable spell, and there was quite a big transition of older players during his spell in charge that any coach would find difficult to manage.
Mauger was brought in to help coach the team as part of some sort of evolution, unfortunately it was more like a revolution!
It should've been the dream team really with all bases covered but they just couldn't make it meet somewhere in the middle!
MOC has experience and he has some younger voices around him, it is looking a lot healthier!

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by RagingBull » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:36 am

Don’t think people have forgotten those although that LI home game was right when we had the worse injury crisis the club had suffered in a while.

Mauger didn’t have a game plan for NH rugby, and that’s why he lost the senior tigers players.

I mean how much of our game plan was just hoping that Veainu will create something?

Cockers - Suffered against wide attacking back play mostly.
Mauger - Suffered against Big packs.

I’m sure Mauger is a good coach but he wasn’t ready for a Heach coach role and he wasn’t ready for NH rugby.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by Scott11 » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:44 am

Good debate guys! There's arguments for both sides i guess,I'm just glad that dark period has ended. I wasn't in the MOC camp,i thought the Tigers way was outdated and we should've gone down the world class coach route,boy am i enjoying being wrong lol! Still early days yet but could we be on the verge of something special? Mapapalangi topped the AP chart this week for carries and Thacker topped the turnover charts and he was a replacement! Our recruitment as a whole has easily been the best in the AP this season imo,well done to all involved!

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by strawclearer » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:47 am

In retrospect, I don't think the Cockers/Mauger dynamic was ever going to work. The demarcation lines - if they were ever defined - were never bought in to. Players were thus expected to choose between whose direction to follow - I suspect on an almost daily basis. As a clever old chap called Matthew once said:

"No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other."

Anyway - water under - much more interested in the next few games, starting with Worcs!
Happy days clearing straw from the pitch before the Baa-Baas games! KBO
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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by ellis9 » Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:22 pm

Scott11 wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:59 am
You would believe anything Ellis as long as your precious Cockers wasn't to blame! Get over it,he's gone and good riddance he was slowly destroying our great club! Don't forget we all have our little sources and I've been told that the vast majority of the players were ecstatic when Cockers was binned,it doesn't take a genius to work that out though just looking at the players smiling faces!!
You'd believe anything that makes Cockerill sound bad so you're doing the same as me but with the opposite opinion.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by johnthegriff » Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:50 pm

Cocker was a proven forwards coach under Pat Howard, he continued his education under Lofreda and Meyer eventually taking the top job when Meyer left and then in partnership (ignore job titles) with Matt O Connor we went on to win trophies. Injuries to Anthony Allen and Manu and to back up centres like Hepetema, Bai, Lofreda, Roberts and Matt Smith hampered our backs play the departure of MOC did not help. Paul Burke who took charge of the backs had about fourteen different combinations of centres in that season and in my opinion was unlucky to be sacked, he never had a chance. With hind sight it was a mistake for Aaron Mauger to be given the title Head Coach when Cocker was Director of Rugby it led to confusion and conflict in coaching. Personally I thought it would be Mauger to depart and I hoped MOC would come to take charge of the backs, re-uniting a winning combination, but it was Cocker who went first, the matches in the early part of this year after Cocker had gone showed no improvement apart from Anglo Welsh fixtures where the coaching was down to the junior coaches so MOC was appointed.
I like the current system where Ged Glynn is in charge of all Rugby matters, and one coach is dictating the style of play of the whole team.
I regret the departure of Cocker but he has gone and we move on, at the moment we are looking pretty good, there is still more to come it will be interesting this time next year when Matt O.C has had more time to develop his team.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by CJ » Tue Nov 21, 2017 2:12 pm

still early days but I hope (believe?) that, come the end of the season, we will be able to pen one of those Private Eye type apologies.

very much enjoying our rugby now and am postponing a foreign trip to make sure I'm here for the end of May.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by Tiglon » Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 pm

I was pretty skeptical when MOC was appointed, but I think that was as much due to the Tigers board ramping up the expectations by heralding their intentions to scour the world for the top coach.

It's been a positive first few months, with some great performances (and a couple not so great), bold signings and I'm excited about the team he's building - more than I have been for years.

Cockers was a great Tiger, he did so much for the club and he played a big part in the winning of many trophies as player and coach. It was time to move on, but he should be celebrated and appreciated for what he achieved.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by jgriffin » Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:47 pm

Agree with the last post, but dear God Scott you are ludicrous. Your sources? Thought not.
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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by JP14 » Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:41 pm

We shouldn't get too far ahead of ourselves but I agree that MOC has quickly turned our fortunes around. Last year we had a decent squad but suffered badly with injuries.

I think it's also important to recognize the efforts of Alex Martin who has returned from Loughborough Uni as Head of Strength & Conditioning, he has changed Tiger's fitness regime for the better in my opinion. I know we have had some long-term injuries, including Manu again, but we have had a far less of an injury crisis than we did this time last season
"Our Greatest Glory Is Not In Never Failing, But In Rising Every Time We Fall" Confucius

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by Seal » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:39 pm

The biggest problem with Mauger is that his gameplan was far too complicated for both the player base and the Premiership. It was very obvious that as soon as things got a bit difficult the players on the pitch had no idea what to do and everything fell apart.

Too many of our tries last season came from nothing or acts of individual brilliance. Veainu alone must have single handedly been responsible for a good 10-12 league points. I love brilliant individual tries, but if that's all you can do you're screwed.

I think Mauger would have done a lot better with the current set of (fit) backs, Ford, Toomua and May would fit in well with that fast paced rugby.

However if you're reliant on all players being fit at one time it's pointless.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by Scott11 » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:20 pm

My source? A Chiefs fan who is head of a company who are one of the main sponsors at Sandy Park. A very good friend of Greg Bateman,I trust him 100%!

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by RagingBull » Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:04 pm

Cockers had his issues with some players, but so did Mauger.

Hence both getting the boot as the results didn't outweigh the issues.

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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by jgriffin » Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:45 pm

Back in 2013 my source, a player Scott has probably never heard of called Fe'aunati (who I worked with and others may recall) had some contacts in Tigers (who I won't name) and his prediction was that Tigers were due to decline:
1 a whole generation of players who knew how to win dirty were going, and the replacements were academy types who weren't as mentally tough
2 Tigers' tactics were simple and outdated and needed revitalising
3 there were factions in the players that affected the team etc. (some very anti-Cockers, others anti -MOC) as well as favourites
There were other bits that may or may not have been relevant.
I believe he was largely accurate, especially the impact of #1.
We grossly underestimate the impact of injury and retirements on the team performance, and indeed during that period before AM we managed well given those issues BUT needed revitalising. I'm with RB in his withering assessment of AM.
While I'm agnostic that Cockers' departure was necessary, his subsequent work with Toulon and Edinburgh suggests that his expertise was/is somewhat greater than Scott would have us believe, certainly not witless, useless or a spent force.
What I do know is that we are now in a better place, but have spent cash that never seemed to be around previously to get there.
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Re: Matt O'Connor

Post by fentiger » Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:20 pm

What I do know is that we are now in a better place, but have spent cash that never seemed to be around previously to get there/quote]

That is true, I wonder why (cash not previously available)? :smt017

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