Watching the Lions

[Downsouth]

Looking at the midweek team, it looks like Cole needs an absolute stormer to even have a chance of a bench slot. I do hope that the best 15 is chosen even if that means the likes of Warburton don't play. I suspect Farrel's chances of starting were hit when Youngs pulled out.

[jgriffin]

I suspect that some rather odd selections - e.g. Warburton will still occur. Can't say I'd be chuffed if the current back row are broken up to slot him in, nor AWJ in the locks as a starter. I suspect gatland has put his eggs in one basket and not even vaguely gone further, despite better choices being available.

[welshy08]

Honestly not sure the English and Irish rugby industries and their broadcasters can handle even the slightest "slight" regarding the lions. Their whole industries seems to be sustained by a manufactured hype and narrative, to the extent that a Warren Gatland doesn't have to do anything really to burst their bubble or to outrage them. Get a couple of players in as cover and to carry tackle bags..and boom, off they all go like a hysterical teenage girl in a poxy prom dress.

In Wales we are lucky. We get the BBC (Scrum v, Johnathan Davies, Gwyn Jones, basically every dour pessimistic former player they can get your hands on) telling us in no uncertain terms if our players and teams are rubbish. We even import english poeple to do it if we get a little bit too optimistic.

In England, Professional Rugby is done the complete opposite way. It is all about getting subscriptions and viewers for BT and Sky. Constantly Selling a product. Over-hyping players. They are hardly going to tell you that next season is going to be a washout. That their players suck. They are going to hype everyone to the hills and hope they convince enough people to buy subscriptions and so to turn a profit.
So vastly different.
So look, No one is insulting your nation, your club your family or you. No one hates you. This isn't the Eurovision Song Contest (where basically everyone does). Some guy just didn't pick some seriously overhyped player who's hype you bought,who happens to play for your nation or club, after picking many others who play for your nation or your club.
So what?
Who cares.
They are not you you are not they. It is all only Product, Brand at the end of the day. Colgate v McCleans toothpaste.

Not even worth a thought...unless of course you are a English Supremacist (English rugby attracts them like nothing else) then I'm afraid this message is wasted on you.

[northerntiger]

The tone of your post is, unusually, quite reasonable.

The content, sadly, is rubbish

[mol2]

Yawn. That's just Xenophobic twaddle. I was born in Wales and disagree with your assertions. They were echo'd by Eddie Jones who isn't English or Irish as I recall.
If all that was required was a bag carrier they could just rope in some locals from the local under 20s.

The comments are not a slight on the Welsh players because they are Welsh but because they are not worth the Lions shirt. Wales were pants in the 6N and their players feature disproportionately in the squad. Scotland are good enough to beat Australia in Australia but get less of a representation.

The same has been said about Lawes (who isn't Welsh) why is he in NZ ahead of at least 1 if not 2 English locks - not to mention those of the other nations who missed out such as Ritchie Gray.)

[h's dad]

Honestly not sure the English and Irish rugby industries and their broadcasters can handle even the slightest "slight" regarding the lions. Their whole industries seems to be sustained by a manufactured hype and narrative, to the extent that a Warren Gatland doesn't have to do anything really to burst their bubble or to outrage them. Get a couple of players in as cover and to carry tackle bags..and boom, off they all go like a hysterical teenage girl in a poxy prom dress.

In Wales we are lucky. We get the BBC (Scrum v, Johnathan Davies, Gwyn Jones, basically every dour pessimistic former player they can get your hands on) telling us in no uncertain terms if our players and teams are rubbish. We even import english poeple to do it if we get a little bit too optimistic.

In England, Professional Rugby is done the complete opposite way. It is all about getting subscriptions and viewers for BT and Sky. Constantly Selling a product. Over-hyping players. They are hardly going to tell you that next season is going to be a washout. That their players suck. They are going to hype everyone to the hills and hope they convince enough people to buy subscriptions and so to turn a profit.
So vastly different.
So look, No one is insulting your nation, your club your family or you. No one hates you. This isn't the Eurovision Song Contest (where basically everyone does). Some guy just didn't pick some seriously overhyped player who's hype you bought,who happens to play for your nation or club, after picking many others who play for your nation or your club.
So what?
Who cares.
They are not you you are not they. It is all only Product, Brand at the end of the day. Colgate v McCleans toothpaste.

Not even worth a thought...unless of course you are a English Supremacist (English rugby attracts them like nothing else) then I'm afraid this message is wasted on you.

Nice one Welshy.
Jonathan Davies telling it like it is for Wales? he's the most one-eyed Taff (all right, second after your good self) there is. Wales can somehow do no wrong in his eyes. Supremacist? It's looking more and more as if the series whitewash down under was more a sign of what a dismal patch Australia are going through than any England revival. Back to back 6N triumphs more a sign of the paucity of the opposition than real dominance from England who were really very poor in the last one. For many of us it isn't even a saving grace to see that Wales are just so much worse (or as you put it, unlucky ).
Your other recent post suggesting that it isn't about taking the best players on tour but a cohesive unit, justifying a bulk selection from one team, may have merit but then to go and pick Wales? Bizarre. Us supremacists wouldn't even mind if it had been Ireland rather than England. But Wales .

[Chobbsy]

Honestly not sure the English and Irish rugby industries and their broadcasters can handle even the slightest "slight" regarding the lions. Their whole industries seems to be sustained by a manufactured hype and narrative, to the extent that a Warren Gatland doesn't have to do anything really to burst their bubble or to outrage them. Get a couple of players in as cover and to carry tackle bags..and boom, off they all go like a hysterical teenage girl in a poxy prom dress.

In Wales we are lucky. We get the BBC (Scrum v, Johnathan Davies, Gwyn Jones, basically every dour pessimistic former player they can get your hands on) telling us in no uncertain terms if our players and teams are rubbish. We even import english poeple to do it if we get a little bit too optimistic.

In England, Professional Rugby is done the complete opposite way. It is all about getting subscriptions and viewers for BT and Sky. Constantly Selling a product. Over-hyping players. They are hardly going to tell you that next season is going to be a washout. That their players suck. They are going to hype everyone to the hills and hope they convince enough people to buy subscriptions and so to turn a profit.
So vastly different.
So look, No one is insulting your nation, your club your family or you. No one hates you. This isn't the Eurovision Song Contest (where basically everyone does). Some guy just didn't pick some seriously overhyped player who's hype you bought,who happens to play for your nation or club, after picking many others who play for your nation or your club.
So what?
Who cares.
They are not you you are not they. It is all only Product, Brand at the end of the day. Colgate v McCleans toothpaste.

Not even worth a thought...unless of course you are a English Supremacist (English rugby attracts them like nothing else) then I'm afraid this message is wasted on you.

Nice one Welshy.
Jonathan Davies telling it like it is for Wales? he's the most one-eyed Taff (all right, second after your good self) there is. Wales can somehow do no wrong in his eyes. Supremacist? It's looking more and more as if the series whitewash down under was more a sign of what a dismal patch Australia are going through than any England revival. Back to back 6N triumphs more a sign of the paucity of the opposition than real dominance from England who were really very poor in the last one. For many of us it isn't even a saving grace to see that Wales are just so much worse (or as you put it, unlucky ).
Your other recent post suggesting that it isn't about taking the best players on tour but a cohesive unit, justifying a bulk selection from one team, may have merit but then to go and pick Wales? Bizarre. Us supremacists wouldn't even mind if it had been Ireland rather than England. But Wales .

Shane Williams (who is Welsh if my memory serves me correctly) spoke well on Saturday while on Talk Sport about it devaluing the Lions shirt, he was quite angry really saying he had worked so hard to earn the shirt and now they would be given away just because of location. He picked out Joe Launchbury in particular saying he had, had a stand out 6 nations and also tour of Argentina. He also admits he got a call up last Lions tour while he was in Australia on holiday, but like he said it was his third tour so he had already "EARNED" the right to wear the shirt. He said you get a Lions shirt because you are the best in Britain and Island in your position. Not just because you are Welsh and in NZ.

[Soggypitch]

Looking at the midweek team, it looks like Cole needs an absolute stormer to even have a chance of a bench slot. I do hope that the best 15 is chosen even if that means the likes of Warburton don't play. I suspect Farrel's chances of starting were hit when Youngs pulled out.

Farrell will play if he's fully fit, the absence of YBY has made no difference to that.
Thankfully however Sexton has started to get some form so if OW doesn't make it the half backs will be Irish quite rightly.

I still think there is a case to have Sexton at 10 and Farrell at 12 with Teo at 13, but doubt WG will do that. I just hope he leaves Warburton out of the 23 because he is seriously under cooked/lacking form and fitness. AWJ would be good to have on the bench but he should not start ahead of the Sarries boys on form.

We have a small chance if the weather is bad and our backs take any chances offered, something that has been beyond them thus far. The forwards should be competitive.

[biffer]

I'm disappointed for Finn Russell that he will always be tagged as someone who wasn't called up by right but by geography, when he's the one of the six who is genuinely deserving of a call up. Obviously I'm not neutral in this but I think he's played exceptionally well for Scotland against Italy and Australia and was in the discussion for the original squad, unlike the other 5 who were called up. There are some (not likely people on here to be fair, as everyone does actually follow rugby outside of big tours and 6Ns) who will tar him with the same brush as the others.

[biffer]

Also, Stephen Jones on twitter is reporting that an unnamed Scotland player turned Gatland down when he was asked to come over as a replacement.

[G.K]

I'm disappointed for Finn Russell that he will always be tagged as someone who wasn't called up by right but by geography, when he's the one of the six who is genuinely deserving of a call up. Obviously I'm not neutral in this but I think he's played exceptionally well for Scotland against Italy and Australia and was in the discussion for the original squad, unlike the other 5 who were called up. There are some (not likely people on here to be fair, as everyone does actually follow rugby outside of big tours and 6Ns) who will tar him with the same brush as the others.

Finn Russells is the in-form FH in B&I and should have been in the Lions squad from the beginning, as should Launchbury.

Gatland has devalued the Lions ethos and turned this tour into a farce, hope he stays in NZ after the blackwash is over.

[trendylfj]

With only 2 midweek games (including tomorrow) left, I cannot see any of the "call-ups" featuring in any more than those and hopefully protecting players who are in with a chance of a test spot from injury. The bottom line about the jersey is that there is no differentiation - your are a Lion or you are not. To many here that is what one of the problems is. I cannot see how anyone can say the call-ups are there on merit - IMHO they are not. I can however, understand anyone saying get stuffed Gatland - I am not travelling all that way to bench one game and possibly play in another. It just rankles with me that they can then say they are a Lion just because they happened to be nearer to NZ than others in their position. People are paying good money and in some cases a lot of money to see the best on our islands and they are not.

[biffer]

With only 2 midweek games (including tomorrow) left, I cannot see any of the "call-ups" featuring in any more than those and hopefully protecting players who are in with a chance of a test spot from injury. The bottom line about the jersey is that there is no differentiation - your are a Lion or you are not. To many here that is what one of the problems is. I cannot see how anyone can say the call-ups are there on merit - IMHO they are not. I can however, understand anyone saying get stuffed Gatland - I am not travelling all that way to bench one game and possibly play in another. It just rankles with me that they can then say they are a Lion just because they happened to be nearer to NZ than others in their position. People are paying good money and in some cases a lot of money to see the best on our islands and they are not.

Exactly my point. Lumping Russell in with the others as not there on merit.

[wormus]

Great weather here in Hamilton very sunny day and no prospect of rain but as we know you can get all seasons weather in one day here! This should be a running game but people here are amazed at Gatland importing lots of bench donkeys ( except for Finn Russell who should have been selected / standby) Courtney Lawes is reconned to be the key Lions man. - at Rotorua he was announced as scoring a try instead of the real scorer Itoje!
Chiefs have a very strong team and bench with Messam etc having watched them train from the sidelines without the red jersey.... Lions do look weak on the bench with these unnecessary seagulls that have flown in. Great atmosphere here for tonight's game.

[drc_007]

6-13 HT

Lions letting them off the hook with a couple of moronic penalties and a yellow card for Marler. Would not be surprised in Marler gets cited after the match.
Nowell took his try well but still seems very unsure in defence.