Could he be the new Neil Back

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LE18
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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by LE18 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:36 pm

I am not a fan of HT as a hooker, but I do acknowledge he has talent but not as a 2, and he got turned over several times, I also thought that every time we had a set scrum on Saturday, our scrum could not move forward over the ball and Kitto had to dig the ball out generally from the 2nd row!

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Spicer » Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:30 am

LE18 wrote:I am not a fan of HT as a hooker, but I do acknowledge he has talent but not as a 2, and he got turned over several times, I also thought that every time we had a set scrum on Saturday, our scrum could not move forward over the ball and Kitto had to dig the ball out generally from the 2nd row!
From what I remember we were on top in the scrums even with Harry playing 2 for 50 ish minutes. Not dominant, but certainly got the better of them despite the size difference of the hookers.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by h's dad » Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:24 am

Spicer wrote:
LE18 wrote:I am not a fan of HT as a hooker, but I do acknowledge he has talent but not as a 2, and he got turned over several times, I also thought that every time we had a set scrum on Saturday, our scrum could not move forward over the ball and Kitto had to dig the ball out generally from the 2nd row!
From what I remember we were on top in the scrums even with Harry playing 2 for 50 ish minutes. Not dominant, but certainly got the better of them despite the size difference of the hookers.
Some think Harry would be a better hooker if he was bigger and heavier, others seem to contend that size makes no difference(!). Whichever is correct, parity or even a slight superiority over Northampton's third choice hooker cannot be considered a ringing endorsement.
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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by mightymouse » Wed Feb 01, 2017 8:44 am

I think many people see Thacker as the best player on the park for 2 reasons

One is that they are not looking at what is happening in scrummage or mauls and secondly they only see him in lower grade games where he excels.

Sadly when he plays in the first team against top teams especially against heavyweight packs all his deficiencies come to light.

It is a shame because he is a great little player and in another era he would have been another star.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Iain » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:18 am

Right, I've seen a few posts saying that hooking doesn't matter much now. And in many cases they're right: because the hooker is now expected to scrummage. And that's something he's REALLY not that hot at.

Twenty to thirty years ago he would have been an excellent hooker - absolutely ideal. But the game has changed and hookers have a different role in the scrum. They have to be able to push and scrummage.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by jgriffin » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:49 am

As I've said all along - club should give him a year to convert to 9 and then take it from there. Personally think he could be no worse and potentially better than Kitto.
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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by BFG » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:58 am

jgriffin wrote:As I've said all along - club should give him a year to convert to 9 and then take it from there. Personally think he could be no worse and potentially better than Kitto.
What about Harrison and White or any young talent currently in the academy, I think it would send out a potentially very damaging message to the rest of the squad!
I don't think he should be given anything that any other player would not be given!
He won't be the first talented player to not reach the required standard at Leicester and he won't be the last, Leicester need to move on and quickly!
Last edited by BFG on Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Noddy555 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:58 am

Yes Hot-Charlie I agree with you about EJ but if he fails to win the 2019 world cup in Japan after everything that's been invested in him and the players then he will be out of the door so HT may have to wait until 2020 to play for England unless he suddenly discovers he's got a Scottish grandma then I'm sure the Scots would snap him up.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Iain » Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:26 am

Noddy555 wrote:Yes Hot-Charlie I agree with you about EJ but if he fails to win the 2019 world cup in Japan after everything that's been invested in him and the players then he will be out of the door so HT may have to wait until 2020 to play for England unless he suddenly discovers he's got a Scottish grandma then I'm sure the Scots would snap him up.
He's leaving after the World Cup anyway. This has been well documented.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Spicer » Wed Feb 01, 2017 4:55 pm

h's dad wrote:
Spicer wrote:
LE18 wrote:I am not a fan of HT as a hooker, but I do acknowledge he has talent but not as a 2, and he got turned over several times, I also thought that every time we had a set scrum on Saturday, our scrum could not move forward over the ball and Kitto had to dig the ball out generally from the 2nd row!
From what I remember we were on top in the scrums even with Harry playing 2 for 50 ish minutes. Not dominant, but certainly got the better of them despite the size difference of the hookers.
Some think Harry would be a better hooker if he was bigger and heavier, others seem to contend that size makes no difference(!). Whichever is correct, parity or even a slight superiority over Northampton's third choice hooker cannot be considered a ringing endorsement.
Fair points. But we did have our 4th choice props compared to their 2nd choice ones. (Unless I've forgotten anybody. People talk about him either being a 2 or 7, but I reckon he could be a pretty good 8. He'd have a lot of space to exploit, would often join the backs and have a lot of ball in hand which plays to his strengths. I doubt many would agree with me however. :smt044

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by kornboy130 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:22 pm

BFG wrote:
jgriffin wrote:As I've said all along - club should give him a year to convert to 9 and then take it from there. Personally think he could be no worse and potentially better than Kitto.
What about Harrison and White or any young talent currently in the academy, I think it would send out a potentially very damaging message to the rest of the squad!
I don't think he should be given anything that any other player would not be given!
He won't be the first talented player to not reach the required standard at Leicester and he won't be the last, Leicester need to move on and quickly!
You quite clearly have an axe to grind here because this post along with your assertion that no one bothered to challenge you on earlier ("I know but won't say") are ridiculous.

Bear in mind our current first choice hooker with 2 Lions test caps was given time to convert to hooker from Centre. Giving a player an opportunity to move positions where their skill set might be better placed wouldn't send out a bad message to the squad and other players have been afforded this here and at other clubs in order to further themselves and the ambition of their team so your seeming passion to have him removed from the squad is farcical.


I hasten to add I'm not advocating his move to scrum half personally as I think around the park in his carrying, tackling, passing and offloading he offers enough to be a serviceable premiership player - his size will, I suspect, hold him back from playing Test rugby in either the back row or at hooker.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by strawclearer » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:47 pm

Spicer wrote: Fair points. But we did have our 4th choice props compared to their 2nd choice ones. (Unless I've forgotten anybody. People talk about him either being a 2 or 7, but I reckon he could be a pretty good 8. He'd have a lot of space to exploit, would often join the backs and have a lot of ball in hand which plays to his strengths. I doubt many would agree with me however. :smt044
Most on here argue for 2 or 7; some go for 12 or 13; a few - me included - see merit in 9; but that's the first proposal for 8 I've seen! :smt038
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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by BFG » Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:39 pm

kornboy130
You quite clearly have an axe to grind here because this post along with your assertion that no one bothered to challenge you on earlier ("I know but won't say") are ridiculous.

Bear in mind our current first choice hooker with 2 Lions test caps was given time to convert to hooker from Centre. Giving a player an opportunity to move positions where their skill set might be better placed wouldn't send out a bad message to the squad and other players have been afforded this here and at other clubs in order to further themselves and the ambition of their team so your seeming passion to have him removed from the squad is farcical.


I hasten to add I'm not advocating his move to scrum half personally as I think around the park in his carrying, tackling, passing and offloading he offers enough to be a serviceable premiership player - his size will, I suspect, hold him back from playing Test rugby in either the back row or at hooker.
Damn right I have an axe to grind, seeing the team I follow physically smashed off the park and then arguably the physically weakest player up front hailed as the future, that is ridiculous!
Has nothing been learned from the beatings because there is only one outcome.
Leicester need to become bigger and stronger not smaller and weaker.
Tom Youngs converted to hooker when we needed a hooker as Davies and Chuter were nearing the end of their careers and he has the mentality for front row play, it was suggested the front row could be a place for him after he had a fight in a match.
From the very beginning I never thought that HT had the mentality for front row play!
We don't currently need another 7 and we don't need another 9 and he'd surely only be 4th choice in that position anyway.
He obviously isn't strong enough for test rugby and I don't think it's debatable one bit that he isn't strong enough for European club level and top four Premiership either.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Noddy555 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:48 pm

No Spicer unless he grows another 15 inches, No. 8's these days are used as the 3rd option to throw to in a line out unless you have a tall flanker such as Crofty, come to think of it the more options you have in a line out the better, a team with 6 or 7 options could leave the opposition confused as long as communication lines are clear.

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Re: Could he be the new Neil Back

Post by Iain » Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:49 am

Woah, wait. Was that suggestion of him playing as an 8 serious?

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