Manu out for season

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strawclearer
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Re: Manu out for season

Post by strawclearer » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:45 pm

chris111 wrote:Well said - I am not actually at all naïve and sentimental; it was Roly's choice of language that I find distasteful.
Oh I know you're not and apologies if I came across that way! I was simply trying to tell Roly he was wrong without being gratuitously offensive! (Tough work but someone's got to do it!) :smt003
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Re: Manu out for season

Post by BFG » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:49 pm

So Roly wants Leicester to weaken the scrum that gave his Sarries side a good going over with a player he has warmed to in his absence and also wants Leicester to throw away Manu who his Sarries side would love to take to replace the ageing Barritt. :smt018
He mixes his logic with his agenda very well, beware!
No idea when Manu's contract is up but I know it's not the end of this season so still plenty of time for him to get back playing.
Too early to start on another target to cause division, RC has gone and now Roly is after another potential target to cause unrest!
What I would say is that he needs some time on the pitch to build robustness and find his game before being sent into the centres next time, perhaps a stint on the wing where he has played before and give him more one on one physical contact, get him back doing what he is good at before sending him into potential triple tackler areas asking him to change his natural game, he would've put the first tackler on his backside a couple of years ago but hasn't even had the time to get back up to full speed to beat those first up tackles let alone being swamped.
Eddie Jones also saw fit to include Manu in his squad.
We can have this debate this time next year, it's just not needed right now and pointless because he isn't going anywhere yet!

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by strawclearer » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:50 pm

Roly wrote:
strawclearer wrote:
So - saying it goes (present tense) with the territory is hopefully in the past - we've moved on from treating people with such contempt and referring to them in gratuitously offensive ways. Roly is right - people really are our best (almost our only) assets in a business/professional sport context - but he's very wrong in believing that the language of 'getting rid' of fellow human beings who've devoted themselves to something that really matters on an emotional level is the best way to get optimum performance from them and their fellow assets. Not in the cold light of day.
I'm not sure how you get optimum performance from a player who's been injured for 70% of his time at the club, or how his fellow players feel every time he's miraculously parachuted back in after seemingly being rehabilitated?
Yes - I can see you're not sure how to do that...
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chewbacca
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Re: Manu out for season

Post by chewbacca » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:55 pm

Would you not think that the care Manu and Crofty have received has a positive impact on the morale of their colleagues in the expectation that they will be taken care of by the club. In a military situation would the proposal be to shoot the wounded?
I'm not cynical just experienced

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by chris111 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:56 pm

jgriffin wrote:To be fair to Roly I believe that Croft, Smithy, Tait and possibly Manu will be gone, along with several other players - some longstanding, some 'projects', some 'retired' (i.e. don't want to play for anyone else). I am just hoping we haven't engineered the return of Ford in two years by laying waste to our midfield and replacing them with blokes AM plucks from the SH.
Yes, you are probably right that all four named are either coming to the end of their time at Tigers - or the end of their careers - and whilst they've all made a great contribution, there's always room for conjecture about what more they might have achieved without injury setbacks. Tom Croft, particularly, I think could have been an "all-time great".

Having said that, I always want players to leave with the good wishes and appreciation of supporters - rather than the snide "about time" comments that you occasionally see on this forum.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by jgriffin » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:00 pm

Guys, its moot till preseason 2017, assuming Rupert & Wray don't pull some loose change out and buy Manu out of his contract. Tigers have done their bit in the past for injured players and I hope they will continue to do so, but I suspect some players will be considered to have had their share. The one that might seal the end of Mrs G's season ticket is Smithy; she has been a bit iffy since Julian retired to the farm. :smt005
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Re: Manu out for season

Post by Roly » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:00 pm

strawclearer wrote:
Roly wrote:
strawclearer wrote:
So - saying it goes (present tense) with the territory is hopefully in the past - we've moved on from treating people with such contempt and referring to them in gratuitously offensive ways. Roly is right - people really are our best (almost our only) assets in a business/professional sport context - but he's very wrong in believing that the language of 'getting rid' of fellow human beings who've devoted themselves to something that really matters on an emotional level is the best way to get optimum performance from them and their fellow assets. Not in the cold light of day.
I'm not sure how you get optimum performance from a player who's been injured for 70% of his time at the club, or how his fellow players feel every time he's miraculously parachuted back in after seemingly being rehabilitated?
Yes - I can see you're not sure how to do that...
Well, its a sure thing you aren't.
“It is no use saying, ‘We are doing our best.’ You have got to succeed in doing what is necessary.” Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by chris111 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:06 pm

strawclearer wrote:
chris111 wrote:Well said - I am not actually at all naïve and sentimental; it was Roly's choice of language that I find distasteful.
Oh I know you're not and apologies if I came across that way! I was simply trying to tell Roly he was wrong without being gratuitously offensive! (Tough work but someone's got to do it!) :smt003
Thanks...I must admit I left this forum for a while because I was a little tired of the boorishness of a handful of posters (I was a mere 'chris11' then). Mainly, however, I was fed-up with the anti-Cockerill contingent and their tiresome sense of entitlement that 'their club' was not in its 'rightful place' at the top of the table!

Still, it's nice to be back, and refreshing to see that civility still largely holds sway.....!

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by strawclearer » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:08 pm

Roly wrote:
strawclearer wrote:
Roly wrote:
I'm not sure how you get optimum performance from a player who's been injured for 70% of his time at the club, or how his fellow players feel every time he's miraculously parachuted back in after seemingly being rehabilitated?
Yes - I can see you're not sure how to do that...
Well, its a sure thing you aren't.
Again, I have to agree with you - which is why I won't be applying for the DoR vacancy either! :smt003
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Re: Manu out for season

Post by Roly » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:10 pm

strawclearer wrote: Again, I have to agree with you - which is why I won't be applying for the DoR vacancy either! :smt003
Too-Shay.
“It is no use saying, ‘We are doing our best.’ You have got to succeed in doing what is necessary.” Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by Roly » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:17 pm

chewbacca wrote:Would you not think that the care Manu and Crofty have received has a positive impact on the morale of their colleagues in the expectation that they will be taken care of by the club. In a military situation would the proposal be to shoot the wounded?
If you do shoot the wounded, don't get caught....

Seriously, shooting the wounded is a poor analogy - in my experience, long term wounded are more likely to be discharged, since they cease to be an asset to their units....

Funnily enough.
“It is no use saying, ‘We are doing our best.’ You have got to succeed in doing what is necessary.” Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by BFG » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:34 pm

Roly wrote:
chewbacca wrote:Would you not think that the care Manu and Crofty have received has a positive impact on the morale of their colleagues in the expectation that they will be taken care of by the club. In a military situation would the proposal be to shoot the wounded?
If you do shoot the wounded, don't get caught....

Seriously, shooting the wounded is a poor analogy - in my experience, long term wounded are more likely to be discharged, since they cease to be an asset to their units....

Funnily enough.
Still, doesn't always make it right though does it!

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by Roly » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:01 pm

BFG wrote:So Roly wants Leicester to weaken the scrum that gave his Sarries side a good going over with a player he has warmed to in his absence and also wants Leicester to throw away Manu who his Sarries side would love to take to replace the ageing Barritt.
'My Sarries'?

:smt015

Saracens' scrum were not 'given a good going over'. I concede that in that particular match, they struggled for parity - but not for all of it.

Does Thacker weaken the scrum? Debateable - I'm not sure he could be any worse than Tom Youngs presently - he's better at carrying the ball than hooking IMO, but he did improve markedly as a hooker last year and probably should have had more opportunities to show it than he got.

Manu is past his sell-by date, even some of my most vociferous critics have acknowledged that he is unlikely to stay at the club, and suggestion of a move to Saracens is pure speculation.

5 Out of 10 for your effort at both a wind up and for technical content.

Must try harder next time.
“It is no use saying, ‘We are doing our best.’ You have got to succeed in doing what is necessary.” Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by BFG » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:03 pm

Roly wrote:
BFG wrote:So Roly wants Leicester to weaken the scrum that gave his Sarries side a good going over with a player he has warmed to in his absence and also wants Leicester to throw away Manu who his Sarries side would love to take to replace the ageing Barritt.
'My Sarries'?

:smt015

Saracens' scrum were not 'given a good going over'. I concede that in that particular match, they struggled for parity - but not for all of it.

Does Thacker weaken the scrum? Debateable - I'm not sure he could be any worse than Tom Youngs presently - he's better at carrying the ball than hooking IMO, but he did improve markedly as a hooker last year and probably should have had more opportunities to show it than he got.

Manu is past his sell-by date, even some of my most vociferous critics have acknowledged that he is unlikely to stay at the club, and suggestion of a move to Saracens is pure speculation.

5 Out of 10 for your effort at both a wind up and for technical content.

Must try harder next time.
Sarries were worked over in the scrum, it was clear to see the lack of confidence in Leicester to really go for the throat and I attribute that lack of confidence to the unsettling nature of the Leicester scrum since Thacker's inclusion.
He has no doubt improved in that area but still not enough yet as proved up in Glasgow.
The fact that Thacker has been omitted for certain fixtures needs to be understood and Manu's injury problems could possibly help a few understand some of the reasoning behind not rushing young players and even more so in the front row.
Manu is not past it, three tackers on the legs and an awkward landing would've done for anyone.
As said a stint on the wing to regain full match fitness and just to get back to his natural game could help before throwing him into the centres with ideas of changing his natural game.

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Re: Manu out for season

Post by BarmyBamford » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:30 pm

from griffin
" since Julian retired to the farm. "
I seem to recall that Julian said he wasn't retiring and was always just a phone call away.

Back on topic; isn't there insurance available against injuries and if so, hopefully the club has it.

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