Player Development.

[Bowden Tiger]

Watching yesterday's Quin's game, it was commented that all of their pack, that were on the pitch, were graduates of their Academy., or home grown. Well done to them!
However, what happened to our youngsters. Our current first choice 8 has a max of 2 home grown players. Is it due to a lack of talent coming through, or poor coaching and development?

[fleabane]

The Academy has been in difficulties for years, with a series of people leading it.

There is no excuse for its failure - there are so many active clubs and ruby playing schools within reach. Is the scouting poor, the coaching, or the opportunities given for young players to step up?

I hate comparing us to Saracens, but this is another time when there is no doubt that they are top of the tree. It isn't all about money, it's also about the people involved, and the decision makers.

The failure is yet another sign of Tigers slow decline.

[RagingBull]

Watching yesterday's Quin's game, it was commented that all of their pack, that were on the pitch, were graduates of their Academy., or home grown. Well done to them!
However, what happened to our youngsters. Our current first choice 8 has a max of 2 home grown players. Is it due to a lack of talent coming through, or poor coaching and development?

Also point out that Quins have failed top get into the top 6 the last 2 seasons a lot of which came through during those 2 seasons.


I don't think it's the coaching TBH (Hear good things about Allen and Deacon) or lack of talent in the area either I think it is more scouting TBH, not naming names but there is one coach in particular who comes to mind who has a bad rep of not picking talented players for certain reasons.

Also think we have a very narrow scouting setup mainly focusing on the usual schools rather than Clubs (something Sarries and Wuins both do). It tends to still be the old boys clubs if you know what I mean.


(Interesting though how many Tigers academy forwards have made it elsewhere? Watson and Green can't think of many other than that really compared to the amount of Backs that have gone on to better things).

[BFG]

Watching yesterday's Quin's game, it was commented that all of their pack, that were on the pitch, were graduates of their Academy., or home grown. Well done to them!
However, what happened to our youngsters. Our current first choice 8 has a max of 2 home grown players. Is it due to a lack of talent coming through, or poor coaching and development?

Also point out that Quins have failed top get into the top 6 the last 2 seasons a lot of which came through during those 2 seasons.


I don't think it's the coaching TBH (Hear good things about Allen and Deacon) or lack of talent in the area either I think it is more scouting TBH, not naming names but there is one coach in particular who comes to mind who has a bad rep of not picking talented players for certain reasons.

Also think we have a very narrow scouting setup mainly focusing on the usual schools rather than Clubs (something Sarries and Wuins both do). It tends to still be the old boys clubs if you know what I mean.


(Interesting though how many Tigers academy forwards have made it elsewhere? Watson and Green can't think of many other than that really compared to the amount of Backs that have gone on to better things).

I agree regarding certain individuals involved who have personal agendas, it's reduced the level of competitiveness that should've been available to Leicester and this has filtered through into the senior set up.

[jgriffin]

Watching yesterday's Quin's game, it was commented that all of their pack, that were on the pitch, were graduates of their Academy., or home grown. Well done to them!
However, what happened to our youngsters. Our current first choice 8 has a max of 2 home grown players. Is it due to a lack of talent coming through, or poor coaching and development?

I don't think it's the coaching TBH (Hear good things about Allen and Deacon) or lack of talent in the area either I think it is more scouting TBH, not naming names but there is one coach in particular who comes to mind who has a bad rep of not picking talented players for certain reasons.

Also think we have a very narrow scouting setup mainly focusing on the usual schools rather than Clubs (something Sarries and Wuins both do). It tends to still be the old boys clubs if you know what I mean.

Heard that one reported more than once over the years, was a focus for a mega-rant by me and a couple of other posters a few years ago, not much has changed although we do get players a lot from oop t'North where there is a little less Old Boy carp.

[AidanMcDowell]

Saracens seem to have a long reach. My son plays in the Academy for Sevenoaks who are affiliated to Saracens and whose scouts tour the area regularly.

[Spicer]

Tbh Harlequins gave those players a chance which is in itself rare. In a results driven business coaches prefer to use tried and tested players of even average ability as it represents less risk. It is the same in football currently.
Although i think quite a few of our current crop who show a lot of promise. The Thacker brothers, Wells, Fred Tuilangi, Evans, Will Owen, Yawayawa and Worth all have potential. IF they are given an opportunity and stay relatively injury free, then quite a few of the current academy could become regular first team players.

[BFG]

Tbh Harlequins gave those players a chance which is in itself rare. In a results driven business coaches prefer to use tried and tested players of even average ability as it represents less risk. It is the same in football currently.
Although i think quite a few of our current crop who show a lot of promise. The Thacker brothers, Wells, Fred Tuilangi, Evans, Will Owen, Yawayawa and Worth all have potential. IF they are given an opportunity and stay relatively injury free, then quite a few of the current academy could become regular first team players.

Hyperbole!
Evans apart it's no wonder the 1st team forwards can't maul properly and the backs struggle to cut open defences if training with that lot.
Yawayawa might have something as a winger, never see enough to judge properly as the rest are so average.
Wells? Itoje, Kruis, Launchbury, L Deacon, Kay, enough said!
Can say similar of them all!

[RagingBull]

Tbh Harlequins gave those players a chance which is in itself rare. In a results driven business coaches prefer to use tried and tested players of even average ability as it represents less risk. It is the same in football currently.
Although i think quite a few of our current crop who show a lot of promise. The Thacker brothers, Wells, Fred Tuilangi, Evans, Will Owen, Yawayawa and Worth all have potential. IF they are given an opportunity and stay relatively injury free, then quite a few of the current academy could become regular first team players.

Hyperbole!
Evans apart it's no wonder the 1st team forwards can't maul properly and the backs struggle to cut open defences if training with that lot.
Yawayawa might have something as a winger, never see enough to judge properly as the rest are so average.
Wells? Itoje, Kruis, Launchbury, L Deacon, Kay, enough said!
Can say similar of them all!

Worth has looked good IMO considering how much of a step up he has had to take, maybe not a world beater but a fine AP option even at 20 IMO.
Harry Thacker has huge amount of talent but his size is a major factor IMO.
Fred Jnr he could have potential but I'm not 100% sold on him his fitness needs to be worked on firstly.

I think we have some potentials in the 17/18/19's in the forwards Fenner, Grahamslaw, Lewis, Harper BUT that doesn't mean much until they play senior rugby more, Hardwick at 10 IMO is promising.

[wormus]

(Interesting though how many Tigers academy forwards have made it elsewhere? Watson and Green can't think of many other than that really compared to the amount of Backs that have gone on to better things).

How about Tom Price Second row through Tigers now a regular at Scarlets.

[4071]

A little more fringe, Charlie Clare is getting decent game time since moving to Saints (10 appearances this season) and Jamal Ford-Robinson is getting opportunities with Bristol (also 10 appearances this season).

Neither are first choice, but they are playing and being given time to develop. They may yet make the grade.

[mightymouse]

Brett deacon came through a club system at Syston along with his brother, Holford and Soden all of who went on to play professionally. I'm sure he is looking in these same talent pools for the next generation.

However did the club not deliberatly decide to move away from home grown talent in favour of the foreign mercenary as they lost too many to England. I think Dean Richards was always against this policy. He went on to develop the system in quins and now Newcastle. Which system works better?

[BFG]

Tbh Harlequins gave those players a chance which is in itself rare. In a results driven business coaches prefer to use tried and tested players of even average ability as it represents less risk. It is the same in football currently.
Although i think quite a few of our current crop who show a lot of promise. The Thacker brothers, Wells, Fred Tuilangi, Evans, Will Owen, Yawayawa and Worth all have potential. IF they are given an opportunity and stay relatively injury free, then quite a few of the current academy could become regular first team players.

Hyperbole!
Evans apart it's no wonder the 1st team forwards can't maul properly and the backs struggle to cut open defences if training with that lot.
Yawayawa might have something as a winger, never see enough to judge properly as the rest are so average.
Wells? Itoje, Kruis, Launchbury, L Deacon, Kay, enough said!
Can say similar of them all!

Worth has looked good IMO considering how much of a step up he has had to take, maybe not a world beater but a fine AP option even at 20 IMO.
Harry Thacker has huge amount of talent but his size is a major factor IMO.
Fred Jnr he could have potential but I'm not 100% sold on him his fitness needs to be worked on firstly.

I think we have some potentials in the 17/18/19's in the forwards Fenner, Grahamslaw, Lewis, Harper BUT that doesn't mean much until they play senior rugby more, Hardwick at 10 IMO is promising.

Names and more names RagingBull, it's hype year after year yet they do nothing to back it up.
The best of that bunch is Harry T and he has some limitations at senior level.
Leicester will finish up lower table and possibly even relegation one day with the rest, they either lack the cutting edge and are puddings who will reduce the training level around them, IMO that is currently beginning to happen.
There are a couple of names in there which make the rugby community giggle they are that soft.

[RagingBull]

Tell me where I have hype them up? I even said it means nothing till they play senior rugby.

I stand by that those do have potential, which I will say again means nothing till they play senior rugby.

[BFG]

Tell me where I have hype them up? I even said it means nothing till they play senior rugby.

I stand by that those do have potential, which I will say again means nothing till they play senior rugby.

Be realistic and look around at how competitive the sport is.
Development is very important, more so than many realise but integration from development to 1st team must not be forced, it will happen when and if someone is good enough.
What needs avoiding which is my main point is that these players must not be allowed to reduce the level of the squad or training levels.
I believe that will lead to inconsistency and IMO that is what is currently happening.