Is it now time to thank Cockers?

[Old Hob]

Iceman-19, I think you have got it about right. I watched the game again last night, and it was obvious that Munster wanted it more. I am not saying that Tigers didn't, but Munster had that drive and belief, that they would win every contact. I don't think that their players are any better than ours, or fitter than ours, just that they had that extra, intangible thing, that we used to have. It's a collective thing, with every player being a leader, every player having the desire and finally the Team being above everything.

But I go back to my earlier point, there are wholesale changes of players every season so it is impossible to build real, rather than ersatz, loyalty. Saracens have managed but it took a few years. Exeter seem to have retained all our ex-players and, despite a dip, have continued to do well. Tigers needs a rebuild. Stick with Cockers, hire Johnno as a motivational coach and employ only those who believe in the project which is to put Tigers back where they should be - at the top.

[fleabane]

How is Johno a "motivational coach"?

It is very different to giving a team talk or leading by blood and thunder antics on the pitch! An occasional visit to the changing room might be a good idea, but it is hardly getting inside a players head, reading his thoughts and providing a mentoring role and coaching them in their own mental approach to the game.

[smith183]

Is it not a bit naïve to sack the man who has brought you consistent success over a long period of time just to replace him with some ex players who you think might make a improvement or the very man who he replaced (who may I add left the club outside the top 4 at his time of departure). Great idea.

Teams lose games. its part of sport. As supporters we should support the players and staff not try to tear them down.

[WhitecapTiger]

Teams lose games. its part of sport. As supporters we should support the players and staff not try to tear them down.

That is the modern way unfortunately, if it's not working throw it out, replace it with another expendable item.

However, most people I have spoken to, and many on here, are not so bothered about losing, just the manner of some of the defeats.

As for 'consistent success' even I would agree - and I'm certainly not Anti-Cockers - that performances have been on the wane for some time and 'success' is relative, last season was a bit better by long term standards, 2 x Semi Finals but we threw one away (Racing) by not turning up until 70 minutes gone, IMO, and were roundly taken apart in the other (Saracens).

On Radio Leicester tonight it was opined that every coach/coaching team has it's limits, even old Bleddyn agreed, and maybe, just maybe, a new outlook - in whatever person/team that takes shape - is the way ahead.

They'll still have my support and voice on Saturday.

[Rykard]

There were some interesing points made onthe rugby hour tonight.
Cockers taking the blame, am responsible fir all matters, strength and conditioning team cut back, not enough coaches in total ... quite a worrying listen..

[Noddy555]

I have been saying it for the last 15 months, Cockers needs to be let go, Thankyou Richard for your invaluable service to the club, but now is the time to seek pastures new whether we get a good result this Saturday or not. The club must let Mauger have his head until at least the end of this season when a review should take place. It's one of many things that need to be discussed including the current boards attitude to Women's rugby. Why is it when the RFU are developing this aspect of the sport and we possess in Emily Scarrett, currently the best player on the women's side and captain of her country that some of the leading Aviva clubs are poopooing the idea of a professional women's league. Is everybody
scared witless by the concussion question? The Time was when Leicester Tigers were
a team which was at the forefront of the game, now we seem to be dragging our heels in so many aspects of the modern game. Have we too got too many tired old white men in our set up?

[smith183]

To expect such a monumental level of success over such a sustained period with a significantly smaller budget than all of our competitors (Sarries, Wasps and Bath) is a tall order that no coach other than Mallinder, who has guided saints to a very respectable 9th this season, has even come close to.

If we were to sack RC there is a distinct possibility that we could never reach the pinnacle of rugby again.

[Noddy555]

Disagree Smith183 I think your judgement is clouded by admirable loyalty to Cockers as a player and coach for the last 25 years. There has to be a time for it to end. As for your comments about Mallender and managing small budgets, I don't expect him to retain his place for very much longer.

[smith183]

Noddy555 so who would you bring in to avoid doing a man utd? Baxter?

[Noddy555]

That's one possible option or may be another New Zealander to work with Mauger. Several spring to mind but alas none of them would be available until at least the end of September next year.

[smith183]

May I remind you that the league is not won at Christmas. at one point we were 11th in the league but managed to be second by round 22. we also pulled together one of the longest streaks of bonus point wins in history (six) and scored the most tries in the comp. RC has proven time on time that his teams perform best with their backs against the wall and I am sure we will see that this Saturday. To ask for his head to roll after one awful performance against possibly the most motivated team atm is a bit unfair do you not feel.

[tigercaspian]

To expect such a monumental level of success over such a sustained period with a significantly smaller budget than all of our competitors (Sarries, Wasps and Bath) is a tall order that no coach other than Mallinder, who has guided saints to a very respectable 9th this season, has even come close to.

If we were to sack RC there is a distinct possibility that we could never reach the pinnacle of rugby again.

I can't tell you how Bath and Sarries sort their finances but I'm not sure that I would include Wasps in this Gang of Three nor as a financial benchmark for Tigers to follow. As a risk, Wasps are out on their own.
Wasps last set of accounts showed a loss before tax of £9.3m and loan repayments due in 2022 of £33m which, no matter how successful they are on the pitch, will be significant factors for them to deal with in the short-medium term. Owner Richardson also has an outstanding loan of just over £9m which is I think repayable at a years notice.
If Bath and Sarries owners keep putting in they will be fine . Wasps I am not so sure about and as another poster pointed out after the loss last weekend, they haven't actually put any silverware in the trophy cabinet recently either.
The pinnacle of rugby can therefore only be achieved with sound and sustainable financing off the field supporting successful team-building on it, and that includes team spirit & buying into the ethos f the club. We have the former but a chunk of the latter clearly went AWOL at the weekend .

[chewbacca]

There were some interesing points made onthe rugby hour tonight.
Cockers taking the blame, am responsible fir all matters, strength and conditioning team cut back, not enough coaches in total ... quite a worrying listen..

I never doubted that he wouldn't take responsibility and at least we now have confirmation of what some of us suspected. We don't have the finances to compete at the highest level. I would say we need to consider how we rebuild and investing in youth and grass roots to build a conveyer belt of players who are tigers to the core would seem a good way to go.

[Noddy555]

Yes Smith 183 but that was at a tme when we had players of real quality who were at the peak of their form and injuries although bad in comparison to our rivals were not as bad as the last 12 months. We then also had quality players to fill in, now we don't have that luxury.

[WhitecapTiger]

To ask for his head to roll after one awful performance against possibly the most motivated team atm is a bit unfair do you not feel.

I'm not one of those asking for his head to roll but even I can see, and accept, that it isn't just "after one awful performance", there have been a few over the last couple of seasons.

Glasgow away earlier in Europe this year was also awful, IMO.

Struggling to put away teams when we've had the upper hand. Scrambling to late wins or hanging on at the death.

It just happens that current circumstances fit the agenda of those who only ever appear when their 'forecasts' and 'speculation' have more traction due to poor performances/results.