Whats the purpose of our Academy

[RagingBull]

The biggest difference between us and sale is there is a lot more pressure to finish in the top 4 on us than Sale and thus can afford to use younger players more often without a risk.

[ellis9]

George Ford I'll give you and being generous also Charlie Walker but Lewington is an average player and Odogwu still needs to prove himself and Diamonds comparison of him to Jason Robinson was way off.

The only player I have been disappointed I have seen leave the club who have come through the academy is George Ford.

[BFG]

The biggest difference between us and sale is there is a lot more pressure to finish in the top 4 on us than Sale and thus can afford to use younger players more often without a risk.

This is a very good point but it's also one that highlights something.
I can't think of much riskier than a young 5ft 6" front row who can't scrummage very well, the risks have not stopped that.

[Hot_Charlie]

Indeed, but for (this arguments) sake, we in essence swapped with Sale a decent young prospect for a journey man in Brady. I know which I'd rather be watching and be more excited about the prospects of.

But that's not strictly true. Brady had been injured, so was probably a reasonably good deal and, as his second club, he's hardly a journeyman. He probably also accepted he wouldn't be first choice too.

[RagingBull]

The biggest difference between us and sale is there is a lot more pressure to finish in the top 4 on us than Sale and thus can afford to use younger players more often without a risk.

This is a very good point but it's also one that highlights something.
I can't think of much riskier than a young 5ft 6" front row who can't scrummage very well, the risks have not stopped that.

And TBH if it wasn't for injuries he prob wouldn't of gotten his chance.

I will say Out of the current 19-21 years old I would say the ones with the best chance of stepping up.
Worth - @ 10 or 15 good goal kicker and seems a promising player
Yawayawa - really high hopes for him if Odogwu is Robinson (honestly he has more in common with Wade than Robinson in terms of running style) Yawayawa is Goneva or similar getting good reviews in the championship and is only 18.
Maksymiw - Could become a proper lock IMO.
Simmons - Impressive player similar to Harrison in terms of the fact he is playing 9.10, 11,15 but is quicker IMO.
White - More of a traditional 9.
Fred Jnr - in terms of raw potential he should have it just if he can put it all together.

I know deacon is impressed with Jordan Olowofela but I haven't heard much of him.

Grahamslaw in the Academy also seems promising and I kind of hope he is being eyed as our future 8.


Will say I was certainly dissapointed that Odogwu (really liked his potential) was let go but these things happen.

I mean Bath lost Devoto and he had huge amount of AP experiance for a youngster.

End of the day not every academy player is going to be up to it and not every academy player is going to stay.

We went through a golden period a while ago, and so have other clubs since then these things happen.

How many out of
Bath
Exeter
Wasps
Harlequins
Saints
Us
Have had more than 2 academy player break through as a permanent member of the 23 in the last 2/3 season?

[Hot_Charlie]

The only player I have been disappointed I have seen leave the club who have come through the academy is George Ford.

That said, we'd have needed to slot another goalkicker into the back line if he'd stayed.

[BFG]

RagingBull
And TBH if it wasn't for injuries he prob wouldn't of gotten his chance.

You ruined a perfectly acceptable post with this.

[Snorbins]

Until there is a proper A league I cannot see the academy being anything more than a breeding ground where you rarely get seen other than for pre season or the Anglo Welsh.

[wormus]

Until there is a proper A league I cannot see the academy being anything more than a breeding ground where you rarely get seen other than for pre season or the Anglo Welsh.

Agreed and at the Cockers & Mage night the question was asked about home & away fixtures for the Northern A League of Tigers, Northampton, Sale, Worcester, Newcastle and Wasps with only 2 home & 3 away this season.
Despite the obvious long travels by Newcastle it was stated that Wasps were the team objecting to the expansion but there was hope of arranging other friendlies for the team. Five home and five away is great experience for the youngsters and those coming back from injury or gametime if arranged away from International windows.

[johnthegriff]

I too have questioned the production line from the Academy and was pleased that the system was re-organised 18 months ago with Bret Deacon and Anthony Allen under Ged Glynn taking charge. Time will tell if the new way is successful but we need to allow about five years before judging.
Noddy says he can name a complete squad of 23 young players who have been discarded by Tigers and are now successful elsewhere, that should make interesting reading when he does it bearing in mind that Ford and Twelvetrees were not discarded, they chose to leave having been given plenty of Premiership opportunity.
I was surprised by Odogwu's departure but sometimes there are issues that are not apparent to us ordinary fans and a change can be good for both a young player and the club.

[BFG]

Edited.
Everyone knows what the culture is and it's pointless debating with folk who believe hardly any players will naturally make it.
Obviously some believe we had a golden generation by luck.
Personally I think many good people put a lot of hard work and seriously good expertise into it.
It is what you make it in my opinion.

[mol2]

The problem is the gulf between the academy and the first team - that few of the academy graduates are ready to cross.
They may be good enough to get game time at the lower level of the premiership and for them it's a logical move.

Have Tigers been a bit reluctant to use some of the academy graduates - probably yes compared to some teams and that may influence the departure of some. Can any club sign all of it's academy graduates? In short no as most simply won't make the grade.

[grobyman]

Having read the previous posts I think it's worth putting stuff into perspective, any level of sport works on a basic pyramid system. There will always be more players at the bottom and less at the elite level, simple mathematics doesn't allow an automatic elevation through the ranks. This coupled with the fact that professional sport is results driven, it is a very brave DoR/Head Coach who select from an Academy as a matter of course. Yes you will miss the occasional later developer, but that happens in all walks of life, down the road look at Jamie Vardy.

The A league has also been mentioned, many clubs do not carry an A team, so game time if this were the only exposure would be very limited; many players are now either dual registered or loaned out to 'feeder clubs' for development and game time.

It always surprises me when watching a game on TV how many ex Tigers play for other teams, they must be doing something right to get to that level, but very few have that X factor, again mentioned on a previous post, a good player can often look better in a poorer team.

In addition, throughput will also be impacted on catchment area, that can be an absolute lottery.

[mol2]

I guess many players play for 3 (or more)league sides in their career so it's quite likely that given that each side contains 23 players there will be an ex Tiger in many teams we play against, just as there will be an ex-Sarry or an E-Irish when we play them.

[grobyman]

Agreed, since the game has become professional and players are earning their living from the game, there will without doubt be increased movement between clubs as they have to be self promoting to earn. There will be many reasons why movement takes place, cash, opportunity, personality issues etc.
It is also important to recognise that academies exist and thrive, not only to provide seedcorn players for the future but also to provide academy credits to assist with the salary cap. That is a whole new discussion!