ellis9 wrote:So he was released from his contract/contract not renewed then.
Pretty much the same thing. Either way, he wasn't rated too highly otherwise we would have played him more and he would probably have stayed.
No his contract ended we offered him a new one, Irish offered him a contract with more game time.
He took the Irish contract.
He was contractually assured of game time, was he?
I smell the whiff of fiction.
He may have left to get game time, but I doubt anyone has guaranteed game time written into their contract. He was probably just trying to move to a club that would give him the opportunity to play. He certainly wasn't offered that at Tigers.
What I meant was Irish offered him a contract and pushed the idea of more game time. (which as a club you would do, as a selling point). Poorly worded on my part.
I'm not blaming him for going, he made the right choice, i was just saying Tigers didn't release him. We wanted him to stay but didn't push enough to keep him.
darganj wrote:I'm honestly perplexed we have signed Brady and let Odogwu go?
Surely Odogwu is the cheaper squad player with more long term upside?
We don't know what happens day to day in the academy, what the staff see, what the nature of contract negotiations are etc. In fact, we are rather uninformed in our ability to answer the question you posed.
darganj wrote:I'm honestly perplexed we have signed Brady and let Odogwu go?
Surely Odogwu is the cheaper squad player with more long term upside?
We don't know what happens day to day in the academy, what the staff see, what the nature of contract negotiations are etc. In fact, we are rather uninformed in our ability to answer the question you posed.
I don't know why you bother posting on the forum, your answer to everything is I don't know and none of us can know as we aren't there.
The whole point of a forum is to discuss and debate.
darganj wrote:I'm honestly perplexed we have signed Brady and let Odogwu go?
Surely Odogwu is the cheaper squad player with more long term upside?
We don't know what happens day to day in the academy, what the staff see, what the nature of contract negotiations are etc. In fact, we are rather uninformed in our ability to answer the question you posed.
I don't know why you bother posting on the forum, your answer to everything is I don't know and none of us can know as we aren't there.
The whole point of a forum is to discuss and debate.
I'm merely stating there may or may not be more than meets the eye when it comes to players leaving. I am led to believe that it may not have been as simple as the "more game time" answer.
darganj wrote:I'm honestly perplexed we have signed Brady and let Odogwu go?
Surely Odogwu is the cheaper squad player with more long term upside?
We don't know what happens day to day in the academy, what the staff see, what the nature of contract negotiations are etc. In fact, we are rather uninformed in our ability to answer the question you posed.
I don't know why you bother posting on the forum, your answer to everything is I don't know and none of us can know as we aren't there.
The whole point of a forum is to discuss and debate.
I suppose it is a lot easier to debate using facts, rather than assumptions/speculation.
And technically he is discussing, he is saying that sometimes there is more than meets the eye to these things esp contract negotiations.
You asked a question he replied to be best of his knowledge what more do you want? him to make up false, unsupported claims? (Not everyone is like you in that regards).
Why are people upset with the lads? I agree with 4071. To maximize your potential you need to play against professional senior players. They have played many A-leagues and age grade matches. To become a full flight rugby player you can't just sit around learning at Oval Park for years. They clearly were getting no senior game time anytime soon so how can anybody be angry at them for wanting to gain experience and become the best player they can be?
I do however believe we have made a mistake not promoting Odogwu into the senior squad instead of buying mediocre squad players.
Spicer wrote:Why are people upset with the lads? I agree with 4071. To maximize your potential you need to play against professional senior players. They have played many A-leagues and age grade matches. To become a full flight rugby player you can't just sit around learning at Oval Park for years. They clearly were getting no senior game time anytime soon so how can anybody be angry at them for wanting to gain experience and become the best player they can be?
I do however believe we have made a mistake not promoting Odogwu into the senior squad instead of buying mediocre squad players.
The final sentence is the one used when we bought McCaffrey.
Leicester Tigers 1995-
Nottingham 1995-2000
Swansea (Whites) 1988-95
A game played on grass in the open air by teams of XV.
We sign players and we let players go.
Some that go may have made it here had they stayed but that will always be a matter of speculation. if they make it elsewhere then we should be glad for them.
We rarely know if those that leave were told to go and seek opportunities elsewhere or left of their own volition.
The fans forum is to debate and discuss over a virtual pint.
We are not obliged to agree with each other or the coaches on here.
mol2 wrote:We sign players and we let players go.
Some that go may have made it here had they stayed but that will always be a matter of speculation. if they make it elsewhere then we should be glad for them.
We rarely know if those that leave were told to go and seek opportunities elsewhere or left of their own volition.
The fans forum is to debate and discuss over a virtual pint.
We are not obliged to agree with each other or the coaches on here.
Leicester Tigers 1995-
Nottingham 1995-2000
Swansea (Whites) 1988-95
A game played on grass in the open air by teams of XV.
Spicer wrote:Why are people upset with the lads? I agree with 4071. To maximize your potential you need to play against professional senior players. They have played many A-leagues and age grade matches. To become a full flight rugby player you can't just sit around learning at Oval Park for years. They clearly were getting no senior game time anytime soon so how can anybody be angry at them for wanting to gain experience and become the best player they can be?
I do however believe we have made a mistake not promoting Odogwu into the senior squad instead of buying mediocre squad players.
The final sentence is the one used when we bought McCaffrey.
Spicer wrote:
I do however believe we have made a mistake not promoting Odogwu into the senior squad instead of buying mediocre squad players.
Well the thing is, I guess that you imagine as I do that the lad has a bright future based on having seen him play a half of rugby in the Argentina game. On that basis, I'm surprised he's leaving too.
But people who see him more than we do on and off the pitch and in training have decided otherwise and/or for whatever reason he's decided his interests are better served at Sale.
None of us know better than the academy staff. That I do know.
Additionally, there are stories floating around that I will not repeat here that may explain it but equally could be complete rubbish. Sometimes it's best not to speculate too much.
RagingBull wrote:
I suppose it is a lot easier to debate using facts, rather than assumptions/speculation.
And technically he is discussing, he is saying that sometimes there is more than meets the eye to these things esp contract negotiations.
You asked a question he replied to be best of his knowledge what more do you want? him to make up false, unsupported claims? (Not everyone is like you in that regards).
What false, unsupported claims have I made? Just because you don't agree with something makes it false.
I'm saying it now and I'm saying it again. We won't win anything next year due to our lack of international quality 4-8 as compared to Sarries, Wasps, Exeter and Saints.
I understand that obviously the coaches see more of the players and do know better. However coaches make mistakes. The most famous example I can think of is Sir Alex Ferguson letting Paul Pogba go. Who is now one of the best midfielders in the footballing world.
So dismissing peoples opinion, because "coaches always know best", I think is rather foolish.
Spicer wrote:I understand that obviously the coaches see more of the players and do know better. However coaches make mistakes. The most famous example I can think of is Sir Alex Ferguson letting Paul Pogba go. Who is now one of the best midfielders in the footballing world.
So dismissing peoples opinion, because "coaches always know best", I think is rather foolish.
I agree that coaches don't always know best and can make mistakes but to assume that we have the same level of knowledge and thus that our opinions are equally valuable is also foolish.
Re Pogba, not sure what happened here but wasn't he being well developed by Ferguson until, when expected to sign a new contract, he announced a deal had been done with somebody else and he was off? Hardly the best example.
I am neither clever enough to understand nor stupid enough to play this game
Players do not always share their coaches opinion of them.
Most of the time the coaches are right but sometimes they are blinded by being too close or perhaps having favourites that means they don't appreciate the player's ability for what it is rather than what it was a while back.
