2015/16 Squad/Contracts/Rumours Thread Part 3

[The Boy Dave]

Quite right of course. Same advice given to Neil Back, I believe? Or is the 1" difference in height crucial?

Neil Back is from a different era, different size, power etc.
He was bigger anyway about 5 10" and naturally heavier set, also naturally very strong and aggressive.
Actually the height is very important IMO (being that short in any case) especially balanced with the effort that would be required in support at the scrum whilst seeing what is coming, I'd add that you may laugh but would he actually be able to scrummage (effectively) on the flank and see enough in todays game at the top level with how big and fast it is, I don't know!
I'm not saying he couldn't do it but the negative impact all round is more to consider than just one player.
Also what message does it send to the players newly listed below by RB?
The lineout is another crucial factor, reducing numbers of a lifter/jumper by one has massive implications all round and at a foot less in height than most lifting/jumping is not an option at this level.
Just my opinion.

[RagingBull]

Tigers Finally update development squad Plenty of new faces brought into the it (also most amount we have had for some time:

Development squad * RED denotes promoted from academy.
Charlie Beckett (Lock/6 Eng U20)*
Oliver Bryant (10/12 Eng U20)
Wesley Douglas (13/11/14)*
Will Evans (7 Eng U18)*
Jake Farnworth (2 Eng U20)
Alex Galletly (Lock Scotland U20)*
Owen Hills (LH Prop Eng U20) *
Dan Hogan (TH Prop)*
Joe Maksymiw (Lock Eng U20)*
George Murrin (6/7/8)*
George Nairn (2)*
Paolo Odogwu (Wing Eng U20)*
Will Owen (6/7 Eng U20)
Oliver Povoas (6/7/8)*
Stone Priestley-Nangle (6/7/8)*
Charlie Thacker (12/13 Eng U20)*
George Tresidder (9)
Fred Tuilagi (8)*
George Worth (15)*

[4071]

good promising hooker - would be a project. been selected ahead of rob hawkins at times and is in the irish u20 team.

At times? He's firmly ahead of Hawkins. He's started 14 matches over the last couple of seasons (to Hawkins' 5) and is almost always in the Falcons' match-day squad.

He's a quality player, which is why the Irish have been trying to poach him. I'm not even sure he's be a project player - I think he'd slot straight into the Leicester 23.

[JackFlashJonny]

good promising hooker - would be a project. been selected ahead of rob hawkins at times and is in the irish u20 team.

At times? He's firmly ahead of Hawkins. He's started 14 matches over the last couple of seasons (to Hawkins' 5) and is almost always in the Falcons' match-day squad.

He's a quality player, which is why the Irish have been trying to poach him. I'm not even sure he's be a project player - I think he'd slot straight into the Leicester 23.

I agree he is a good player..should fit well for us and be a solid backup to TY..I am also glad he is leaving Newcastle as he went to school with my Girlfriend and asks her if she is single yet everytime he spots her out with her friends in town

[jgriffin]

Quite right of course. Same advice given to Neil Back, I believe? Or is the 1" difference in height crucial?

Neil Back is from a different era, different size, power etc.
He was bigger anyway about 5 10" and naturally heavier set, also naturally very strong and aggressive.
Actually the height is very important IMO (being that short in any case) especially balanced with the effort that would be required in support at the scrum whilst seeing what is coming, I'd add that you may laugh but would he actually be able to scrummage (effectively) on the flank and see enough in todays game at the top level with how big and fast it is, I don't know!
I'm not saying he couldn't do it but the negative impact all round is more to consider than just one player.
Also what message does it send to the players newly listed below by RB?
The lineout is another crucial factor, reducing numbers of a lifter/jumper by one has massive implications all round and at a foot less in height than most lifting/jumping is not an option at this level.
Just my opinion.

I'm just pointing out the obvious, as Back (who was no differently built) was told in the Geoff-Cooke-influenced era that he was too small for top-class rugby. I suppose I'm amused by the scrum-half call too. My eldest was told, at 5'10"/16 stone brick-outhouse likewise, too small for flanker, and 9 was suggested, if he lost weight. In the end it was the Shoguns demise that turned him from rugby to the RAF rather than those who idolised super-big FatBoys.

[The Boy Dave]

I'm just pointing out the obvious, as Back (who was no differently built) was told in the Geoff-Cooke-influenced era that he was too small for top-class rugby. I suppose I'm amused by the scrum-half call too. My eldest was told, at 5'10"/16 stone brick-outhouse likewise, too small for flanker, and 9 was suggested, if he lost weight. In the end it was the Shoguns demise that turned him from rugby to the RAF rather than those who idolised super-big FatBoys.

Sorry I know it's off topic before anyone charges in but yes I find the size issue frustrating but it is a real issue and not one that is dealt with very well in general.
There are some very average rugby players playing at the top level, in fact some right dumbos!
IMO if they weren't big they would not even make it in the national leagues and it mostly stems from elite youth rugby.
I watched an academy game recently, there were some big lads about but my word some were poor rugby players.
Thacker is a good young rugby player absolutely no doubt about it but I just think in this day and age it's stretching it a little too far in the forwards with the boring way the game is played up front.
Perhaps Tigers could challenge that but it's a big ask and IMO it's risking more.
I think he could be a massive star in rugby league to be honest.
There are shorter players and some even excel such as George Smith or Steffon Armitage but I have met Smith and as well as having a brain that is one of the best in the game his shoulders are wide like a truck and Armitage is obviously built like a bull.
Being both short and light to the extreme is difficult and it transfers itself into a top level pro side trying not to just survive but wanting success in a bosh dominated league.
I have had a bee in my bonnet about it ever since people on here kept suggesting that it was Cole's fault and he was possibly past it and then some blame was being pointed in Ayerza's direction which was just laughable, and then the new boy from Newcastle was suggested as not being a very good lock.

[jgriffin]

Agree there, matey!

[Mersey Tiger]

I agree whole heartedly with the point that TBD makes about Harry Thacker potentially being a big star in Rugby League.
As well as following the Tigers, I follow Leeds Rhinos in Super League - what a season 2016 was!
This was in part because my son moved to Leeds not far from Headingley and he prefers League to Union (whereas I prefer Union to League). But we both like both!
The focus on huge monsters in Union is worrying and whether Thacker is the right build and can fit in with his undoubted skills is a question we are all asking. But then you look at the superlative Rob Burrow - hooker (Yes! I said hooker!) and scrum half for Rhinos. He is only 5'6" and he is absolutely brilliant, and still going strong at 33 years of age. Because the scrums are a joke in Rugby League, Burrows' size is irrelevant compared to the "push and grind" of Union scrums. So Harry would fit in a treat and his skills would be very much appreciated.

Maybe I should get in touch with the Rhinos and ask if they might have a look at the lad..........

[Gramps]

I agree whole heartedly with the point that TBD makes about Harry Thacker potentially being a big star in Rugby League.
As well as following the Tigers, I follow Leeds Rhinos in Super League - what a season 2016 was!
This was in part because my son moved to Leeds not far from Headingley and he prefers League to Union (whereas I prefer Union to League). But we both like both!
The focus on huge monsters in Union is worrying and whether Thacker is the right build and can fit in with his undoubted skills is a question we are all asking. But then you look at the superlative Rob Burrow - hooker (Yes! I said hooker!) and scrum half for Rhinos. He is only 5'6" and he is absolutely brilliant, and still going strong at 33 years of age. Because the scrums are a joke in Rugby League, Burrows' size is irrelevant compared to the "push and grind" of Union scrums. So Harry would fit in a treat and his skills would be very much appreciated.

Maybe I should get in touch with the Rhinos and ask if they might have a look at the lad..........

Have been saying this for ages with his ball skills and speed off the mark he would make a great hooker / half back in the 13 man game. I am a little surprised that those close to him have not suggested this especially as he has been playing some rugby up in Doncaster.

[Hinckley Bob]

I agree whole heartedly with the point that TBD makes about Harry Thacker potentially being a big star in Rugby League.
As well as following the Tigers, I follow Leeds Rhinos in Super League - what a season 2016 was!
This was in part because my son moved to Leeds not far from Headingley and he prefers League to Union (whereas I prefer Union to League). But we both like both!
The focus on huge monsters in Union is worrying and whether Thacker is the right build and can fit in with his undoubted skills is a question we are all asking. But then you look at the superlative Rob Burrow - hooker (Yes! I said hooker!) and scrum half for Rhinos. He is only 5'6" and he is absolutely brilliant, and still going strong at 33 years of age. Because the scrums are a joke in Rugby League, Burrows' size is irrelevant compared to the "push and grind" of Union scrums. So Harry would fit in a treat and his skills would be very much appreciated.

Maybe I should get in touch with the Rhinos and ask if they might have a look at the lad..........

Have been saying this for ages with his ball skills and speed off the mark he would make a great hooker / half back in the 13 man game. I am a little surprised that those close to him have not suggested this especially as he has been playing some rugby up in Doncaster.

This may be true but we don't want to lose him from Tigers.

[Gramps]

So we don't want to lose a player that isn't big enough for his chosen position and can't really play anywhere else at the top level.

[Cagey Tiger]

So we don't want to lose a player that isn't big enough for his chosen position and can't really play anywhere else at the top level.

In your opinion. Yes, others agree, but some do not. Having never played myself, any opinion I have would be pretty worthless.

[4071]

So we don't want to lose a player that isn't big enough for his chosen position and can't really play anywhere else at the top level.

2-3 years ago, I pretty much assumed that Thacker would end up in the centres. He's got a Hipkiss-esque build - not massive, but very powerful for his size - with the pace and ball-skills to play in the position.

I would have thought that if it were on the cards he'd have switched by now, though. He must really like it in the front row, and none of his coaches appear to be particularly concerned by his lack of height and weight.

[LE18]

Has anyone asked the props, and the rest of the pack, if they mind packing down with such a light hooker, who's arms don't appear long enough to get a proper bind?

[fortysix]

It is blindingly obvious he isnt a hooker, and Cockerill knows it, otherwise he wouldnt be trying to buy all and sundry

But he's not going to admit it publicly, now is he ..