ONLY a British league can save English rugby!

[mol2]

I don't think the problem lies with the league. Sure there may be concerns such as the salary cap holding back the top level, yet seemingly it hasn't elevated standards at the bottom. I'm sure the league could help matters perhaps by rewarding sides who feature more English qualified players in key positions. Perhaps the marquee players should be England qualified? I have long advocated sides with more England players in the England squads should receive a greater share of whatever funding comes from England via the RFU.

The players also play in Europe which would expose them to the best sides in Europe.

However the problem seems more to do with the selections and game plans at the highest level. By and large there are a lot of talented players out there so why are they being held back? England selected 3 scrum halves for the world cup one of which (if he were at Tigers) would not make the bench ahead of Youngs or Harrison, let alone should he have displaced a number of the better scrum halves at other premiership clubs. This is just one example of the problems within the elite coaching set up. Only one of the the current England coaching set up has experience at the top level - Rountree. The head coach has not coached as a head coach at club level, his assistants - Catt and Farrell have negligible coaching experience and in the case of the latter negligible experience in Union as a player either. Blaming the league is missing the point.
The previous head coach (Marting Johnson) had no real coaching experience and seemed to take on the role out of a sense of duty.
Brian Ashton and Andy Robinson had experience but had probably reached the end of the line in terms of international rugby.

Being objective how many of those appointments should have been made? Perhaps Andy Robinson as assistant to a world cup winning head coach is the only one.

[Noddy555]

Once again I find myself moved to post on this subject. I value varied opinions but find most of the posters are taking tommy rot to new heights. This will never happen and the strand should now be closed.
For a start the political pressure from the SNP on the Glasgow Warriors and Edinburgh clubs would be immense, less so in Wales because Plaid Cymru are a standing joke. And once the Irish realise that there financial share in such a league will diminish greatly from what they currently receive then they too will prove lukewarm and what about the Italian clubs, they're barely credible members of the Celtic league how would they justify their Britishness?

[Cagey Tiger]

England have fallen further behind since 2003

Just to highlight one of the many poor arguments, given England won in 2003, going backwards was always likely, especially with all the retirements. And as no-one has yet retained the WC, all past winners could be said to have fallen behind after winning.

[Cagey Tiger]

Once again I find myself moved to post on this subject. I value varied opinions but find most of the posters are taking tommy rot to new heights. This will never happen and the strand should now be closed.

You do a good line in high handedness Noddy555. Who are you to decide when a topic should be closed. This is a public forum and I will defend everybody's right (including you - did I really say that?) to talk sense, twaddle or whatever as long as they wish. Even preposterous ideas can generate meaningful debate. As long as people do not get personal, does it matter? You don't have to read it. All topics naturally run out of steam and the poorer ones generally run out quicker.

[Bill W (2)]

England have fallen further behind since 2003

Just to highlight one of the many poor arguments, given England won in 2003, going backwards was always likely, especially with all the retirements. And as no-one has yet retained the WC, all past winners could be said to have fallen behind after winning.

Cagey, please stop confusing the isses with logic and common sense!

[Cagey Tiger]

England have fallen further behind since 2003

Just to highlight one of the many poor arguments, given England won in 2003, going backwards was always likely, especially with all the retirements. And as no-one has yet retained the WC, all past winners could be said to have fallen behind after winning.

Cagey, please stop confusing the isses with logic and common sense!

Well, we have to show that there is some around on this forum don't we Bill? (now where's that tongue-in-cheek smiley )

[mol2]

When you are at the top the only way is down.

Quite why it has taken the England hierarchy so long to address the reason for this is staggering.

England have only had one truly capable manager/head coach in the professional era and that was SCW. The problem is that the bigwigs at the RFU can't cope with the type of single minded driven person that this requires.

They would rather deal with a head coach who tells them what they want to hear rather than tells them what needs to happen. I'm sure Lancaster is far easier to deal with than SCW was in his era. It is that sort of character that is needed to drive a side. Few are easy to deal with.

The problem isn't the league it's the RFU who have been ousted from running the professional game but won't hand over control of England to its mangement.

[Jeremy Anderson]

Clearly anybody surnamed McLaren may be of Celtic stock and not thinking of the best interest of the English game.
England does not need to join a Celtic league. All we need to do is remove Randrew and appoint a decent replacement and national coaching team. That's it.

[Louis]

England have fallen further behind since 2003

Just to highlight one of the many poor arguments, given England won in 2003, going backwards was always likely, especially with all the retirements. And as no-one has yet retained the WC, all past winners could be said to have fallen behind after winning.

Cagey, please stop confusing the isses with logic and common sense!

Outrageous. Something like sense might break out.

[The Boy Dave]

Clearly anybody surnamed McLaren may

Qualify under residency rules.

[tigercaspian]

Agree with mol2 on SCW and his single-mindedness. However, all good generals need luck and SCW's luck was to have 4/5 genuinely world class players available to him, resources that he certainly made the best of.

[biffer]

Clearly anybody surnamed McLaren may be of Celtic stock and not thinking of the best interest of the English game.
England does not need to join a Celtic league. All we need to do is remove Randrew and appoint a decent replacement and national coaching team. That's it.

Given that it's a demented idea that'd destroy Irish, Welsh and Scottish rugby, I disagree with your deduction. No country has a monopoly on really, really bad ideas.

[biffer]

Even preposterous ideas can generate meaningful debate.

Except this one

[Cagey Tiger]

Even preposterous ideas can generate meaningful debate.

Except this one

Disagree. The meaningful (rather one-sided) debate has reinforced the preposterousness of the original post on many fronts.

[rocktop51]

Can you really imagine that the other Home Countries Unions would go for it? I don't. You then get in to the realms of divisions and where does that leave the English Championship and its Celtic equivalents.

Non starter

simple, the top team in the English championship has a 2 leg play off with the bottom English side in the british league for promotion relegation...theres no promotion or relegation for the celts as they have no other teams.... you see problems I see solutions.........next?

Maybe - but if one of the celtic nations finishes bottom then they may play off Championship winners who if they win take their place. It isnt right that the celts are relegation proof. Some solution !