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Jimmy Skitz
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Jimmy Skitz » Sat Aug 22, 2015 11:36 pm

I do love how Lawes gets away scot free over the line out woes, always Tom Youngs fault, even when he has the ball snatched from his hands due to not being aggressive enough to catch the ball

drc_007
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by drc_007 » Sun Aug 23, 2015 8:42 am

Mr Bean wrote:The person also said Marler gave away too many penalties, it would be interesting to see the comparison between him and Cole.
According to ESPN stats

Marler gave away 3 penalties, Billy Vunipola 4 and Cole 1.

Ben Arous the French loosehead prop facing Cole conceded 3 penalties.

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Mr Bean » Sun Aug 23, 2015 8:54 am

drc_007 wrote:
Mr Bean wrote:The person also said Marler gave away too many penalties, it would be interesting to see the comparison between him and Cole.
According to ESPN stats

Marler gave away 3 penalties, Billy Vunipola 4 and Cole 1.

Ben Arous the French loosehead prop facing Cole conceded 3 penalties.

Does it say how many of Marler were in the scrum and how many in the loose? The ground conditions were so bad I wouldn't want to count any scrummaging penalties against any of the props.

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by TigerCam » Sun Aug 23, 2015 9:57 am

Spicer wrote:The final ten minutes were fantastic. The other 70 were awful.
Brilliant performance after 4 years prep? :smt010
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by jgriffin » Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:09 am

Jimmy Skitz wrote:I do love how Lawes gets away scot free over the line out woes, always Tom Youngs fault, even when he has the ball snatched from his hands due to not being aggressive enough to catch the ball
Newspaper threads full of blame for Youngs, as usual. Au contraire Bean, you look at what's in front of you on the TV (as you should in rugby) and Lawes was anonymous - the problems with the lineout were from aggressive French disruption, and is why Parling is so useful - and Launchbury looked slow and not-quite-with-it. None of Englands four hookers threw well - which suggests the problem lies elsewhere.
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by The Boy Dave » Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:42 am

Got to feel for Launchbury, been treated stupidly for a young lock IMO.
Sometimes better off not being the favoured by a fool.
Since his debut in 2012 he has crammed in over 20 caps plus any Saxons and Wasps stuff in just two years until he was injured, he required neck surgery and spent months out and then thrown straight back into it and not long turned only 24 years old.
Last edited by The Boy Dave on Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:54 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Sajerj » Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:49 am

jgriffin wrote:
Jimmy Skitz wrote:I do love how Lawes gets away scot free over the line out woes, always Tom Youngs fault, even when he has the ball snatched from his hands due to not being aggressive enough to catch the ball
Newspaper threads full of blame for Youngs, as usual. Au contraire Bean, you look at what's in front of you on the TV (as you should in rugby) and Lawes was anonymous - the problems with the lineout were from aggressive French disruption, and is why Parling is so useful - and Launchbury looked slow and not-quite-with-it. None of Englands four hookers threw well - which suggests the problem lies elsewhere.

Sadly not JGriffin/JS. Much as i admire TY as a payer for so many reasons, his line out throwing for England is awful. Its not new. He has been throwing 60-65% with England for the last two seasons.
The players have been in camp a long time, so their is no reason for it not to be far better.

TY, throws well for Tigers, and threw very well Internationally on the Lions tour, but for some reason with England his confidence looks shot. It is not Lawes. Everybody he has thrown to in the last two seasons he has struggled, including Parling.

You have to ask some serious questions of the England coaching at the set piece. It has gone backwards markedly in recent times.

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by drc_007 » Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:00 pm

Zinzan Brooke ‏@ZinzanBrooke8 2h2 hours ago
Forget the last 10 minutes. England were completely outclassed last night.

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by LE18 » Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:27 pm

At scrum time, Lawes seems very lightweight to me, would he be better off and fill our No 6 problem? Lineouts wise we are seriously missing Croft, who moves up and down the line and steels loads of ball. I saw him recently he said he was fit and now he is training with the squad, could SL be considering him as a late replacement to fill that 6 role and cover an obvious failure in selecting Wood who never wins any lineouts ball?

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by L Smith » Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:14 pm

RE: the scrum, last night.
Considering the state of the pitch and the clear risk of a serious injury, I'd have been happy to see uncontested scrums.
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by TigerCam » Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:24 pm

drc_007 wrote:Zinzan Brooke ‏@ZinzanBrooke8 2h2 hours ago
Forget the last 10 minutes. England were completely outclassed last night.
Couldn't agree more - unfortunately!! If that is it, then getting out of the pool stage is doubtful. As for those that said that Ford cannot play behind a pack going backwards, I don't know of many that can even the supposed 'great' Carter has had a mare or two behind a poor performing NZ pack. Happy to see Cips make a point tho the papers say Brown played a blinder? England are going to have to suss out the southern Refs IMO to negate the penalty count which was really poor but this came about by a french battering for 70 mins! Is SL and AF league influence the right focus for the union game?
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Doghashadhisday » Sun Aug 23, 2015 4:37 pm

Sajerj wrote:
Sadly not JGriffin/JS. Much as i admire TY as a payer for so many reasons, his line out throwing for England is awful. Its not new. He has been throwing 60-65% with England for the last two seasons.
The players have been in camp a long time, so their is no reason for it not to be far better.

TY, throws well for Tigers, and threw very well Internationally on the Lions tour, but for some reason with England his confidence looks shot. It is not Lawes. Everybody he has thrown to in the last two seasons he has struggled, including Parling.

You have to ask some serious questions of the England coaching at the set piece. It has gone backwards markedly in recent times.
True to form you are critical of TY and Rowntree is it because they happen to be associated with Tigers.

Apart from one not straight the other throws by Tom appeared to be towards the intended recipients but the French locks competed and often got higher or were more aggressive. Its easy to blame the hooker.

Jimmy Skitz
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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Jimmy Skitz » Sun Aug 23, 2015 4:42 pm

lets not forget Lawes was calling the line out, maybe the french had worked out his tell

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Doghashadhisday » Sun Aug 23, 2015 5:01 pm

Jimmy Skitz wrote:I do love how Lawes gets away scot free over the line out woes, always Tom Youngs fault, even when he has the ball snatched from his hands due to not being aggressive enough to catch the ball
Totally agree with you. Apart from one not straight, Tom's throwing was not that bad or way off the mark. Our locks were out performed by the French. Dan Cole and Tom Youngs were doing the job of a true no 7 while Robshaw was busy guarding the gate rather than preventing the French getting quick ball.

Sad to say that Fazlet would be a better option at 10 than Ford at the moment. Cips wont get picked but he would be a good utility back. If Faz is going to play at 10 then we need Slade at 12. Easter may not be able to go on storming runs like Morgan or Vunipola but his rugby brain and ball handling skills are a million light years ahead of the others and again he should be in the squad

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Re: England for the weekend 2nd round

Post by Dr H Flashman MBE » Sun Aug 23, 2015 6:36 pm

There is always a scap goat for any England defeat. Tom is it this time. I am utterly one eyed and biased so will support any Tigers player. Toms throwing in wasn't great, that is a fact, however, if a hooker is throwing into a line out that the opposition know where the pill is going the he isn't going to come up looking like Dan Carter. Also, he may have been a tad shattered as he was tackling himself into the ground covering the lack of back row we had.

I said it after the game, launchbury and Burell were non existent. They gave no go forward. Ford was under the cosh and didn't have enough nous or time to go South African and stick the ball in the corner, reliving pressure.

Ciprini when he came on gave us a bit of Carlos Spencer, unpredictable and attacking. I know it was just a short cameo, but teams can't play again players they don't know what they are going to do next.maverick.

Although he isn't that popular on this forum , Farrell isn't dynamic but against some teams, under the cosh you need to put the ball out and far away from your 22. Like Andy Goode.

I would hope that Cips makes it and if Lancaster is feeling brave, drop Burrell for Slade.
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