darganj wrote:
How you can think it will be Burgess and Owen in the centres is beyond me. Such SL haters on this forum.
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I don't think Sam B will go to the World Cup and if he does it will just be for a smash about against Uruguay.
It's easy to think that given the VAST amount of sound bites coming from England on the subject. I hope you are right about the actual choices but given they are expending serious amounts of comments on both of those players in those positions I have my doubts.
As for hating Lancaster I don't. I just fail to see where the progression of the squad is under his guidance. Equally I hope to be proved wrong, after all what do I know?
But I stand by the comment about Burgess, I don't think he's ready for that level and smash up or not against Uruguay is a waste of a space for a better player to have taken.
All of that is only my option.
SPIKE
It's not the winning or losing but the taking apart which matters.
Much prefer Slade over Burgess who as we all seem to agree is overhyped and unable to play International centre or 6 today with his current skill set. The love-in with him is keeping somebody else out of the squad. If he is there to motivate etc have him in as part of the coaching team.
Here is a thought did SL want him as 6 and a certain forward coach dug his heels in and said not good enough today - hence he ended up with a Centre label where no doubt Farrell Snr was delighted to have him.
Is he a centre ? Of course not. Is he a blindside? Yes at club level not at international. I do believe he CAN be an international back rower in due course but will he want to stay in union for another 4 years. If he does, I can see him being in the England set up in a year or two. The England back row is already competitive and we cannot take a luxury such as Burgess. RWC 2019 - come along and join the show. For much of last season I preferred Garvey or Fearns to him at Bath.
He was always going to make it. I've lost all faith with Lancaster now. Not that I had a lot of faith in him anyway but that little bit I did have, has now been lost all together!
At center he has looked very average. At flanker he has looked good. He has potential and may become a very good union player, but currently he isn't at the required international level.
I don't usually agree with Chris Hewett (Independent) as he has been a SL tart, but this struck me as spot on:
"Eastmond will be wondering what the hell and why. His performances in the No 12 shirt during the last domestic campaign were so far in advance of the newcomer from rugby league that Burgess ended up operating on the blind-side flank – patently the best position for a powerful, ruthlessly combative individual who, nevertheless, has no kicking game, rarely passes the ball more than a few feet and is unlikely to worry opposition midfielders with his express pace. Still, the die is cast. Eastmond now knows that form is not only temporary, but occasionally irrelevant."
Leicester Tigers 1995-
Nottingham 1995-2000
Swansea (Whites) 1988-95
A game played on grass in the open air by teams of XV.
I think its difficult to know where Burgess is as a 12 , because he clearly was in the very early stages of learning the game when he played there.
You have to believe that he has impressed in training. If he was a mile off the mark, then it is hard to believe the England coaching team would waste valuable playing time on him. I guess we find out next Saturday.
I like Eastmond as a club player, but he has fallen short at the very top level. He had a really good club season, but ultimately was absolutely nowhere against Farrell, Barritt and friends in the final.
Hewitt's comments are silly really. He is confusing Club rugby with International rugby, and they are a world apart.
Sajerj wrote:I think its difficult to know where Burgess is as a 12 , because he clearly was in the very early stages of learning the game when he played there.
You have to believe that he has impressed in training. If he was a mile off the mark, then it is hard to believe the England coaching team would waste valuable playing time on him. I guess we find out next Saturday.
I like Eastmond as a club player, but he has fallen short at the very top level. He had a really good club season, but ultimately was absolutely nowhere against Farrell, Barritt and friends in the final.
Hewitt's comments are silly really. He is confusing Club rugby with International rugby, and they are a world apart.
Ok. So Burgess wasn't good enough at 12 for his club but will be good enough at international level.
I may have missed something here.
I don't buy into this whole "Burgess has a positive influence on the group" rhetoric. We're talking about elite sportsmen, all there, (barring Burgess) on merit. Firstly, I doubt they need a rugby league player to inspire them, secondly, I could only see Burgess' continued inclusion as being divisive at best.
I can't help but keep coming back to the fact that the Burgess project has been a World Cup marketing exercise, gone wrong and that someone at a high level is not prepared to back down.
Still, what do I know?
I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed man
