As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

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chipnchase
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by chipnchase » Mon Jul 06, 2015 2:00 pm

mol2 wrote:
chipnchase wrote:How do you police someone being given a bag of £50 notes or being given a £500,000.00 flat in their home country?
Can be done by the Police, Inland Revenue or their counterparts overseas etc.

However as it isn't necessarily illegal they won't be using their powers to investigate simply because it breaches the league agreements. Non-dom foreign players having earnings in foreign countries may well not be subject to UK taxation. Even harder to find if it paid by a company's overseas operation to the a company in which the player or their spouse is a shareholder.

As for the league they have as much access to information from the banks as any other member of the public. They may be able to use private investigators but couldn't really use the information as it would have (probably) been illegally obtained. They rely on disgruntled staff or players to blab.
And that is the issue. If it isnt costing a substantial amount in lost revenue then nothing will be done.

We cant say the game is a business one moment and then expect everyone to act like Peter Pan the next. This was always going to happen the minute we declared the game 'open'.

Which is what I was saying about all clubs in Europe need to agree not just 12 in England.

ourla
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by ourla » Mon Jul 06, 2015 2:25 pm

As we are in the build up to the World Cup it is probably too damaging to continue so it will be postponed until November. When of course the Prem and ERC will be in full swing, so it will be too damaging to continue investigating so will be postponed, etc., etc....
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L Smith
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by L Smith » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:48 pm

ourla wrote:As we are in the build up to the World Cup it is probably too damaging to continue so it will be postponed until November. When of course the Prem and ERC will be in full swing, so it will be too damaging to continue investigating so will be postponed, etc., etc....
I hope the fans keep the momentum up on this seminal issue. I can unfortunately foresee a time when we look back and see this as a crossroads where the wrong turn was taken :smt009
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by jgriffin » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:01 pm

I think the wrong turn was taken when PRL bent over for Craig on the 2nd marquee.
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by BengalTiger » Tue Jul 07, 2015 7:31 am

Everyone keeps saying the cap is impossible to police, but the inquiry obviously turned up enough evidence that it had to be kicked into the long grass to avoid the bad publicity. In a normal sport the committee that took this decision could not avoid a charge of bringing the game into disrepute. Dean Richards and co were hung out to dry for stuff that I think is small beer compared to abetting cheating on a grand scale by certain clubs, maybe the our decline would not be the subject of so much debate if others had not cheated their way to relative improvement, and it is cheating pure and simple, you sign up to play in a league with certain regulations, if you do not like them you lobby to change them, if the rest agree the regulation is changed, to willfully, systematically defy the agreed regulation is nothing more than cheating.

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by mol2 » Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:04 am

It's much easier to hang out an individual for cheating that it is to punish a club. Even more so when the club's backers have more financial clout than the league itself.

The reality is that the league probably could not afford the legal wrangling to expel one of the rich sides - the only way would be for the other clubs to leave the league and form a new one without the offending side, which in turn may well go against RFU or even international rules so could have implications for European eligibility and for England selection.

A mess.

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by BengalTiger » Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:45 pm

The regulation regarding the salary cap is a voluntary regulation, ie the clubs have opted to play under it, it is the same as having 15 players on the park, clubs who play under the Union regulation have opted into that rule, for any club to suddenly decide that they are rich enough to afford to have 16 on the pitch and cause sue anyone who objects is as ridiculous as breaking the salary cap with impunity.
I cannot fathom the benefit of closing down the inquiry, if there is evidence let us know about it, we the fans are also being cheated of a fair contest.
The clowns who have decided to abandon the inquiry should be held to account by the RFU and the IRB, Oh it was probably their idea to abandon it!

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by jgriffin » Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:53 pm

Fascinating parallel to the Gibson enquiry on extraordinary rendition I was just reading about. Commissioned to do a job, suddenly suspended, known that evidence had been uncovered and who had been involved, responsibility for continuing shuffled elsewhere and to some unspecified date. You might think there was a handbook of 'How To Dodge Unsavoury Facts' in PRL back pockets (as opposed to rich men's cash).
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chipnchase
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by chipnchase » Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:15 pm

BengalTiger wrote:Everyone keeps saying the cap is impossible to police, but the inquiry obviously turned up enough evidence that it had to be kicked into the long grass to avoid the bad publicity. In a normal sport the committee that took this decision could not avoid a charge of bringing the game into disrepute. Dean Richards and co were hung out to dry for stuff that I think is small beer compared to abetting cheating on a grand scale by certain clubs, maybe the our decline would not be the subject of so much debate if others had not cheated their way to relative improvement, and it is cheating pure and simple, you sign up to play in a league with certain regulations, if you do not like them you lobby to change them, if the rest agree the regulation is changed, to willfully, systematically defy the agreed regulation is nothing more than cheating.
Do you honestly think Tigers arent one of the clubs involved cap breaches? Our past poor season has nothing to do with the cap breach. Like I said before every club is at it and we shouldnt be throwing stones.

Tiger_in_Birmingham
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by Tiger_in_Birmingham » Tue Jul 07, 2015 6:01 pm

chipnchase wrote:Do you honestly think Tigers arent one of the clubs involved cap breaches? Our past poor season has nothing to do with the cap breach. Like I said before every club is at it and we shouldnt be throwing stones.
As a PLC our books are more open than most - suspect we'd be very easy to target.

Also given how shrewd Tigers are regarding contracts and making the most of injury dispensation etc. I think we're probably spending right up to it

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by G.K » Tue Jul 07, 2015 9:28 pm

Carpet swept under. Always the same if vested interests are threatened. :smt009
Nowadays referees decide matches, players by how much.

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by Farmboy » Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:19 pm

Bengaltiger imho as it is a PLR salary cap the only thing that RFU/WR could do them for is bringing the game into disrepute which could be hard to prove & would RFU want to rock the boat with PRL?

chipnchase
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by chipnchase » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:57 pm

Tiger_in_Birmingham wrote:
chipnchase wrote:Do you honestly think Tigers arent one of the clubs involved cap breaches? Our past poor season has nothing to do with the cap breach. Like I said before every club is at it and we shouldnt be throwing stones.
As a PLC our books are more open than most - suspect we'd be very easy to target.

Also given how shrewd Tigers are regarding contracts and making the most of injury dispensation etc. I think we're probably spending right up to it
Lets agree thats the case and place our heads in the sand :smt023 :smt023 :smt023

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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by kornboy130 » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:24 pm

chipnchase wrote:
Tiger_in_Birmingham wrote:
chipnchase wrote:Do you honestly think Tigers arent one of the clubs involved cap breaches? Our past poor season has nothing to do with the cap breach. Like I said before every club is at it and we shouldnt be throwing stones.
As a PLC our books are more open than most - suspect we'd be very easy to target.

Also given how shrewd Tigers are regarding contracts and making the most of injury dispensation etc. I think we're probably spending right up to it
Lets agree thats the case and place our heads in the sand :smt023 :smt023 :smt023
I've spoken to some pretty senior figures in the club about this - candidly - and the feeling is that we have used every grey area in the past but never stepped over the mark.

jgriffin
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Re: As we suspected, you can smell it from here....

Post by jgriffin » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:45 pm

Chimes with what I was told on the QT last year, that we use every legal ruse possible (and was also told about the two overspenders, one was paying players in their home country).
Leicester Tigers 1995-
Nottingham 1995-2000
Swansea (Whites) 1988-95
A game played on grass in the open air by teams of XV.

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