Guess your England RWC squad of 31

[4071]

I appreciate that's your opinion but good god it seems you've been hypnotised by the media into believing Sam Burgess is the answer! He really isn't! He will only ever be an average rugby union player and should in my opinion be no where near the England squad!

Quite a call that he will only ever be an average Union player, given how well he's played since being moved to blindside by Bath. He's been excellent, and far better than most would have expected.

What are the limitations you see that mean that he'll never be anything except average?

[ellis9]

I appreciate that's your opinion but good god it seems you've been hypnotised by the media into believing Sam Burgess is the answer! He really isn't! He will only ever be an average rugby union player and should in my opinion be no where near the England squad!

Quite a call that he will only ever be an average Union player, given how well he's played since being moved to blindside by Bath. He's been excellent, and far better than most would have expected.

What are the limitations you see that mean that he'll never be anything except average?

1. The fact that no one seems to know what position he is, including himself!

2. In any of the games I have seen him play, he hasn't stood out as a higher level player.

3. I can't see any potential that he will be an International level Union player.

What do you see in him that says he will become International level?

[mol2]

As a centre he has shown nothing to merit selection.

As a flanker a handful of games in a position that (aside from the front row) is as far away from League as it gets so to pick him would be ludicrous and unfair on him.
Is he really a better pick than Croft?

[Will S]

Sad to hear that Slater is likely to be dropped but with the lack of recent game time and quality in depth at lock I understand why.

Daly being dropped would be a real shame in my opinion. He is the only like for like back up we have for JJ. If anything happened to JJ and centres would be blunt. I would think Daly would be a very good bench option. He covers 13 and the back three, has the ability to change a game and brings with him a massive boot for long range shots at goal (if Ford is our starting 10 then a long range option would be very handy as he hasn't got the biggest of boots on him).

[SPIKE@srufc]

I'm hoping Sam Burgess is no where need the team.
Now, don't get me wrong as a league player he is outstanding. As a union player he has potential but only that at the minute. Bath it seems as well as England say they aren't sure where his best position is which sort of makes it easy, if you don't know where he is better than someone else don't play him.
There isn't another team out there as far as I know who would pick a player on potential for a RWC. This isn't a "journey" or a "pathway" or any of those media bits we are getting feed in the run up.
This is a World Cup on home soil and it should be a win at all costs approach to selection. If you're not the best English player in that position you shouldn't be on the pitch.
Just my opinion obviously, sure the RL types around will disagree

[baz1664]

Burgess, Ashton and Clark all survive the cut!!

[chipnchase]

Tough one this, can't remember the last time we had the level of strength in depth that we have now.

LH - M. Vunipola, Marler, Corbishero
HK - T. Youngs, Webber, Cowan-Dickie
TH - Cole, Wilson, Brookes
SR - Parling, Lawes (also cover 6), Launchbury, Kruis
FL - Robshaw, Wood (can also cover 8), Kvesic
8 - Morgan, B. Vunipola

SH - B. Youngs, Care
FH - Ford, Farrell (Also cover 12), Cipriani (Also cover fullback)

CE - Twelvetrees (can also cover flyhalf), Barrett, Jospeh, Eastmond (Also cover wing)

W- Nowell

FB - Brown (Also cover wing), Goode, Watson (Also cover wing)

Its really tough to pick just 31 in the modern game and shows how far we've moved in terms of players having to be more versatile and cover more than one position outside of the specialist front row, scrum half and fly half positions.

[chipnchase]

Burgess, Ashton and Clark all survive the cut!!

Sadly I think you may be right.

[Spicer]

Elliot Daly, Maro Itoje, Stephen Myler and Ed Slater are out.

[tigercaspian]

Bitterly disappointed that Daly not included : we will see more of Itoje I am sure: Myler, evens there for me: and as for Slater , well, very disappointed for him but at least England can't break and we can have him to ourselves.

[Sajerj]

Burgess has made very considerable progress, and Bath have always been clear they view him as a six, not a centre.

I think he started all the games during Baths run to the premiership final, which included some not inconsiderable victories, Tigers included. This was Baths first premiership final in more than 10 years, so to think they did it carrying a blindside flanker is a bit silly really. I thought he was one of Bath's best players in the final.

Do i think he should be picked for the squad ? On balance probably not. But it is poor not to recognise the considerable progress he has made in the game.

[ellis9]

Burgess has made very considerable progress, and Bath have always been clear they view him as a six, not a centre.

I think he started all the games during Baths run to the premiership final, which included some not inconsiderable victories, Tigers included. This was Baths first premiership final in more than 10 years, so to think they did it carrying a blindside flanker is a bit silly really. I thought he was one of Bath's best players in the final.

Do i think he should be picked for the squad ? On balance probably not. But it is poor not to recognise the considerable progress he has made in the game.

Wow, so he has made progress! He needed to make progress as he had gone from never playing Union to getting picked for Bath, so of course he was going to make progress. That said, he still isn't good enough to be picked by England!

We are not discussing the amount of progress he has made in the game. This topic is about what players should be in the England World Cup squad and he shouldn't be picked in it.

[Sajerj]

Yes, and if you read my comment more closely, i said that on balance i didn't believe he should be selected despite his progress to a decent union player.

But the six berth is wide open. Wood has lost form and Haskell doesn't cut it. I suspect that being in camp for a number of months Burgess will make significant progress and maybe far closer to selection than most may think now.

One other thing to consider is that he will stand out like a sore thumb with his personality and character in a squad that lacks leadership.

In 2007, a poor team reached the final through force of personality with the likes of Dallaglio, Corry, Shaw, Vickery, Wilkinson, Farrell, Regan. The 2011 squad was severely lacking in character.

[JackFlashJonny]

Would have preferred Itoje over Kruis I think young Mario is all class the way he played for Sarries at the end of the season was nothing short of monumental..

Hopefully he can still get back in if lady luck smiles at him

[ellis9]

I read your comment and saw that you said should "probably not" be picked. Take the word "probably" out and it is fine.

I wasn't commenting on that though. I was merely discussing the point you made where you said how much he has progressed, so I said that he hasn't progressed enough to be good enough to be picked for England. However much progression he has made, he still needs to progress a lot more before he can even be considered for selection.

You think Haskell doesn't cut it, which is fair enough but if Haskell isn't good enough then Burgess definitely isn't!